Cold Thermogenesis Guidelines/Results page 66

[Paleobird]

But you are not just skeptical. You are condescending to others who have found success with it. You used to be so much fun here. What happened?

I'm not posting for your amusement. Sorry to disappoint. I came on this thread honestly seeking information and wanting to find the truth, and actually hoping that CT really works. But all I found were a few anecdotes with confounding variables and, "Do it because Ray and Jack said so".

And I also found a lot of really creepy adrenaline/pain junkie sounding Kool aid drinking behavior. (This is only in reference to the folks who say they just can't wait for their next full body ice bath. OOOOh yeah, ice baths. WTF is wrong with this picture?????)

I actually think there may be some merit to cold exposure on the level that Mark was talking about and possibly the spot CTing too, but full immersion in ice water to a normal human being is PAINFUL. It's meant to be painful. It's natures's way of telling you not to do that.

Rational thought has left the building.

[Paleobirdy]

I think there is great merit to what you are doing. Any temp below thermoneutral causes the body to ramp up heat production and increase calorie burn. Probably not a whole lot calorie wise, but if it's also increasing BAT stores it will eventually add up.

My initial reason for going to extreme cold temps was that I live in Alaska near the arctic circle and run a river boat whenever the rivers are ice-free. I was raised on stories that you can't survive more than a few minutes in our cold waters and saw first-hand many people drown and die of hypothermia.

I now know that with proper adaptation one can acclimate themselves to cold temperatures. The main reason for the drownings isn't the cold, it's the shock and panic. I have spent 45 minutes in water that is said to kill in 15! If my boat capsizes, I feel confident I could survive the coldest waters we have.

As to the health benefits of cold, I think antiinflammation is best with the coldest water possible, but it isn't needed for cold thermogenesis to occur and impart it's BAT and UCP actions.

Good luck and let us know how it works for you!

I am not doing deep ct by any means, but my long-term goal is to live completely without the need for artificial heating and cooling. This winter I relied on gas heating in the winter, and I still rely on my fridge for my food, and my freezer for the few ice packs I add to the cold tub. But, our gas bill has decreased considerably since we started taking cold showers. Today we are having June gloom, and it is amazing how many people are outside bundled up in sweaters and hats because it got down to what, 65 degrees? We are breaking free from the tyranny of cold and our reliance on fuel for climate control.

[Paleobirdy]

The last paragraph of that article says a lot: "As for deliberately making yourself cold if you want to lose weight, Dr. Carpentier said, “there is still a lot of research to do before this strategy can be exploited clinically and safely.”

Trust me, this works as a weight loss tool, problem is, no one can figure out how to get rich off it. The liability would be huge if someone came out and recommended doing what I'm doing with extreme cold or even mild cold; if people started dropping dead of hypothermia or getting frost bite there'd be huge repercussions.

I have a feeling this 'cold' movement will snowball in the next few years. People will be selling all kinds of 'safe' methods to get cold. Pills will be developed. Supplements will be touted as the best for BAT development.

The other day, on my country radio station, they gave a teaser: "Lose weight this summer taking a cold bath, stay tuned to learn how!" I wasn't able to stay tuned, so don't know what they said, but I'll bet it wasn't free.

cold is the new black

[gopintos]

I just had bath #3. I can say with all certainty, that I do not look forward to it Perhaps when I start to see some benefit, I will but I would much rather it be a nice hot bath.

Anyways, some weird things happened. My reading material wasnt panning out, I opted for something other than PB-21, so I ended up not as reclined as usual. It was about 1 - 1.5 hours after dinner, about when my internal furnace fires up, so the part in the water was cold, not shivering but I could see goosebumps, and the part that was out was starting to get hot to the point of barely breaking a sweat. Weird, huh? So I was goosebumps and sweating at the same time basically.

I can also see how ppl drown in cold waters. I was trying to wiggle lower, and the thingy I was using to recline against, slipped down causing me to slip down suddenly. Man oh man was it cold. So I gasped a big ole gasp of air. Had that been a frozen lake I fell into, my lungs would have filled with water and I would have surely drown.

Okay, so I was trying to wiggle lower because I had read this afternoon, most of the BAT is in our backs, between our shoulder blades? So that needs to be cold also right? I also read about bitter melon extract, but now I don't really remember why or what it's purpose is in all this, but pretty sure it was in regards to CT.

I did time it this time, and I just wasnt feeling it this evening, so I thought I was getting out way early but still was in there for 35 minutes. So maybe I have been staying longer than I thought. Also, I still only use tap, after first warming up to the idea in nice toasty water. As I was sitting there thinking about the post of using a turkey thermometer and wondering wth that is, and what would I use to check a turkey, then I remembered my meat thermometer. So after I got out, I checked my water and it settled on 66.2. Man, it sure seemed colder. Did I also read somewhere that the skin needs to get to 50 - 55 or something?

Last night, I had trouble getting warmed up. Tonight, I am already starting to get too hot but it is temporary. Already getting somewhat cold again.

[MamaGrok]

maybe MamaGrok or Otzi can chime in here about a realistic timeline. I think Otzie mentioned it took about 8 weeks to notice a decrease in waist size, right?

I lost belly fat right away.

And I also found a lot of really creepy adrenaline/pain junkie sounding Kool aid drinking behavior. (This is only in reference to the folks who say they just can't wait for their next full body ice bath. OOOOh yeah, ice baths. WTF is wrong with this picture?????)

