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    otzi's Avatar
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    Cold Water for Fat Loss, Muscle Recovery, and Increased Metabolism Thread

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    Howdy All! Mark has been writing a lot lately about using cold water for numerous primal benefits such as fat loss, exercise recovery, and increasing metabolism through brown adipose tissue (BAT).

    Here are some links to Mark's previous blogs on the topics:

    Cold Water Therapy | Mark's Daily Apple

    How to Conduct a Personal Experiment: Cold Water Plunges | Mark's Daily Apple

    Dear Mark: Leptin Resets, Cold Thermogenesis, and Safe Starches? | Mark's Daily Apple

    Is Brown Fat Good For You? | Mark's Daily Apple

    There are other 'guru's' touting the benefits of cold water, let's leave them out of this and focus on tearing into what Mark Sisson is finding. His latest challenge on self-experimentation is a great place to start this thread, maybe his next book will use our data!

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    There's already this thread. I thought you had posted in it.

    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread50560.html
    You lousy kids! Get off my savannah!

  3. #3
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    Anyhow, I have been a fan of the cold for years. I live in Fairbanks, Alaska, one of the coldest cities in the world. I have incorporated cold into my workouts and life. I retired from the Air Force in 2004 a little on the heavy side, but over the next few years I ballooned out of control. I was a 42 year old guy, 5'11, 250lbs, on all kinds of medicine for full-blown metabolic syndrome type stuff (high bp, high chol, gout, hypothyroid, sleep apnea, fatty liver disease, etc...) Fast forward to 2010, I discovered Mark's daily Apple and started eating and exercising according to the blueprint and have lost nearly 100lbs and weigh 165.

    Last Winter, I was at that dreaded 'last 10 lbs' phase. Carb cycling, IF'ing, sprinting, LHT, all that couldn't bust it. I turned down the heat in my garage where I exercise to 40 degrees, abandoned my winter clothing for any outdoor activities just short of frostbite and hypothermia, began taking cold plunges in water from 32 - 80 degrees. I studied all I could on the physiology of cold adaptation. I went from 177 in January to 165 now. I lost almost all traces of belly fat and increased gains on lifting.

    I'd love to share what I learned with you guys. As Mark says--there is merit to cold water therapy.
    Last edited by otzi; 06-05-2012 at 09:31 AM.

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    gopintos is offline Senior Member
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    I am glad to see Mark's views all in one place with a link. Thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    Howdy All! Mark has been writing a lot lately about using cold water for numerous primal benefits such as fat loss, exercise recovery, and increasing metabolism through brown adipose tissue (BAT).

    Here are some links to Mark's previous blogs on the topics:

    Cold Water Therapy | Mark's Daily Apple

    How to Conduct a Personal Experiment: Cold Water Plunges | Mark's Daily Apple

    Dear Mark: Leptin Resets, Cold Thermogenesis, and Safe Starches? | Mark's Daily Apple

    Is Brown Fat Good For You? | Mark's Daily Apple

    There are other 'guru's' touting the benefits of cold water, let's leave them out of this and focus on tearing into what Mark Sisson is finding. His latest challenge on self-experimentation is a great place to start this thread, maybe his next book will use our data!
    wait, dude - are you starting another cold water will save us all thread?

  6. #6
    otzi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakey View Post
    wait, dude - are you starting another cold water will save us all thread?
    I wanted to let that other thread die. You guys ruined it by dissing the cold so bad. There are people genuinely interested in using cold for health benefits, like, oh, Mark Sisson. Mark did another 'cold will save us all' blog just today.

    People have been asking a lot lately about how to get started with cold baths. One of the first steps is getting used to the cold water. This can be done by activating your built-in 'mammalian dive reflex'. When you put your face in water colder than 55 degrees, your brain thinks you fell in the water and does some miraculous things. It slows your heart rate, constricts peripheral blood vessels, and changes the way your lungs exchange oxygen.

    Doing this a few times will acclimate your body to the changes that happen when you get cold. You should try doing this a few times before your first cold water experience. Just fill a sink with cold water and ice cubes, put your face in and hold your breath. When you can't hold any longer--you are done (30-60 seconds). Do it a few times the day before your first cold water bath and you will be good to go.

    If you don't believe me, check Google or Mammalian diving reflex - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia If you have done it, tell us about it!

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    He stated why - this one is to get the focus off of the personal controversies of other "gurus" and focus on what Mark (since this is his daily apple) has posted and the personal experiences of the people already on this forum.

