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  1. #121
    drssgchic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    What you're alluding to is fashion drilled into your head by the media. People 100,000 years ago weren't wearing corsets. None of this makes any sense.
    Ah, right, of course. Fashion never, ever emphesizes what's considered to be attractive. Totally.

    Would you be a dear and explain to me, then, the African cultures who's traditional dress includes rolls of fabric that emphisize the size of the women's hips and buttocks?
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  2. #122
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    So the next time some guy goes on and on about how he eats 80-85% primal and effortlessly dropped to 15% BF, and you're wondering why you're eating 95% and stuck at 25% BF ... well, you two are more different than you know. What works for one gender does NOT necessarily work for the other - - and can even be detrimental. How interesting.
    In defense of primal not being a miracle, my husband did not really drop any magical number of pounds by just eating Primal (with ~ 20% cheating) and moving slowly. He eats too much, and he will always eat too much, no matter what he eats & he will not train. But yeah, doing everything right, following every rule and being endlessly stuck at 'not fat' stage is not uncommon in women. genetics+ evolutionary make-up + lower tolerance for hunger = can't drop fat.

    With your 140 pounds, I had a few stuck points on CW, and yeah, it is rip through and suffer to hold kind of thing rather than 'just give it time' and 'relax' approach that worked for me.
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  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    The problem is that getting solid bit. It is just hellishly hard to look firm when fat coats up even larger muscles. The huge problem that women face trying to become fit is with being programmed to carry more fat, while the muscle are not growing as big as men's. Our 'good' fat % is in excess of 20%. A man at 20% looks pudgy even if he has huge upper body muscle. So does a woman, only she doesn't have the structure to pop out from under that fat showing her athleticism even if she lifts heavy. And the lower body is a nightmare. That's why the whole concept of 'toning up' is so laughable for women. It leads to the starvation in the attempts to remove the fat and get some firmness, while most muscle is lost in the process.

    If you have ever seen an advertisement for something like Insanity Workouts, you can see how men look great and muscular in their 'afters', and women look like dry fish. And those are most likely the fit individuals that were paid to go fat and then do workouts and get back into shape quick using the muscle memory.

    IF was supposed to provide a miracle cure for this phenomenon, but in my experience, it is, unfortunately, not effective.
    Men don't generally like defined women. Women look better at 20% bodyfat than 15% bodyfat. Your goal is 15% bodyfat IMO is not only unhealthy, but it looks bad. Men look A LOT BETTER lean than women do, and it's no accident than women need A LOT MORE body fat than men to be healthy. Women can stop menstruating as high as 17% body fat. 12% is when the female body starts dying.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leida View Post
    In defense of primal not being a miracle, my husband did not really drop any magical number of pounds by just eating Primal (with ~ 20% cheating) and moving slowly. He eats too much, and he will always eat too much, no matter what he eats & he will not train. But yeah, doing everything right, following every rule and being endlessly stuck at 'not fat' stage is not uncommon in women. genetics+ evolutionary make-up + lower tolerance for hunger = can't drop fat.

    With your 140 pounds, I had a few stuck points on CW, and yeah, it is rip through and suffer to hold kind of thing rather than 'just give it time' and 'relax' approach that worked for me.
    Oh yeah, definitely not saying it's EVERY guy out there who loses that much more quickly. But it might just be a lot of the more vocal ones on the forums.

    I always figured that I weighed 5-10 lbs more than I wanted because I wasn't willing to give up the occasional pizza, strudels in the office break room, etc. Then I switched to this nearly-100% clean diet and to my surprise, saw no change whatsoever. I readily admit that I haven't gone full-on crossfit with the exercising, because right now my priorities are just to eat clean and try to solve my persistent insomnia. Regardless of that though, this whole experience has given me a whole new perspective on being overweight. No longer do I believe that dropping the doughnuts & pizza for salmon & salad is going to get a woman down to 20% BF. It's more complicated than that and I do not believe we have all the answers yet.

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by drssgchic View Post
    Ah, right, of course. Fashion never, ever emphesizes what's considered to be attractive. Totally.

    Would you be a dear and explain to me, then, the African cultures who's traditional dress includes rolls of fabric that emphisize the size of the women's hips and buttocks?
    Have you ever actually watched a runway show? 95% of the stuff they wear is absolutely hideous, but it's very "fashionable." I don't care what women wear. I'm speaking about how people look naked - that look is much more instinctual.
    Don't put your trust in anyone on this forum, including me. You are the key to your own success.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    Have you ever actually watched a runway show? 95% of the stuff they wear is absolutely hideous, but it's very "fashionable." I don't care what women wear. I'm speaking about how people look naked - that look is much more instinctual.
    That's art draped around a very thin woman- I'm talking about fashion that's actually worn.

    You just said two posts up that women look better with fat. Maybe other people like women that are 25% rather than the 20% you like? Maybe? I'm well over 25% and there are men that find me attractive.
    http://cattaillady.com/ My blog exploring the beginning stages of learning how to homestead. With the occasional rant.

    Originally Posted by TheFastCat: Less is more more or less

    And now I have an Etsy store: CattailsandCalendula

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by RitaRose View Post
    So are you saying you DO walk 15-20 miles each day in direct sunlight in 45C weather... in London???

    I'm only making assumptions because what you're implying is ridiculous and you haven't stated otherwise.

    It's called "empathy", along with the knowledge that everyone's lives do not work the exact same way yours does. And no, I'm not lashing out in defense of my obesity. I'm only 15 pounds over my ideal weight right now.