Did you miss the part where one of those Koolaid drinkers regularly drives boats through near-frozen waters, and this creepy stuff might just save his life some day, or that of someone rescued by him?

I thought of that, too, while enjoying my refreshing, delightful, completely pain-free 50F bath in the Chattahoochee on Sunday. The local Fire & Rescue team pulled up (complete with TV news crew, I know not why?) for training, and the rescuers were in wet suits. How much better could rescues be if the rescuers themselves weren't just as endangered as the rescuees from the cold?

This is imminently practical

And you may not believe it, but it's your words against ours (and especially those doing the super cold) - it. is. not. painful. once you get used to it. I'm not even numb. It's just not painful. It's invigorating.

(Again, I can't speak for 33F CT; haven't BTDT.)

[Paleobird]

Did you miss the part where one of those Koolaid drinkers regularly drives boats through near-frozen waters, and this creepy stuff might just save his life some day, or that of someone rescued by him?

I thought of that, too, while enjoying my refreshing, delightful, completely pain-free 50F bath in the Chattahoochee on Sunday. The local Fire & Rescue team pulled up (complete with TV news crew, I know not why?) for training, and the rescuers were in wet suits. How much better could rescues be if the rescuers themselves weren't just as endangered as the rescuees from the cold?

And you may not believe it, but it's your words against ours (and especially those doing the super cold) - it. is. not. painful. once you get used to it. I'm not even numb. It's just not painful. It's invigorating.


Again, I can't speak for 33F CT; haven't BTDT.)(

I grew up surfing in the very chilly Pacific waves, about the same temp as your Chattahoochie. Sure that is invigorating once you get over the first gasp and yes, you do get acclimated to it over time. I know that is not painful. I didn't say it was. I think what you are doing is very sensible. Outdoor exercise in cold water gives you double bang for your buck as far as weight loss goes because it it exercise plus trying to keep warm.

The pain/adrenaline junkie comment was specifically in reference to the full immersion ice baths which you are not doing like the sane person that I know you to be.

If someone can by repeated exposure to extreme cold (the ice bath kind) turn himself into a cold proof superhuman, that might come in handy if you live in a really cold place such as he does. But by extreme cardio, one can turn into an ultra marathon runner too and be capable of amazing things. I think the two are similar in that extreme stress to the body on a regular basis ceases to be a beneficial stress and just devolves into jacked up cortisol and adrenal fatigue.

There is a fine line between overcoming pain and getting off on the pain. *Some* people on this thread sound like they have gone over that line. Way over.

[Rearden]

After a cold shower attempt a few months ago at this thread's inception, I gave up for a while because the shower didn't go very well. (gasping for air, *really* unpleasant) Reading everyone's experiences as well as the perception that a cold bath is heaps better than the shower impressed me enough to try again. So I took a bath tonight; started with lukewarm water and kept adding cold. I'm not sure of the temp but I cooled it to the point of goosebumps and light shivering. Man, I had to fight against clenching all my muscles! I watched a 42 min TV show on the ipad so the time passed fairly quickly. I'm really looking forward to this now! I'm such a weenie when it comes to cold; it would be really nice to have it not bother me so much.

What are the benefits to doing the facedunk outside of the immediate physiological response noted a few posts back? Does it help with long term cold adaptation? I can see that it should have some skin tightening benefits. TIA.

[BestBetter]

Yesterday, my husband made a comment that since I've started taking cold showers, he's noticed I'm not losing my hair all over the apartment. (I tend to lose strands of hair everywhere, and we have a running joke that living with me is worse than having a dog who sheds everywhere.) This from a man who raises his eyebrows everytime I went for my cold shower and kept reminding me 'be careful'

After just a week, he's already recognizing that this CT stuff is actually doing good things, and he made a comment that maybe if he'd started doing CT years ago, he wouldn't have a receding hairline. Yes, Validation!!!

[gopintos]

I lost belly fat right away.

What is "right away"? I lost an inch the next morning I think it was, but.... BUT.... I figured I was just due. I hadnt lost for awhile, and I changed some other things, and the scale moved 1.1 pounds on the morning of my first bath, so I can not pin point it to any one thing. But that was enough to keep me interested and to keep doing it, just the prospect of having one more tool I can use.

It was from the measurement across my belly button, so tummy, hips, butt....the areas the most underwater.

[quelsen]

I'm not posting for your amusement. Sorry to disappoint. I came on this thread honestly seeking information and wanting to find the truth, and actually hoping that CT really works. But all I found were a few anecdotes with confounding variables and, "Do it because Ray and Jack said so".

And I also found a lot of really creepy adrenaline/pain junkie sounding Kool aid drinking behavior. (This is only in reference to the folks who say they just can't wait for their next full body ice bath. OOOOh yeah, ice baths. WTF is wrong with this picture?????)

I actually think there may be some merit to cold exposure on the level that Mark was talking about and possibly the spot CTing too, but full immersion in ice water to a normal human being is PAINFUL. It's meant to be painful. It's natures's way of telling you not to do that.

Rational thought has left the building.

who in this thread has said do it for Jack and Ray? Hell I am doing it despite Ray for shizzle, he and I had no meeting of the minds in an offline conversation. As for Jack, He teaches what happens when thus and so occurs, he doesnt actually hold anyone head in the water.