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Thread: The bitch is back! Primal journal, round 3. page 2

  1. #11
    Knifegill's Avatar
    Knifegill is offline Senior Member
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    One idea about meds, here. If you have a life that your behavior won't fit into, is it preferable to take meds to change your behavior in hopes you'll fit into that life, or would it be more prudent to reshape the life so that IT fits YOU? I mean, are you living someone else's idea of a life instead of your own? Have you ever sat down and said, "This is what I want my life to look like. These kind of activities will fit my behavioral needs." And then changed it to suit you?


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  2. #12
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    ^I've definitely heard that as a method to "dealing" with mood disorders, but in today's world, it's hardly feasible/realistic (can't tell you how many times I've heard that from doctors/teacher re: public school structures). Had I enough money, I could do all the crafty things I want that suit my scatter-brained attitude. IT work suits me fairly well in its random day-to-day problems & projects, but the sedentary life does not. Nothing I can do to change that. I don't have enough money to even THINK about free-lancing anything.

    BUT I do think there are probably things that you can change that can help to adjust your life to your mind's madness. Today I am exceptionally scatter-brained, but it's working out really well (except for editing what I write). I took a random walk. I called my grandmother & my sister. I am working on about 5 things at once/in short segments and then working on another, whatever feels right. I'm making epic plans for this week/the weekend for moving into my new place. In the end, I'll finish what I need to before the week is up because that's what I always do and it's how I'm most efficient.

    Today is a good day. I've accepted my mind and am fitting my life around it. I don't know what's so amazing about today that my brain is so high-functioning. I am not always this lucky.
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  3. #13
    Knifegill's Avatar
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    You use the term 'sedentary life' but admit you have the ability to walk just a paragraph later. Do you feel guilty going for long walks? Are there family pressures on you that you wear like shackles? Our society has forgotten how to live, and wants you to forget how as well. If you try to live, go for walks, be the beast you are, you can expect people to shake their heads at you and slap labels on you. That's where you put up your middle finger mentally, and just shake your head and laugh about it. All it usually takes is a short sentence to remind them that you'll go crazy running in a hamster wheel. I'm just saying, don't waste any more time on your butt than you have to. We are born to roam the earth, learn the plants, eat some grubs, climb the trees, throw rocks and swim in the water. Do it!


    Turquoisepassion:
    Knifegill is christened to be high carb now!
    notontherug:
    the buttstuff...never interested.
    He gives me Lamprey Kisses in the midnight sea
    Flubby tubby gums latching onto me
    For all that I've done wrong, I mastodon something right...

    My pony picture thread http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82786.html

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knifegill View Post
    You use the term 'sedentary life' but admit you have the ability to walk just a paragraph later. Do you feel guilty going for long walks? Are there family pressures on you that you wear like shackles? Our society has forgotten how to live, and wants you to forget how as well. If you try to live, go for walks, be the beast you are, you can expect people to shake their heads at you and slap labels on you. That's where you put up your middle finger mentally, and just shake your head and laugh about it. All it usually takes is a short sentence to remind them that you'll go crazy running in a hamster wheel. I'm just saying, don't waste any more time on your butt than you have to. We are born to roam the earth, learn the plants, eat some grubs, climb the trees, throw rocks and swim in the water. Do it!
    ADHD comes in different shapes and sizes. What you put forth as a remedy would be great for most people, ADHD or not, but my issues tend to stem not so much from restlessness, but becoming overwhelmed. I can't shut out the stimuli, it exhausts me. By the end of the day, whether I'm sitting behind a desk or working in a fast paced environment, I need to recover from that. Pre treatment I needed a two hour nap every day. Going to the supermarket, a concert, a party, anywhere other than a quiet room would send me into sensory overload. Treatment actually allowed me to start taking long walks, climb trees and throw rocks and swim.

  5. #15
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    I understand that. And I remember now what it was like. Meditation fixed it for me, but it took over a year of practice and I still forget sometimes to just dull everything be calm. So, yeah, I get your point about being overloaded to the point where even standing up feels like moving a mountain. Have you tried meditation? The kind where you focus on just one thing and make everything else go away. I visualize a small black dot and the word "No" whenever my mind strays from the dot. Sometimes counting slowly to ten, or from ten to 0, helps my calm down as well. And afterward I find it easier to filter the information that floods in, and focus on the priorities as I see fit. But that's me. Like you said, everybody is different.


    Turquoisepassion:
    Knifegill is christened to be high carb now!
    notontherug:
    the buttstuff...never interested.
    He gives me Lamprey Kisses in the midnight sea
    Flubby tubby gums latching onto me
    For all that I've done wrong, I mastodon something right...

    My pony picture thread http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread82786.html

  6. #16
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    Thanx for stopping by, guys. I'll reply to everything next post, I just want to get my numbers and current conditions down for the day. I'm running out of 'day' here, it's already 6pm!

    Anyway-

    Data for yesterday:
    1510kcal (this is still a little low)
    11:30pm-5:00am sleep. Probably not much over 5hrs when you get down to it. (Not great.)
    93g carb/90g protein. (the protein continues to be a bit low, possibly. I don't count non-dense veggie protein though)
    28%/29%/43% protein/carb/fat I seem to tend towards a 30-30-40, of some variety. I know Zone is 40% carbs/30% fat. so not exactly the same.

