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  1. #71
    Jedi's Avatar
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    Primal Fuel


    "I aim for 100% paleo, but I'm not going to tell someone they can't eat something (ie. avocado) even if I won't eat it myself. It might be a worthy addition to the diet, but it might do you a lot of harm. Until we know the 'true' causes of inflammation, autoimmune diseases, cancers, etc I'm personally not going to risk it."


    Tarlach, as a real prevalence of autoimmune diesease and cancer is a fairly recent phenomenon, shouldn't we be looking at what has changed in our diet since the increase in these diseases eg vegetable oils, increased sugar and refined flour comsumption etc ??


  2. #72
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    Except that what a pregnant woman eats also affects her unborn girls eggs. You might be able to lay some blame on you mother and even your grandmother if you are insulin resistant.
    [quote]

    Insulin sensitivity is going to start being determined from the moment the sperm combines with the egg. If your mother, while you were in the womb was eating a high carbohydrate diet which is turning into sugar, we have been able to show that the fetus in animals becomes more insulin resistant. Worse yet, we are able to use sophisticated measurements, and if that fetus happens to be a female, they find that the eggs of that fetus are more insulin resistant.
    </blockquote>


    Source


    So we may have to go back further than just the visibility of the symptoms and it might just be that the bad stuff is showing up sooner - ie. Pottenger&#39;s Cats.


    It&#39;s quite common to see families with illnesses happening about 20 years sooner every passing generation. Grandparents with got them in their 70s-80s, parents in their 50s-60s, and now children in their 30s-40s.

    I know a few families like this where three generations have had heart attacks, roughly 20 years earlier each generation.


    I have lost a few friends to heart attacks and cancer in their 20&#39;s and 30&#39;s and my dad&#39;s heart surgeon has quit his job because he is so disheartened at seeing people come to him younger and younger each year.


    My wife and I don&#39;t just eat strict paleo for ourselves, we do it for our kids and grandchildren too.

    The "Seven Deadly Sins"

    • Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . • Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . .• Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
    • Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . • Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . • Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
    • Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

  3. #73
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    Series of interesting posts on tubers:

    http://donmatesz.blogspot.com/search...mal%20Potatoes

    Height: 5'4" (1.62 m)
    Starting weight (09/2009): 200 lb (90.6 kg)
    No longer overweight (08/2010): 145 lb (65.6 kg)
    Current weight (01/2012): 127 lb (57.5 kg)

  4. #74
    Anand Srivastava's Avatar
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    Lately I have been leaning towards a germ theory of health ;-), rather than a germ theory of sickness.


    It seems to me that excess fiber or maybe some other things in the diet causes stomach acidity to go down. This prevents proper digestion of proteins into amino acids. The undigested protein get into our intestines. If the intestines are not healthy, they may get into our blood stream.


    It seems to me fiber causes a lot of these problems, and good bacteria help mitigate them.


    Tarlach, have you tried to get a large amount of healthy bacteria into your body, from kambucha, or maybe eating fermented meat. I would think that might solver your sensitivity to several food products.


    I think you are not eating foods that are causing damage, but you are also not eating foods that are healing. Inuits used to eat a lot of fermented food, which I think would be absent in your diet.


    I think our digestion needs a constant infusion of healthy bacteria. I have been lacking in this respect. I tried a few days ago eating a longer aged kefir (more than a week in the fridge), and immediately felt that my digestion was better. The digestion went back to its original state in a week. So I guess we need to have a constant supply of bacteria.


    This was not a problem, before the invention of a fridge.


    Could it be that the refridgerator also contributes in substantial ways to our ill health?


  5. #75
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    I know someone who is almost zero carb but only eats fermented veggies for carbs. I think this would/could be an ideal blend for some folks. I too agree w/ continually getting lots of good fermented buggies in through the diet. Almost all traditional cultures consume fermented foods in one form or another.


    I also think it&#39;s important to distinguish between fermented foods and rotten foods (which some think of when they hear the word &#39;ferment&#39;--at least I did when first hearing of them!)
    [quote]

