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Thread: Your chocolate products contain Ethanol page

  1. #1
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    Primal Fuel


    Did you know that the chocolate product that you are consuming contains a toxic substance called Ethanol? ("Theobromine"/ "Methylated Xanthine" - is a mild stimulant, similar to caffeine, but is NOT caffeine))


    If you've followed the research on why sugar and alcohol (and other 'Ethanol' containing products) are dangerous to your body, it is because of the toxic substance of Ethanol being introduced to your liver ("Sugar: The Bitter Truth" video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM ).


    The fermentation process of such products as soy, alcohol & chocolate (raw cacao beans), kills the embryo for the 'sprouting' process to occur in the cacao beans. This fermentation process involves glycolysis, which produces Ethanol and Lactate (lactic acid) from the resulting Pyruvate. ( http://www.springerlink.com/content/f080j630t1357431/ )


    Ethanol containing products: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOCNgiX7Zy4 (Glycolysis)


    I heard this and like many of you, (undoubtedly), I wanted to plug my ears and sing "la, la, la, la.... I can't HEAR YOU!!!!"), but I want to bring up what my research has led me to.


    All-in all, what I found is this: The darker the chocolate, the higher the concentration of Ethanol (and fructose).


    From what I've read, the whole bean, prior to processing, would be 'Primal', however, the extraction of the cocao butter from the bean is only possible through this fermentation process, leaving only the 'cocao liquor' for making chocolate. This Cocao Liquor is the by-product of the fermentation of the bean and extraction of the cocao butter.


    In short, the cocao nib contains all of the whole nutrients, including the cocao butter, which may be healthy for your body to consume (pre-fermentation process), however, what you are consuming in that 100% Dark Chocolate bar is a processed alkaloid (via the Xanthine, "Theobromine"), which can be good for the blood in small concentrations, but can be deadly to an already toxic liver as well as to a healthy liver, when introduced in high concentrations.


    You may choose to ignore this, as many of us feel a 'euphoric' connection with this delicious 'food', however, I think proper education may be necessary for those who have existing liver issues, (including current and/ or past alcoholism), as this particular processed substance called 'chocolate' is more damaging to our liver than we thought.


  2. #2
    OnTheBayou's Avatar
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    Some of actually buy ethanol.......


    Theobromine is a natural component in both coffee and tea.


    Whatever ethyl alcohol produced by the fermentation is probably evaporated during the heated steps. Like cooking with wine, there's no alcohol left. Darn.


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    Mmmm boozy choccy....


    I don't mean to be a smart-ass, I appreciate the research and links.

    TBH I'd be more concerned about extra fructose than about ethanol. And it does depend on the total amounts present, and your sensitivities to them.


    So how does this fermentation sit with other fermentations thought to be healthy - kefir and kombucha for example? They too will produce ethanol and lactic acid.


  4. #4
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    I think you greatly misunderstood Dr. Lustig's presentation. He said that excessive fructose consumption was similar to excessive ethanol consumption (i.e. alcoholism) in its effects on the liver and downstream. He did not say that fructose is ethanol, because it isn't. And whatever trace amounts of ethanol exist in a chocolate bar are not a health problem. A little ethanol every now and then (like in a glass of wine) actually has documented health benefits for certain populations.


    "Proper education" is indeed clearly needed here.


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    Fructose causes ethanol to be released through glycolysis, which is the reason that Ethanol is THE poisonous substance to your body (liver, organs and other muscles) when eating Fructose and drinking alcohol.


    Good questions on the Kombucha & Kefir!


    I'm not sure.


    The research on the chocolate is not very hefty and I have been scraping the bottom of the barrel to come up with what I have so far.


    When chocolate is summed up by it's components, I think it's 35% carbohydrate, 5% Fructose and then the Ethanol, etc. (I need to find that link again), so really, it's double ethanol with the Fructose in there!


    http://www.living-foods.com/articles/toxiccacao.html


    I'm still learning, but apparently, it's one of the most addictive substances known to man! Maybe that's the reason that many may not even glance at this thread or take it seriously?!