    I feel okay, my energy is a bit better. I'm walking around, doing light exercise (climbing, picking, stretching into all kinds of positions to try to get berries deep or high in the bush without getting snared on the thorns (yeah, I'm still cut up anyway. This is NOT free food, lol). The berry expeditions in the morning, which now shake out to about 3hrs, since I kind of bliss out doing it, are a transition from no exercise to light exercise so I can get back to real exercise.

    Which will require fruit. I know me & my body. And it does.not.change. That's axiom #2.

    What remains to be seen is whether I can stay at 100g carb. Tom Venuto goes up to like, 200g per day. But I like Mark's curve. Basic Zone is, or was, given that I last saw the literature around 2003, about 120g carb. I feel most comfortable going up to 120g, but not higher.

    80-120g seems like the ideal zone for me. I haven't weighed in for a while, due to the sheer inconvenience of walking down to the cottage and the scale, pre-shower, pre-coffee, and in my underwear. Not that there's anyone on our property that could SEE me in my underwear. But eh, I don't feel like it.

    This is probably why the ED clinic isn't (or doesn't seem) too worried about my continued utility for the scale and the calories. Fortunately my ED was never really about weighing (or weight, really... oddly.. .but true). Or calories. I never counted calories or weighed in at all while actively bulimerexic there. I don't really feel compelled or bullied by the disorder to do it, really. Hell, if it isn't really convenient for me to do a morning weigh-in, I don't bother. Rather have my coffee, frankly. Also, there's this teenage kid who lives close by (and is often out in the morning playing with his machete(!), and the other day when I ran out (in my underwear, half asleep) to scream at THE DEER, he was kinda hanging around and staring.

    Which is no biggie, given that you can go to Wreck Beach in Van any day of the week and see half the world hanging out naked, but I kind want to say to him... 'dude, you're what? Fourteen? I'm 31, okay? I'M TOO OLD FOR YOU. I mean, fuck, I've got stretch marks on my boobs from the whole 180lbs to 110lbs to 150lbs to 120lbs (where I remain) thing.' Doesn't he have some porn he can look at on his computer or something? Wish he'd throw the machete at the DEER, for fuckssake.

    Right, but I'm getting off topic. (ADD, lol).

    So I've gotta do this carb up thing... soon. I've got to stop lazing around (getting my type a back, getting back to, you know, WORK)... but I... kinda... still don't waaanna... just yeeeeeet. Soon. Not yet! I may actually have to haul ass to the condo to Vic to get me back in touch with all that caffeinated type a vibe. I've worked my own hours (artist and all) for ages, but I always used to troll the coffee shops at 6am, just to be in the same space as all the motivated professional people, all coffee-d up and plugged into their blackberries. The energy vibe would get me going, even before the caffeine hit.

    I miss the city. Sorry Grok, I can't do this small town thing. Amazingly, this island doesn't seem to find me interesting enough to gossip about. (WTF, people. Have people suddenly quantum leaped in enlightened attitudes towards EDs or something?) But still, I want the anonymity of a city. Having everyone know you and your business isn't that hot.

    I will NOT miss the guys here (not all of them, fortunately) who are obviously bad news and obviously only interested in me when I'm too-skinny and obviously using something (though they don't seem to know what exactly) and on some reptilian level of their brain, kind of sense that they can get into a really unhealthy relationship with me.

    I can't remember who said it, but... seriously. 'Bone is for the dog, meat is for the man, gentlemen.'

    It is SO creepy when skeezy guys hit on you BECAUSE you're sick.

    But anyway, I've got to do something soon. Psychologist tomorrow. I might make an appointment with the nurse practitioner for the speed, I don't know.

    Lot of time outside in the sun today. Was nice.

    I've fallen into this pattern of...
    5am get up, coffee, out walking and picking and climbing for about 3hrs.
    I don't get around to 'breakfast' until 11am.
    I don't get around to 'lunch' until 4pm.
    Then I want to get dinner done because I hate eating late at night, so I try to get it in at 8pm at the latest.

    So, IF-city. Though I feel good on this. It definitely feels very paleo hunter/gatherer to me. I'll eat when I get back home, and if I'm out, and I don't feel like going home yet.... it just seems like Grokette wouldn't bother with food and wouldn't worry about it. There's lots of food, after all.

    So, day 42 today.
    Last edited by CandylandCanary; 08-30-2011 at 06:33 PM.
    Getting my Grok on in the Pacific Northwest.

    "C is for cookie, that's good enough for me."
    "Cookie is a sometimes food."
    "Sometimes cookie monster eat APPLE instead of COOKIE. Sometimes eat CARROT."
    -Cookie Monster, partially reformed sugarholic

    "

  7. #17
    CandylandCanary's Avatar
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    I was offered drugs and said "yes, please."
    Lol! Well, me too. I just got sufficiently high on sugar to not have to bother with anything else. But otherwise.. yep.

