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Thread: "Carb Flu" Ketosis and how to lose 30 pounds of fat, safely. page

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    Mczx's Avatar
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    "Carb Flu" Ketosis and how to lose 30 pounds of fat, safely.

    Primal Fuel
    I am coming into this from being a vegan, who was consuming 90% fruit and 10% veges, some nuts and seeds. I had some issues on the high fruit diet which led me to believe I may have had borderline insulin resistance. Key among them was 70 days of Power 90 training and no measurable fat loss, muscle gain or weight loss. The only positive effect was gains in weight exercise weight amounts.

    Before going all fruit, I experimented with raw food, higher fat (nuts and avocados) and protein and calorie restriction. I lost 45 pounds and I do believe calorie restriction and insulin control were the main answer for that loss, by sheer dumb luck. I came to this conclusion a week ago on my own after buying a portable glucose meter and trying different foods and watching the effect on blood sugar spikes and crashes. I was surprised to see so many eating plans and books available for diabetics and or controlling insulin.

    So, I am starting in on eating the PB way and Day One was fairly tough with flu-like symptoms. Day two is marginally better, at least the headache is gone. I want some feedback and preferably if anyone has medical evidence, to suggest that this is just sugar withdrawal and not more from filling my blood with fat and animal products?

    I certainly was eating a boatload of fructose and white rice quite a bit. I will be happy if someone can give me reasons why it's sugar related.

    Secondly, I don't think ketosis is healthy for months, if I stay at 100 g carbs a day is that ketosis?

    Third, does the thyroid down regulate metabolism if I stay eating low carb too long?

    Does anyone do a carb refeed one day a week or anything like that?

    Basically the goal is to lose bf% consistently with light cardio at the start.
    Last edited by Mczx; 01-31-2012 at 01:22 PM.

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    Mike Gager's Avatar
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    you arent going to have carb flu the first day! is this even real? read the damn book

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    Empty your cup grasshopper. It's already too full. http://www.ironpalm.com/beginner.html

    Forget what you think you know about health, it's just going to get in the way of successfully implementing pb. If you're not going to embrace the change that pb recommends then you're probably not going to succeed.

    Carb flu is a comedown from excess sugars.
    Ketosis is natural otherwise we wouldn't be able to do it.
    Meat is only full of toxins if you believe the vegan dogma.
    Last edited by thanatos; 01-31-2012 at 12:40 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Gager View Post
    you arent going to have carb flu the first day! is this even real? read the damn book
    It's a long book, maybe I have not got to that part yet? Listen, I went from feeling decent for a long time, to feeling exactly like the flu the day or so after starting, seems pretty logical. 2-3 off sugars total, first 1.5 days were some beans. My point was to ask questions, not to get bashed here.
    Last edited by Mczx; 01-31-2012 at 01:24 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thanatos View Post
    Empty your cup grasshopper. It's already too full. Beginner's Mind by Darren Henson

    Forget what you think you know about health, it's just going to get in the way of successfully implementing pb. If you're not going to embrace the change that pb recommends then you're probably not going to succeed.

    Carb flu is a comedown from excess sugars.
    Ketosis is natural otherwise we wouldn't be able to do it.
    Meat is only full of toxins if you believe the vegan dogma.
    Clearly I have stripped some dogma away, or I would not be giving it a shot? I can accept that it's sugar related, just looking for similar experiences. If I have more of that feeling coming, I ain't looking forward to it. I believe the book said like 2-3 weeks to adapt?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Gager View Post
    you arent going to have carb flu the first day! is this even real? read the damn book
    Thanks for the positive support from a "senior" member.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mczx View Post
    Secondly, I don't think ketosis is healthy for months, if I stay at 100 g carbs a day is that ketosis?
    I think it's fine for periods, but probably not permanently, though different people feel differently while on it.
    It's very unlikely that you'd drop into ketosis at 100g/day, most people on here say that they need to eat under 50 to 70 g/day to be in ketosis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mczx View Post
    Third, does the thyroid down regulate metabolism if I stay eating low carb too long?
    Can't help you on this one. But this article may point you in the right direction: A Different Perspective on Hypothyroidism | Mark's Daily Apple

    Quote Originally Posted by Mczx View Post
    Does anyone do a carb refeed one day a week or anything like that?
    Yes, some do. I don't consciously have a carb reefed, but some days I'm very low carb, others I eat a coupla hundred grams. It depends on what I feel like eating on any given day and if I've had a hard work out that day (tend to feel more like a big sweet potato after a hard workout).

