Caffeine? page 3

[Dave RN]

I do have epilepsy, since the age of 15, when not so coincidentally I had an MMR booster. First seizure not too long after that.

I take Depakote, 750 a day (5-6 years ago I was on 125 a day). At least it's supposed to be 750. I've cut back to a 250mg in the AM and 250 in the PM. I figured with paleo, Imay be able to cut back or ditch the med. Been on just 500 a day for a couple of months now and everything is going great. I'm taking it slow because I know how Depakote, especially long term depakote (since age 17 for me) can be. Gotta be real careful. I'm ketogenic half the time so that helps.

My neurologist approves. She said it was up to me. She has success stories and horror stories... And I don't want to be on that crap the rest of my life. I have however been one of the fortunate ones that had no observable side effects from the Depakote.

Meanwhile, I do drink coffee once or twice each day. No problems. And too many studies in favor of coffee drinking...

[Paleobird]

Funny. My neuro said that it's fine to drink coffee so long as it's the only caffeinated thing that I consume and that I ensure that I am getting adequate sleep. I don't need it (no addiction issue) but I do enjoy the taste of it. I can easily go days without it (which I've done in the past), but I drink it usually during my IF and/or on my walks to work/dog park. I like the taste of good quality coffee just as much as I do good quality dry red wine.

I think if you are genuinely using it on this low level, it;'s probably not a problem. When I started having seizures I was a senior in college and was mainlining the caffeine and chocolate bars to study all nighters.

It is very easy however to go from just a cup now and then for the taste to physical addiction. This happened to me last year when I was on jury duty for a week. I started having a cup when we had our break just cuz it smelled good and I was bored. By that Saturday after only five days of coffee, I went on a hike that I would not consider all that hard normally. But that day every single muscle in my body was screaming out in pain wanting another fix.

I agree with codered5 above that, for being as all natural and health fixated as we are, the PB community does turn a blind eye to an addictive substance that does rule a lot of people's lives. I know some people can drink it now and then or walk away from it but then there are those who would growl at you if you inadvertently got between them and the coffee machine in the morning.

[girlhk]

I used to drink maybe 5 cups of coffee daily for years just to stay functional. Then I went caffeine-free in our efforts to conceive a baby. Caffeine withdrawal was so bad I swore I would never go back. But I like the smell and taste of coffee, and sometimes just can't resist a cup. Too much caffeine gives me headaches though. Nowadays, I drink a cup of decaf coffee or regular red tea, just because I enjoy my day more. I know it's not optimal for health but oh well.

[fuzzylogic]

I work nights, coffee doesn't affect my sleep---can drink 4 cups or a rockstar and go to sleep without difficulty. That said, I think I'm self-medicating for ADD---I concentrate better and function better on a fairly minimal amount of caffiene.

And yes, Rockstar is not primal but it is a lifesaver...both mine and probably someone else's

[CaveWeirdo]

I heard that caffeine is the hardest drug to quit, and I can believe it. I tried it once, and found I was feeling depressed and sleeping for 16 hours a day for about a week. My other half found me in bed in the afternoon and we ended up having a blazing row about it, which is very unlike us, we usually hardly ever argue. So for the sake of my relationship, and to keep depression at bay, I am not going to try that again.

I also read that some people have withdrawal symptoms for up to 2 weeks. Add to that the fact that you have to do it all again after slipping up and having a bit too much chocolate one day... arse to that! I know it's technically a toxic bean but arse to that!

I don't think it's just me being weak either. I've given up all sorts of foods to solve my allergies, without any difficulty, even cider which used to be my favourite thing. I have cut down a lot on cola and coffee, but I don't think I could quit it completely.

I think cutting down to just 2 or 3 cups in the morning and sticking to tea in the evenings is doable and will make you feel better.

[Periwinkle]

I went 2.5 weeks without caffeine and felt like I got run over by a truck the whole time. I never had any energy. But I am also a single mom to two kids under 5 who dont sleep the whole night. I started drinking coffee again yesterday...I feel much better. Someday, when they sleep all night, I'll give it another try. If I actually knew that my adrenals were fried instead of just suspecting that they are, I might try harder. I plan to drink 2 cups of coffee with raw cream in the mornings. I dont drink anything else with significant caffeine.
Good Luck!

[Paleobird]

Law #2 of the Primal Blueprint is "Avoid Poisonous Things". Everyone who drinks coffee loves to point and say, "But Mark drinks coffee. It must be Primal." Mark specifically says in a big fat caveat that everyone likes to ignore however, that coffee is fine In Moderation and "As long as it is NOT used as an energy crutch".