    My temp has gone from 96.0-97.0 across a cycle to 97.0-98.4 across a cycle, and energy has steadily increased (after 6 years of CFS) since day 1 of cold baths. After a few weeks, I needed to decrease my thyroid supplement b/c I started getting hyperthyroid signs. All of these point to CT improving my thyroid function.

    My cold tolerance has dramatically increased from needing a wool coat at 40F to enjoying 27F in a lightweight shirt & pants with no coat for half an hour. (Otzi's is way more dramatic, working out in -10F in shorts & a tee!) Also, from shivering heavily in 70F baths & unable to tolerate a single ripple to shiver-free swims in a 50F swiftly moving river for half an hour.

    Spot-icing my belly has most definitely reduced belly fat. It began within a few days of starting, and stopped when I stopped icing a few weeks later.

    All this after going primal for two years. At the time I started CT'ing, I made no other dietary changes.
    5'4" 36yo mother to five sweeties & married to their AMAZING DaddyGrok
    Starting: 185 lbs (March '10)
    Current: 132.5 lbs
    Goal: 135 lbs (Hit Jan '13)
    Beating bingeing since 10/31/11 on my Leptin Reset journey

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    I'm about 1.5 weeks in (cold showers, ice packs/spot icing, and ice baths for bottom half of my body). Since day 1 of cold showers, I stopped losing hair by the handful. My abdomen is less bloated, and my skin is looking great. Even though I'm not cold-adapted yet, I don't fear the cold anymore - which for me, is huge. I'm excited to see what the next weeks/months will bring by continuing CT.

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    I have started taking cold showers over the past month, and my god have they done wonders to this bod.

    Being in my late twenties and having been athletic forever, life events raised stress levels along with weight.

    MDA and PB have done wonders for me over the past 3 months.

    Cold showers have literally killed my stress levels (road rage, work) and has lowered my blood pressure ( refuse medication).

    Need to read up now on the abdominal cold packs.

    ^^^ buffalo is prime country for cold! Lived there from 06-09 during my college days.

  10. #10
    otzi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitro3 View Post
    I have started taking cold showers over the past month, and my god have they done wonders to this bod.

    Need to read up now on the abdominal cold packs.
    Look up a process known as Zeltiq. Sometimes it goes by CoolSculpting. It is a process invented by Harvard scientists and sold to a private firm. The principal is that fat cells get cooled to around 35 degrees, they commit suicide (apoptosis). This is at a temperature above what would cause skin and tissue damage. Ice packs held over areas of stubborn fat will cause the fat cells to die and the body will absorb them over time. It doesn't happen over night, but do a daily ice pack treatment for a week or two a then wait 4-6 weeks before re-icing the area. I have used this method and it worked for me. i used a gallon size ziplock bag filled 1/2 with crushed ice cubes and water. This will get your skin temp down to the required temp for lipoloysis.

    From Wikipedia: Cryolipolysis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Method of action and animal studies
    Lipolysis procedures attempt to "dissolve" fat cells by nonsurgical means. A number of methods have been attempted, including the use of laser, ultrasound, and rf current.[4] Popsicle panniculitis is a dermatologic condition that shows that exposure to low temperatures can selectively damage subcutaneous fat while leaving skin intact.[5] Based on this premise, fat cells are more easily damaged by cooling than skin cells, cryolipolysis was developed applying low temperatures to tissue via thermal conduction. In order to avoid frostbite, a specific temperature level and exposure is determined. Drs. Dieter Manstein and R. Rox Anderson at The Wellman Center at Massachusetts General Hospital originated the concept, explored it in a number of experiments on pigs and reported their data in 2008. [4][6] While the process is not fully understood, it appear that fatty tissue that is cooled below body temperature but above freezing undergoes localized cell death followed by a local inflammatory response, a local panniculitis,[4] that gradually over the course of several months results in a reduction of the fatty tissue layer.[7]

    [edit] Experience in humans
    The first human study appeared in 2009 when Coleman et al. reported results after cryolipolysis had been applied to love handles in a single session to ten patients, each patient being their own control. A session takes less than an hour and does not require anesthesia. With a single treatment subjects had a 20 % reduction after two months and 25 % reduction at six months in the fat layer as assessed by ultrasound.[7] The lipolytic effect of treatment takes place within about two to four months.[5] It appears primarily applicable for limited discrete fat bulges.[8] With the small number of patients treated clinical data remain scarce, thus it is not known how long the treatment effect will last, or when and if later treatments would be necessary to maintain the result.
    Last edited by otzi; 06-05-2012 at 10:58 AM.

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