    Quote Originally Posted by Mczx View Post
    Basically the goal is to lose bf% consistently with light cardio at the start.
    Move around slowly alot, e.g. walk at least 30 mins / day.
    Lift heavy things a couple of times a week: This can be body weight exercises (push ups, pull ups, lunges - or variations of if you can't do the full exercises yet) or actual weight lifting.
    Sprint every 7 to 10 days (or more often if you enjoy it ) - move as fast as you can, for as long as you can. To begin with this may be a fast walk and build up from there.
    If you're interested in my (very) occasional updates on how I'm working out and what I'm eating click here.

    Quote Originally Posted by tfarny View Post
    If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

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    I went from a veg. diet before going paleo and I had the same symptoms as well. It started two days after beginning and it lasted for two or three days then it went away. Now I feel great and have no symptoms from the "flu". Ironically, I had a tiny tumble off of the wagon this weekend (it was my birthday) I had a piece of cake and felt kinda bad afterword. Sugar crash, craving, and bloated. bleh. Today I am back on track and will consider that my 20%. No harm and no foul, just life.

    As far as the Ketosis goes, it is my understanding that as long as you dont drop below 50 grams per day, you are not in ketosis. Ketosis begins anytime you Intermittent fast or consume less than 50 grams. If you consume around 50-100 grams you are in your weight loss sweet spot, according to Mark Sission.

    I think I read somewhere that a carb refeed would only be necessary if you were an elite or endurance athlete. Other than that, just some starchy veggies would be fine. ie sweet potatoes ect...

    I have only been primal for almost 3 weeks. I have found my energy levels to be higher and I have not sensed any metabolism slow down. The other questions are out of my Junior status league. But I bet that someone else may be able to answer them. Good Luck!

    Don't let these losers turn you off of the daily apple. I have found most people on here to be extremerly helpful and eager to provide information. Some are just ego filled trolls.

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    Mike Gager's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mczx View Post
    Thanks for the positive support from a "senior" member.
    well sorry if i sounded harsh but do you realize how many posts just like yours are posted every single day? a simple search or just reading the book would answer all of your questions. and again there is no way you are experiencing carb flu on your frst day, especially if you are eating 100 carbs/day

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    I don't know, but I suppose it is possible for someone who has not been on the SAD to get low carb flu earlier in the transition, particularly if they were used to loading up on fructose.

    The idea is not to be in ketosis long term, I think it even says as much on the PB carb curve. I find that I can't sustain it for more than a few days at a time, and generally speaking I'm not looking for it or trying for it, I just notice that particular taste in my mouth, a couple dyas later the taste is gone and the scales have dropped and then stabilise.

    There is some history here of dogmatic vegans (is there any other kind?) trolling the forums since we are mostly devout carnivores, so you might cop some of the backlash around that also. Unfortunately there are also a few childish posters who take pleasure in mocking newbies and their questions, none of whom have posted in your thread yet, but you'll likely see a couple of threads they like to hang out in.

    Don't take it personally. Definitely read the book and follow the blog. Check out every link in 'start here' http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread17722.html Every Link. After that you will be well placed to recognise who here knows what they post and who is full of BS.

    As any population expands, the number of idiots also increases. Just so you know, it only takes 100 posts to be a senior member.

    Relax, read the book and enjoy your new primal lifestyle. This is the way we evolved to live, it isn't supposed to be difficult. Which is not say that it is always easy, profit driven 'food' processing companies see to that.
    Live. Grow. Flourish.

    My Journal/story is at http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread38948.html

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