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  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by quelsen View Post
    you didnt say if it is up or down but remember gretch that the first 3 days for me were normal and then i hit the wall bad. anything that required testosterone was DOA for a week.

    after clearing the estrogen flood i am back to two or three a days.

    gotta clear the pipes no matter your gender
    Kinda a decrease... from the more recent pattern... hit about a week ago - just kinda staying blah... I figure its part of the detox process... I guess i really need to see how it goes w/the rest of this cycle and into the next.... I Know w/in the 1st 2 wks my hormones were all over the place... right now they're just blah.... but I am HOTTER temp wise now... I'm in a take top/shorts most of the time now at home... I'm finding I'm craving to work out right after my CT spot session mid morning... got to continue dialing in the diet, as well as dial in the parasite/yeast eradication....
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  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    I have the same memories of swimming in 'freezing' pond water as a kid in Ohio. As to the face plunges, I don't know that you need to overthink it. It is just meant as an adaptive step to prepare you for full-on cold baths. It activates the 'mammalian dive reflex' which preps your body for what is about to come. It constricts vessels and redirects blood flow among other things. According to this study, 12-40 seconds is enough. Please read more here: The human dive reflex: An experimental, topographical and physiological analysis 10.1016/0031-9384(86)90018-1 : Physiology & Behavior | ScienceDirect.com
    Thanks very much, Otzi!
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  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    Neither is Ray Cronise or Wim Hof. But their thoughts on CT only add to the Paleo/Primal experience!
    I just don't think calling it paleo is appropriate.

    I could supplement with testosterone and it would make me achieve my goals faster with minimal risk. That doesn't make it paleo.

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apex Predator View Post
    I just don't think calling it paleo is appropriate.

    I could supplement with testosterone and it would make me achieve my goals faster with minimal risk. That doesn't make it paleo.
    It seems to me that CT is uber-paleo! What could be more primal than exposing your body to cold winter temperatures as we evolved in? Even dessert dwellers had to cope with cold nights. With our heated cars, warm clothes, temperature controlled house and workplace, we never experience what the uncoupling proteins and brown fat can do for us. This takes paleo to a new level if you ask me. Please read through this study and tell me what you think. It's an eye-opener! http://journals.cambridge.org/downlo...3d4e84592ebdd3

  5. #75
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    Here is another recent study on Brown Fat (BAT). study
    They used 16 deg C (around 60 degrees F) air temp to activate the BAT, so if you are against ice-cube baths, there may be hope for you!

    Methods
    We studied 24 healthy men — 10 who were lean (body-mass index [BMI] [the weight in kilograms divided by the square of the height in meters], <25) and 14 who were overweight or obese (BMI, ≥25) — under thermoneutral conditions (22C) and during mild cold exposure (16C). Putative brown-adipose-tissue activity was determined with the use of integrated 18F-fluorodeoxyglucose positron-emission tomography and computed tomography. Body composition and energy expenditure were measured with the use of dual-energy x-ray absorptiometry and indirect calorimetry.

    Full Text of Methods...

    Results
    Brown-adipose-tissue activity was observed in 23 of the 24 subjects (96%) during cold exposure but not under thermoneutral conditions. The activity was significantly lower in the overweight or obese subjects than in the lean subjects (P=0.007). BMI and percentage of body fat both had significant negative correlations with brown adipose tissue, whereas resting metabolic rate had a significant positive correlation.

    Full Text of Results...

    Conclusions
    The percentage of young men with brown adipose tissue is high, but its activity is reduced in men who are overweight or obese. Brown adipose tissue may be metabolically important in men, and the fact that it is reduced yet present in most overweight or obese subjects may make it a target for the treatment of obesity.

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    I'd be leery of jumping right in if you have a compromised metabolism (lupus). Maybe if you get your diet right and lupus under control it would be an option.
    I have a compromised metabolism/autoimmune disease (Hashimoto's) and am finding it very beneficial It reduces inflammation big-time!