    I don't really like to rock the boat, but I like to know the truth and so far, raw cocao nibs are the only 'non-processed' form of this 'antioxidant' power-house, not the end result :-(


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    Chocolate and cacao are outright health hazards due to the chemicals, contaminants, and additives they contain. The chemicals within chocolate are called methylxanthines. They can be further classified as theobromine, caffeine, and theophylline, all of which have deleterious effects on the body. Theobromine is known to cause a host of symptoms including abnormal glandular growth, nervousness, depression, anxiety, insomnia, gastrointestinal problems, and itching....The carcinogenic mold called aflatoxin has been found in large quantities on cacao beans.
    ( http://www.rawlife.com/store/pages.php?pageid=32 )


    Researchers claim the same alkaloid compounds found in alcohol are also present in chocolate. This could explain why many recovering alcoholics use chocolate to curb their craving for alcohol, especially in early sobriety. ...Theobromine is an alkaloid with about one-tenth the stimulating effect of caffeine. However, cocoa contains about seven times as much theobromine as there is caffeine.
    ( http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=211209144665 )


    Basically, the science says "Theobromine is in there. Period. It's an 'Ethanol'. Ethanol is toxic to the liver".


    I'm still not sure about the Kombucha and Kefir references either....


    Time to research about the amounts of the 'methyl-alcohols' contained in the final product for both substances...


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    OnTheBayou's Avatar
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    ""Theobromine is in there. Period. It's an 'Ethanol'. Ethanol is toxic to the liver"."


    NOT! Theobromine is an alkaloid with characteristics in our body like that of the more well known caffeine. Ethanol is an alcohol, ethyl alcohol. Nowhere near being the same.


    I still don't get what the concern is. Drinking one beer probably has a heck of a lot more alcohol in it than ten pounds of chocolate. And a cup of coffee similarly in regards the alkaloids.


  8. #8
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    Glycolysis of sugars results in 2 pyruvic acids. Glycolysis literally means "cutting of sugar" and is the first step in the breakdown of all sugars, including glucose made in the body, by all aerobic organisms. If we don't have pyruvic acids made, we don't have the necessary ingredients to perform the Krebs Cycle (the pyruvates are converted to Acetyl Co-A, which start the process of the Krebs Cycle where the most significant amount of ATPs are made). ATPs = timed release capsules of energy for all cell processes.


    In anaerobic organisms, fermentation occurs and ethanol is a by-product). These organisms (mostly bacteria) can live off lower amounts of ATPs and a huge energy cycle like Krebs is not needed). Humans and other animals do lactic acid fermentation when muscles are starved for oxygen. We produce lactic acid instead of ethanol, the side effect of which is sore muscles.


    Simplified a very complex process here. Theobromine is not an ethanol, it is a xanthine compound. Alkaloids are not alcohols.


  9. #9
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    SassaFrass88, do you actually know what ethanol is? It's ethyl alcohol, the same stuff found in beer and wine and gin. It's not "poisonous" (except in huge quantities) unless you consume it to excess for a long time, like years -- just as fructose isn't "poisonous" as Dr Lustig means it unless you consume it to the same extent, as many people do nowadays.


    If you don't want to eat chocolate, don't. But this is an incredibly misinformed line of argument, and you are frankly making a fool of yourself in front of a very informed audience.


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    Primal Blueprint Expert Certification


    lbd, you are completely correct. I just bypassed all of that jargon to simplify it. Thank you for clarifying.


    John, I came in here to let you know what I pieced together so that it could be discussed. Please don't be mean to me. I can admit when I am wrong, I am trying to find the answer, not tell people not to eat chocolate.


    Calling me a fool is inappropriate and is very hurtful.


    lbd corrected me with the information that I was overlooking and very kindly, I might add.


    I got my wording mixed up, correct, how foolish of me, but I did come in here to FIND an informed audience so that I could sort this all out.


    You, however, were of no help in this matter.


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