half marathon training page 2

[Orchid]

Just this weekend, I ran my first half marathon since being primal (its been about 1.5 years). My story is that, back then, I got a stress fracture, ditched running, and became vlc primal. I was running a tad here or there (maybe around your 6 miles/week, but with many 0 mile weeks) and then a few months ago ditched vlc in favor of carb cycling and moderate carbs and started doing more hiking, pilates, strength, and a tad more running.

Anyway... as far as this 1/2 marathon business goes, after just 3ish weeks of real half marathon training (got 3-4 long runs in), in the race I PR'd (1:35) and came in first place for my age group (F 25-29): not bad. With more training, I know I can break 90 minutes. I don't think its a crazy goal at all.

I run just 3 days a week (two shorts, one long), x-train 2-3, rest 1-2, ALWAYS train fasted, and ALWAYS carb up post workout. My active day carbs are 100-200 grams. Rest days 0-75 grams. The day before the race I ate ~200 grams of carb; morning of the race I drank some coconut water and took a bunch of amino acids. I had no GUs or anything (just water) during the race, but I was wishing I did in the last 4 miles.

Oh, and I IF, eating twice a day, both in the evening after a full day's work and a workout, all done fasted.

This was definitely the easiest half-marathon I've ever done; I felt so loose and easy and light. Maybe it has something to do with the not over-training, too, a problem I traditionally fall victim to.

Anyway, thats what worked for me.

[BCingyou]

Interesting thread, I also used to be a big-time runner and I'm now down to <10k a week. I have done halfs in the past, I think my last one was almost 3 years ago. But I was recently eyeing some half-marathons, just to try to get a PR and maybe do it with friends. Curious to see how it works out, and nice to hear that people are doing well even without the extensive cardio training.

[TerpsPwn_387]

Orchid nice job!!

I had the race today and finished in 1:39, pretty happy with myself. However, I got a big boy job this past week and have been too busy to train properly and I also ate pretty anti primal the last few days to carb up.

I'll have to do it properly next time, meanwhile I'll have to get back into my workouts and try to get back the muscle I lost over the last month.

[Blah]

A big part of paleo/primal is its not about dogma, it about making it work for you, so if you doing longer more intense workouts you will need more carbs. Sure running for 1:30 hours or so isn't "primal" or "paleo" but it can be put down to the 80:20 rule. Thinking there is a max 150g per day limit and you are no longer paleo if you eat 200g is dogma.

I ran a half marathon and I want to run a full marathon, I done this to test myself. I DO NOT do it for my health, or think or suggest to anyone that it is healthy. This is part of my 20%.

[Blah]

Since dogma annoys me I was thinking about this and found a post you really need to read

Carb Refeeding and Weight Loss | Mark's Daily Apple

Mark writes:

eating PB simply means choosing to eat real, whole foods that man has been eating for tens of thousands of years. You can go higher carb or lower carb

AND

because the PB is a moderate to low-carb plan, people (understandably so) tend to assume that carbohydrate refeeding contradicts its basic tenets. They make an incorrect assumption.

Also how does a thread like this fuel to the 30BAD BS and dogma? The thread is NOT low carbers, and NOT slow race times.

[Misabi]

Also how does a thread like this fuel to the 30BAD BS and dogma? The thread is NOT low carbers, and NOT slow race times.

By you letting the latest troll draw you into even entertaining the discussion. They'regetting smarter, even trying reverse psychology!

[Blah]

By you letting the latest troll draw you into even entertaining the discussion. They'regetting smarter, even trying reverse psychology!

I see it now, if I don't think about it too hard I can see the dogma

You can't run fast without carbs
These guys are running fast, with carbs
They cannot be paleo because they eat carbs
Paleo is bad, and you cannot run fast on a paleo diet

I bet its part of a circular piece of logic, its perfect because all the gaps in an argument can be closed if it just goes in circles.

[Blah]

Well if you read what those 30BaD morons say about us here at MDA then you would understand what Im on about. You got some 2:14 marathoners over there and 1:10 half marathoners like the Fruitarian twig Mike Arnstein and head cult member DR reckons he will give any paleo/primal runner 10 000$ if they can beat him in a half marathon on a diet of 150g a day.

Ive been telling all my work mates that Im eating low carb. Im more confused than ever lol! Is PBP low carb or high carb? What % of my cals should I be getting from carbs? Maybe I will start a thread on this.

Fittness and health are about much more than fast marathon times, we aren't suckered in by their challenges to a highly specialized event which suits them. A true test of total fittness might be a MMA fight. Would that be fair? Not really since there are afew paleo fighters and I not know of any 30BaD fighters.

Paleo/Primal is not about prescribing percentages and grams per day. Just eat a vaired diet of real food. If you have lots of weight to lose being low carb helps, if you do a lot of intense workouts more carbs will probably help, if you want to lean out try carb cycling and IF. Notice the lack of dogma in all that.

[Karma]

PrimalMark,

I disagree with your desire to "purify" the flock to your version of Primal, Mark has always said that if working out beyond the standard primal protocol gives you pleasure and you enjoy doing it then perhaps it is something you should continue to do. He does stress that you try to incorporate as much of the primal ideas as you can to aviod the pitfalls associated with your chosen effort levels.

What you choose to do is entirely up to you and that's what makes this whole lifestyle great.

I stopped eating low carb paleo and moved to a high carb primal diet (with a few alterations like white rice from time to time) because I HAVE CHOSEN to pursue activities that require I fuel my body with more carbohydrates. I run trails for hours on end because I love the feeling and solitude I get from it. While trail running I take the time to reflect on my life and how I can grow my business and be a better person. It's my "me time" away from all the pressures of society and my busy life.

Many people are going long on Paleo/Primal once they have reached a higher degree of metabolic efficiency and are still able to keep the carbs low. My avg. HR for a 20 mile trail run is in the low 140's (max HR of 196) so most of my runs are at <80% MHR. To say that you must be doing "chronic cardio" in order to go long is not entirely correct. It depends on your efficiency.

Three athletes I coach who eat Primal/Paleo just finished Ironman Arizona last weekend and all three had personal records by over 40 minutes. We used a smart balance of high intensity, hill work and just enough steady state (long slow distance) work to get these results.

Come down of the mountain and enjoy the fact that each of us can find a way to live a happier and heathier life by incorporating primal methods into the athletic pursuits we wish to enrich our lives with.

Cheers,

Dave

[Misabi]

Im PRIMAL MARK from SM CA man!

Means nada to me mate!
Could be good ole harley typing with a cali accent for all I know