If you could honestly say that you only drink coffee because you "love the taste" and are not using it to get your rear in gear in the morning, then I would say, cool, enjoy your joe. But I really don't think that's the case with most people. People, for example kiwigal above, are addicted to a substance. It rules their world.

How do we, the all natural, never take an aspirin or antibiotic or use soap on our Primal skins crowd, let something gets its hooks so firmly into us?

Once you have discovered real natural energy, being able to jump out of bed ready to kill a bison if you needed to, you will never go back to chemically assisted energy again. It's a pale substitute that keeps you from finding your real energy if overused.

[solstice]

I was recently addicted again...to caffeine. I am off of it now for almost a month and feel great! However...the first week or so was a bit hellish...exhaustion and headaches were common. Stay the course!

[Annlee]

I have been unable to drink coffee in moderation - for years. I drank a pot a day, possibly a little more. I gave it up for 3 months (took some getting used to) and a doc advised me to drink it for a medical problem I had (I didn't think it was related - still don't). Within a couple of weeks I was right back to a pot a day, drinking it (and nuking cooled off cups to reheat) all day. Combined with ratcheting stress from my job, I had to drop it.

This time, it was harder. Not the headache (about the same) - but simply the addiction to drinking hot coffee. Now I'm used to water, and I do consume some herbal teas (no caffeine). But the psychological crutch of my coffee was powerful and has been very hard to overcome.

Given my stress level, without coffee I am sleeping better. I never noticed it keeping me awake, so I suspect without proof that it was simply the extra load I could no longer tolerate.

Obviously, not everyone is like that. But I think perhaps more of us are than realize it.

[cori93437]

I heard that caffeine is the hardest drug to quit, and I can believe it. I tried it once, and found I was feeling depressed and sleeping for 16 hours a day for about a week. My other half found me in bed in the afternoon and we ended up having a blazing row about it, which is very unlike us, we usually hardly ever argue. So for the sake of my relationship, and to keep depression at bay, I am not going to try that again.

I also read that some people have withdrawal symptoms for up to 2 weeks. Add to that the fact that you have to do it all again after slipping up and having a bit too much chocolate one day... arse to that! I know it's technically a toxic bean but arse to that!

I don't think it's just me being weak either. I've given up all sorts of foods to solve my allergies, without any difficulty, even cider which used to be my favourite thing. I have cut down a lot on cola and coffee, but I don't think I could quit it completely.

I think cutting down to just 2 or 3 cups in the morning and sticking to tea in the evenings is doable and will make you feel better.

No...
No, not even close!

Do a little research on opiate addiction and withdrawal.

Or how about Meth addiction and withdrawal... which is probably the worst at this point for long term brain chemistry effects from the studies.

I hate how people throw around the "caffeine" or "cigarettes" is so hard, or "just as hard as insert other MAJOR drug here.
NO, no they are not.

As a late teen I drank an entire pot of coffee by myself every morning between getting ready for school and the ride there.
Yep... ouch.
That's a lot of coffee... and it wired me up good.
I did that for a a couple of years.
Then I quit.
It sucked. I had headaches...
But it wasn't the end of the world.

I also smoked briefly as a young person...
And was most certainly addicted to cigarettes.
They were harder to quit than caffeine by miles!
There were stops, and starts, and stops.
It was very physical/psychological.
Places/people/activities that were associated with cigarettes made me want to smoke badly!
But still... not all that hard comparatively...


Compared to what you say?
Compared to opiates.
I was physically addicted to morphine because of spending about 2 years on it at a pretty high dose when the VA wouldn't do a surgery to fix a problem with a pain management Spinal Cord Stimulator applinace I have at one point.
They decided to medicate me instead...
For two freaking years... during which I fought to get them to do the surgery because I dislike pain meds.

Once I got the surgery I needed to quit the morphine.
And I had to do it slowly... I was warned that quitting all at once could actually cause me to be so sick I could need to be hospitalized.
So I had to step down gradually 15mg at a time.
Every reduction of 15 mg was like giving yourself the worst Flu you can imagine...
Cold sweats, stomach cramps, shaking, whole body quaking almost convulsions, vomiting, etc...
For an entire week...
Then I'd have a week to recover a little.
Then I got to reduce by 15mg again.
And again, and again... and again... etc

Then, about 6 MONTHS later... I suddenly realized one day that it was like a cloud, a FOG, had suddenly lifted off from around my head.
I was like I could suddenly think again.
It was like waking up... and you didn't even realize you had been asleep.

And from what I understand from the research the chemical changes that Meth induces in the brain makes it even WORSE to recover from.


No... caffeine is NOT the hardest.
Not by MILES

I drink one cup of coffee per day about 5 days per week...
Sometimes less during cool months if I'm enjoying herbal tea.