    I just hate the whole "I can do it [at this one point in my life under my exact circumstances] so everyone else [under completely different circumstances] can too, and if you can't, you're just not trying hard enough" attitude.
    If you are only 15lbs over your ideal weight you are hardly obese in the way in which this discussion is slanted so please spare me the Self obsessed Opra BS its NOT always about you!

    I work long hours including a 3 hour commute in a highly stressful job as well as being a very hands on father. I am responsible for a multi million pound contract that affects thousands of people. So I have plenty of excuses to not EAT right or TRAIN right but I make time.

    I want to live to see my family grow up

    I get up at 5.30 am to train before anyone else in the house wakes up, I batch cook foods : sweet potato, chicken, meat etc so im good to go....BTW once somethings in the OVEN you DONT have to stand in front of it!

    If you walk 15~20 miles a day then do it quickly and eat right and the weight will fall off ! Oh yeah this ISNT ABOUT YOU!

    This is about grossly overweight people, who do fuck all to help themselves and shovel crap down their mouths and wouldnt dream of doing exercise, who then expect the world to pick up the tab healthwise and dump on us about how sad we should feel for them. My empathy goes out to those who live in environments where they can barely scrape enough to live on, not over privileged slobs in. western countries who eat their own body weight in food every day.

    For the record I find extremely thin people pretty disgusting to look at and often they have their own self inflicted health problems as well.

    My ideal female shape is the marilyn monroe look with curves in the Right places not the ultra skinny super model like a boy look which so many DELUDED WESTERN women aspire to.

  8. #128
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    Kim, I am with you. Just replacing the bad food with good food and having a champ exercise regimen is not going to make it! It takes either being young and childless (or genetically lucky) or the chronic shortage of food. If an average woman is full and not overeating, plus trains, she will end up in the 22-25% comfy zone and that set point will be held by the body no matter what you do, marathons, Olympic lifting or climbing Everest with no oxygen.

    Men don't generally like defined women. Women look better at 20% bodyfat than 15% bodyfat. Your goal is 15% bodyfat IMO is not only unhealthy, but it looks bad. Men look A LOT BETTER lean than women do, and it's no accident than women need A LOT MORE body fat than men to be healthy. Women can stop menstruating as high as 17% body fat. 12% is when the female body starts dying.
    I don't know what BF% I am, likely about 20% BF (who the heck knows, all the methods tell different, most of them giving me <20% number) but I lift, I eat healthy, I do HIT, and I do not look firm/muscular, even when I do have muscle now on the upper body. I still look soft and pudgy because of the fat on the thighs and the layer of fat around the waist. I don't think any man will honestly look at my figure and go: Whoa! HOT!" . I have my husband, so what other men think is irrelevant, but it is still far from what I want to see in the mirror. I want the muscle to show and no dribble, and no fat filling up the sit like dough in a plastic bag when I sit down on a char. I have a gut feeling that it comes with below 20% BF only if the fat distribution is localized.

    My ideal female shape is the marilyn monroe look with curves in the Right places not the ultra skinny super model like a boy look which so many DELUDED WESTERN women aspire to.
    Merlyn Monroe's waistline was 22-23", she was comparable to the modern models in her built in Size 0-2 (READY TO WEAR! NOT PATTERN that is often quoted), but shorter. I walk, train, eat right, take care of my family, work and has been forever and ever, and my waist is still 26", and not budging.
    Last edited by Leida; 06-15-2012 at 08:35 AM.
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  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by spacey47 View Post
    No it's because they are fucking lazy and can't be bothered to prepare cheap healthy food.

    They load up on pizza and ready meals and take aways and ice cream which is more expensive than lots of healthy alternatives over here.

    Food like kale, sweet potatoes, bananas, liver, greens, eggs, Turkey etc are v cheap in comparison but hey they might need washing or peeling or chopping or cracking or steaming or roasting etc

    Can't be bothered to do that mate I am busy, sitting on my arse watching 'pop idol' on TV.

    What go to that place with grass and trees for a walk.....the PARK with it's FREE exercise machines no way I'm too busy playing Xbox

    Funny even though I'm skint I have enough money for cigarettes and booze !

    Oh dear apparently now I'm not that well have to go to the doctors all the time, can't work, feel depressed and bad about myself

    I WONDER WHY?

    There is not a single person of the half million that visit this site each month that meet what you are describing. I doubt very few that read teh "offending" article meet your description. I work for a large urban school district in what is commonly referred to a "food dessert" area. There are many parts of my town that you have to travel more than 5 miles to get fresh food that you describe. You are obviously very ignorant of the state of many parts of the world if you think that everyone has access to both the food, and the knowledge needed to prepare it. I witness kids who think the only vegetable is a carrot. I have witnessed children who didn't realise fries were made from potatoes. I'm not saying that there isn't some lack of effort here, but young children that lack role models are not to blame.

    Yes, once they are adults, there is a certain level of responsibility, and I agree that there are many people that just need to make small steps and stop being ignorant of good health (rarely are they "lazy", you are just being an idiot with throwing that out). Unfortunately, they have huge hurdles to get through first. One being self esteem issues.

    Again, those that read these blogs are not like the few people you seem inflammed about. You may want to take your trolling elsewhere.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
    Have you ever actually watched a runway show? 95% of the stuff they wear is absolutely hideous, but it's very "fashionable." I don't care what women wear. I'm speaking about how people look naked - that look is much more instinctual.
    A lot of the clothes are OK but larger people shouldn't focus on or blame the fashion industry but should focus on implementing real information to get to their set point. There is more to life than just weight.

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