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by otzi View Post
    It seems to me that CT is uber-paleo! What could be more primal than exposing your body to cold winter temperatures as we evolved in? Even dessert dwellers had to cope with cold nights. With our heated cars, warm clothes, temperature controlled house and workplace, we never experience what the uncoupling proteins and brown fat can do for us. This takes paleo to a new level if you ask me. Please read through this study and tell me what you think. It's an eye-opener! http://journals.cambridge.org/downlo...3d4e84592ebdd3
    My issue isn't with CT, it's the Hcg, antibiotics, and God only knows what Kruse comes up with next.

    CT is pretty paleo.

    Messiahs and drugs, not so much.

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apex Predator View Post
    Just saw your sig. Regardless of whether it works or not, Kruse is not paleo. He is textbook transhumanism. It's not a value judgement, it's just a matter of accuracy.
    He doesn't even claim to be Paleo at this point. He would agree with your point completely

    Here's the thing: his writing can be difficult to decipher and grammar is NOT his forte, but those of us who interact with him on a regular basis here and on Facebook have gotten a lot more clarification on his views.
    Yes, he's in your face, but he also encourages lab testing and experimentation. So, you can pretty much assume that you only have a faint surface understanding of his concepts unless you've really had some back and forth with the guy!

    I see so many people criticizing (which is fine) and making assumptions based on outright misunderstanding/ignorance of his actual views (which is not fine). Case in point: I see people in the blogosphere calling him "very low carb" which is very inaccurate since he himself eats up to 300 gms of carbs around the Summer Solstice. They haven't bothered to ask him. Or, they take the Leptin Rx and assume it's a permanent way of eating.

    His recent interview w/ Sean Croxton last week is a lot easier to understand than his writing is and he comes across a lot more gentle and laid-back than in his writing style (here it is if anyone wants to listen: Cold Thermogenesis with Dr. Jack Kruse 03/08 by Underground Wellness | Blog Talk Radio).

  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apex Predator View Post
    My issue isn't with CT, it's the Hcg, antibiotics, and God only knows what Kruse comes up with next.

    CT is pretty paleo.

    Messiahs and drugs, not so much.
    LOL! If you'd read his recent stuff, you'd already know that there's no need for HCG w/ CT. Tsk, tsk. You sort of proved my point!

    PS- those of us that "follow" him question him to no end. We drive him nuts with it. We experiment. There are a couple of points that I don't totally agree with him on. I don't just blindly believe everything he's saying. I do my outside research.

    I see my fellow CT crazies as being a lot less brainwashed than, say, Matt Stone's followers, stuffing their faces with sugar and grains in order to "heal their metabolisms". To me that's so much more risky/dangerous than some old fashioned cold water, a few ice packs and traditional seasonal dietary cycling... this has a foundation in both history and science (and common sense!) It's truly not as complicated and high-tech as you seem to think it is.

  10. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by hazyjane View Post
    He doesn't even claim to be Paleo at this point. He would agree with your point completely

    Here's the thing: his writing can be difficult to decipher and grammar is NOT his forte, but those of us who interact with him on a regular basis here and on Facebook have gotten a lot more clarification on his views.
    Yes, he's in your face, but he also encourages lab testing and experimentation. So, you can pretty much assume that you only have a faint surface understanding of his concepts unless you've really had some back and forth with the guy!

    I see so many people criticizing (which is fine) and making assumptions based on outright misunderstanding/ignorance of his actual views (which is not fine). Case in point: I see people in the blogosphere calling him "very low carb" which is very inaccurate since he himself eats up to 300 gms of carbs around the Summer Solstice. They haven't bothered to ask him. Or, they take the Leptin Rx and assume it's a permanent way of eating.

    His recent interview w/ Sean Croxton last week is a lot easier to understand than his writing is and he comes across a lot more gentle and laid-back than in his writing style (here it is if anyone wants to listen: Cold Thermogenesis with Dr. Jack Kruse 03/08 by Underground Wellness | Blog Talk Radio).
    It also wasn't Kruse I was criticizing, it was Quelson(who's posts I generally like) for referring to Kruse as Paleo 3.1

    As I mentioned early, he is much more intelligible offline.

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