    Tarlach, have you tried to get a large amount of healthy bacteria into your body, from kambucha, or maybe eating fermented meat. I would think that might solver your sensitivity to several food products.</blockquote>
    Some of the things Tarlach is describing are not sensitivities, IMO. Feeling mucousy after eating dairy is very common. Having joint pain w/ nightshades is common (from my current reading) as well. Many of us do not know/are not aware that we are experiencing these kind of reactions/effects of eating the various foods we eat b/c we have not removed them from our diets before. We may *think* we are fine eating them, but until we actually remove them, we are not aware of how good we could feel w/out them! (That has been my experience irt gluten/grains/dairy/corn/processed foods/etc.) I don&#39;t think this means we have a sensitivity to them though. I&#39;m not sure eating grains causes inflammation in my gut in the way eating gluten does for my son (who has multiple food sensitivities.) I think there is a difference between a sensitivity, and the body&#39;s natural response to a food. Some folks can tolerate dairy healthfully (typically raw, and typically because they have whatever genes needed to digest the dairy), others cannot. Does that mean some folks are sensitive to dairy, or that their bodies were just not made to digest it well? It seems most folks don&#39;t do well w/ grains (many just don&#39;t realize it)--like our bodies were not made to digest them well. Some folks get joint pain from eating nightshades, others do not (again, I think based on genetic makeup, etc.) Those are not sensitivities IMO, those are just natural body responses to eating certain foods, and *can* vary by individual genetic makeup...


    Not sure I&#39;m being clear on this but I&#39;ve got to run. I find this discussion very interesting though and would love to read/learn/discuss more!


  6. #76
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    Kombucha is not paleo, so I don&#39;t have it.


    Intestinal flora doesn&#39;t need any outside help if you feed it the right food in the first place. Introducing anything just upsets the natural balance.


    I don&#39;t have any problems eating anything paleo.


    Here&#39;s some info I came across on probiotics.
    [quote]

    Michael Wilson, Professor of Microbiology at University College London, said that the promotion of daily probiotics was devoid of robust scientific evidence that they improved health in any way. He added that while topping up on “good bacteria” might sound sensible for rebalancing or enhancing conditions in the human gut, it was based on “a lot of shaky understanding”.


    “It’s all well and good saying that certain bacteria are good for you, but we don’t know about all the other species in the gut and how they all interact. We are basing a lot of probiotic understanding on shaky ground. You need to know you are using appropriate strains for appropriate conditions in appropriate people and we just don’t know those things.”


    He said that there was some “instinctive sense” in thinking that manipulating the gut flora - or microbiota - might help with adverse events. But for people with compromised immune systems, increasing the bacterial load could risk problems such as septicaemia blood poisoning if there was a defect in the barrier in the gut separating bacteria from sterile tissue.


    No bacterium is totally innocuous. If you are healthy there is probably no harm in taking probiotics, but there is also no benefit. But to increase the bacterial burden if you are immuno-compromised is asking for trouble.”Prof Wilson added that the possibility of problems linked to probiotics would not be picked up because doctors rarely considered them as a cause.
    </blockquote>


    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article6438753.ece
    [quote]

    Probiotics, the potentially beneficial bacteria and yeasts available as diet supplements and in some foods, may not be as helpful as widely believed. A new study suggests that under certain circumstances, they can be deadly.


    This study, was the largest randomized, double-blinded trial of its kind, and the authors found no other reason for the harmful effects.
    </blockquote>


    http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/19/health/19regi.html?_r=1


    The study:
    [quote]

    probiotic prophylaxis with this combination of probiotic strains did not reduce the risk of infectious complications and was associated with an increased risk of mortality
    </blockquote>


    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/la...act?isEOP=true

    The "Seven Deadly Sins"

    • Grains (wheat/rice/oats etc) . . . . . • Dairy (milk/yogurt/butter/cheese etc) . . . . .• Nightshades (peppers/tomato/eggplant etc)
    • Tubers (potato/arrowroot etc) . . . • Modernly palatable (cashews/olives etc) . . . • Refined foods (salt/sugars etc )
    • Legumes (soy/beans/peas etc)

  7. #77
    Anand Srivastava's Avatar
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    My question is do you eat the meat the way our ancestors did. It was not put in the fridge. It was out their getting moldy and fermented.


    The problem with scientists these days, is that they have to have a cut and dried answer for everything. And they don&#39;t care whether it matches with evolutionary evidence. I think the opinons and studies are all bull****.


    There is a lot of fear of bacteria. I think the only reason why people in India have less allergic reaction than the people in western countries is bacteria.


    Why can&#39;t scientist give out results that also matches our world view and perceptions. Its like medicine is like quantum physics, and is not intuitive. I don&#39;t think that you agree with their results on saturated fat and cholesterol. Why do you think they would be right on bacteria?


    I think the only tenet in Primal lifestyle is to try things yourselves and check the results.


    You say that Kambutcha is non paleo, but why. Can you not prepare it from the juice of paleo vegetables and fruits. Why does it need to have sugar? Kambutcha is not non-paleo, only the recipes are non-paleo.


    Till you have tried adding bacteria into your diet, you cannot really say that it is bad for you.


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