Is A Vegetarian "Primal" Lifestyle Possible...? page 4

[Crabbcakes]

Hi Brickfur!

I was an ovo-lacto wholefoods vegetarian for almost 9 years, continuous, also for ethical reasons. I don't have a cut-and-dried yes or no answer for you, but I do have some thoughts, and I will give you those.

- if you have definitively decided that killing animals is not on your okay list, then that is that, and you will make as much of the Primal work for you as possible. I'll still talk to you.

- while I didn't choose Primal straight out of veg (there was a gap of a number of years doing just plain old bad eating), the thing that got me to stick around was the emphasis on grass-fed, organic, local. It showed me that the Primal people were not just a bunch of meatheads; they are concerned with the land, the animals raised on it, and sustainability, which should resonate well with you.

- the Primal folk, in general, eat the whole animal. If you are going to bother killing a cow, just eating the steaks would be a total shame, simply wrong as it is wasteful, not something paleo-man would have done, and something that I could not personally countenance. These guys eat organs, marrow, muscle, and anything else they can figure out how to consume. I find this the best way to respect the life of the creature you sacrificed for food.

- while I don't agree with stretching Primal out too far (because then it loses its identity and purpose and meaning), there is room under the tent for you, all other things being Primal.

- we are not talking about 2-lb steaks for each meal. The amount of dead animal that you really NEED to consume, taking into account egg protein and dairy, is actually on the smaller side than what I suspect you might think. Yea, the Primals love their meat, but many of them are choosing less-but-higher-quality over more-but-feedlot and making the protein requirements

- a final thought - why don't you do an experiment and SEE, just for yourself, how animal flesh makes you feel / perform? While this is a damning breach of vegetarian ethics, it IS a valuable trial of HEALTH. There are a number of former vegetarians on this forum who gave it a shot and found the improvement(s) to be undeniable for them.

[Gravyboat]

You should really read 'The Vegetarian Myth' by Lierre Keith. People's reasons for going/staying vegetarian are honorable, but, frankly, misguided. Vegetarianism does not stop the cycle of death, won't feed the hungry, won't help the planet, and doesn't stop (or even dissuade) factory farming. Not eating animals is not the ideal moral choice; ending agriculture (or at the very least industrial monoculture) is.

Standard non-organic agriculture kills everything on the land down to the bacteria. It displaces animals from their homes. It breaks the natural system of plants working together to form a living community, animals eating plants, animals eating animals, and then plants eating remains and excretions. That system worked for millions and millions of years. Now we come along and clear off all that land, that was functioning perfectly on its own, and kill every living thing on it to produce grains, which are bad for us and bad for the animals we feed it to. Agriculture is what is killing the planet, not animals eating animals. We were originally part of that natural and eternally sustainable food chain before we removed the food chain by killing everything, growing our own annual plants, and then force-feeding it to sick cows living in concrete cities.

If you really want to do the most moral thing possible, with regards to food, buy organic, buy grassfed, buy free-range, and support the sustainable living communities that nature is based on. Don't beat yourself up for being part of the food chain when the food chain is what nature is based on, what nature needs to survive. Do beat yourself up for supporting agriculture, which is essentially bio-cide. If you want to avoid death, well, agriculture is death.

tl;dr: Eat more (grassfed/free-range) meat and fewer plants if you really want to be sustainable and moral.

[Betorq]

I am a vegetarian. I don't eat meat or fish not because of any moral grounds or because I feel sorry for the animals, I just don't like it. I find the texture disgusting to take. I found myself eating less and less and it was much easier to become vegetarian than to keep refusing meals offered to me. My children all eat meat, I prepare meat and fish dishes for them. All I would like to know is how can I stay the very healthy person I am within the bounds of the primal eating plan. I don't need preaching to about why I should eat meat and fish..I don't...end of...but I am interested in knowing what alternatives I can indulge in. I take it cheese is a nono? So if anyone out there can give me any no nonsense help and advice rather than criticism I would be very grateful..

Just yesterday on a bike ride, I stopped @ the Korean grocer in my neighborhood, strolled around in the A/C to cool off, I saw that they had these cool Bulgarian lacto-bifidus fermented cheese, goat,sheep & cow. They were pretty darn affordable too for their quality. Like $7.50/lb. Natural full fat cheeses are awesome, eaten regularly but in whatever moderation suits you... I have no food allergies, nor weight issues, so I eat what fancies me... Quality cheeses ROCK. For a lacto-ovo vegetarian seeking to live primally, I'd say eat loads of eggs, whey & other forms of dairy, macs & other soaked/sprouted nuts. Go for it! Leaves more meat for people like me (a former vegan & vegetarian for more than 13 years)

[Rasputina]

I sometimes feel like becoming a vegetarian again, albeit "primal" vegetarian, just to piss everyone off.

[Leida]

I find the texture disgusting to take.

Okay,please, do not take it as a criticism or whatnot, but I am curious. How's texture of beef, pork, lamb, chicken, fish, eggs is all the same, and at the same time different from the texture of mushrooms, avocado, other fruit, beans, grains, cooked veggies, etc? Can you only tolerate crisp fresh veggies for texture? Is it to soft, too chewy? Is it how fibers fall apart on muscle meats? Is fish too flaky or shrimps too soft? You do not like crispiness of grilled stuff? Just what exactly turns you off the texture of proteins? Do you by chance over-cook your proteins?

[mystifiedu]

yes vegetarian primal is possible. You need to ensure you get a lot of protein from different sources eg. nuts, seeds,grain (small amounts-- can soak and eat small quantity raw), soy products in small amounts, dairy in small amounts, mushrooms all kinds, tigernuts ( they're actually a tuber root), spirulina supplement, reishi mushroom supplement ( these supplements contain protein in large digestible amounts ) , chlorella, wild green algae, sea greens, pulses,chestnuts-- raw or cooked