    Also, congrats on your sobriety! How long has it been now?

    So if you're pondering them and are worried about the drug aspect of them, don't. Addiction is psychological, dependence is physical and there's a vast distance between the two.
    I'll remember that, thanks very much for the advice. It's very timely since my doc just gave me the Rx for ritalin today. Your story is very illuminating, I'll have to come back to it later as I test out the ritalin, and if necessary go to adderall or dexedrine. Thanks so much for sharing.

    I've been playing the game of "Can I work without meds?" for a few years now. So far, I really don't know.
    I hear a lot of debate about this one. I know it's huge for creative people, the whole 'I can't take meds, they destroy my creativity' thing. I guess I have to count my blessings since it IS so black and white for me. My freaking brain just DOES NOT WORK without chemical assistance. Like, it's not whether I can fly the plane better on or off meds, it's that without meds, I'm not even getting the engine to start.

    I do see a lot of people trying to get off their meds, though. It was very interesting to read through this conversation here.

    Do you feel guilty going for long walks? Are there family pressures on you that you wear like shackles? Our society has forgotten how to live, and wants you to forget how as well.
    I agree. I've noticed this in spades. It goes double for women, too. Hell, it seems to go like, twenty times over for mothers in particular. I know my mom AND my sister (who has a 18 month old daughter) both struggle with this, but also seem to just accept it as 'normal'.

    I visualize a small black dot and the word "No" whenever my mind strays from the dot. Sometimes counting slowly to ten, or from ten to 0, helps my calm down as well.
    I'm curious about meditation. I do think that I need pharmaceutical assistance first and foremost. But after that, these lifestyle practices can't hurt. My psychologist was suggesting the technique of visualizing a billion buddhas each sitting upon a gold lotus with a billion petals. Just try picturing THAT, lol.

    Sure shut off the chatterbox in my brain.

    Nice of all of you guys to stop by. I really appreciate the advice.
    Last edited by CandylandCanary; 09-02-2011 at 01:26 PM.
    Getting my Grok on in the Pacific Northwest.

    "C is for cookie, that's good enough for me."
    "Cookie is a sometimes food."
    "Sometimes cookie monster eat APPLE instead of COOKIE. Sometimes eat CARROT."
    -Cookie Monster, partially reformed sugarholic

    "

  8. #18
    CandylandCanary's Avatar
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    Okay, so. Day 45! Awesomecakes. Or, I guess more primal-esque... awesomesteak. Actually, I wouldn't mind a steak... maybe I can score one for the bbq tonight. Salmon steaks are good too.

    The big goalposts in my ED sobriety here are day 90, which is when I'd 'graduate' from sober living, I guess. I'd be out of rehab by now. The next one is when my sobriety date coincides with that of the people on Intervention. (Just for the hell of it.) And finally, when I hit the 2 year mark. ED doc says that statistically, if you can stay sober for two years, your chance of relapse goes way down.

    Anyway, the news today is that I do have a need for speed and I clearly am a D-R-U-G-G-I-E (and I don't look as good as Marky Mark in my underwear either.. unfair, lol). The doc gave me the Rx for ritalin. I've got the pills. Haven't taken them yet. I've got all long weekend to laze around, though I should get packing soon. I'm moving to the city (Victoria) in early October.

    I haven't done the carb cycling yet. I've got ten million blackberries in the freezer, though! I'm all set. But I've got a hunch that in the same way MOAR CARBS did less than nothing for my ED, it's not going to fix my brain, either. I need drugs. So, I may want to stabilize on the ritalin before I start messing around the carb count.

    Been traveling, so more IF than usual, lots more VLC. Just because eating out there in the world is so damned difficult. It's a relief to just eat hardboiled eggs and burger patties, little salt and pepper in the baggies and it's ready to go. Cheap, too. And keeps me from turning into the carb harpy in an enclosed space. Planes are such goddamn food nightmares. I'm surprised anyone is sane at all, given the shite that everyone is eating constantly.

    My calories are low, though. I don't know wtH! is going on.... I was at 1490kcal the day before, 1520kcal yesterday.... too low! Honestly, I maintain at 120 with 1680-1920kcal. This is... less than I need. And yet, I'm not hungry and I couldn't finish my dinner last night at all... seriously, wt-freaking-F!

    Sleep could be better.

    It's also suddenly, as if overnight, fall. It feels like it could be mid-november here. WTF part 2. We had like, NO summer. I bought all these cute sundresses at American Eagle and I didn't get to wear them! OR the tankinis I got in Australia, it was too damn cold to swim! Not fair, climate change. I guess you're for real after alll.
    Getting my Grok on in the Pacific Northwest.

    "C is for cookie, that's good enough for me."
    "Cookie is a sometimes food."
    "Sometimes cookie monster eat APPLE instead of COOKIE. Sometimes eat CARROT."
    -Cookie Monster, partially reformed sugarholic

    "

  9. #19
    Blackcatbone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CandylandCanary View Post
    Lol! Well, me too. I just got sufficiently high on sugar to not have to bother with anything else. But otherwise.. yep.

    Also, congrats on your sobriety! How long has it been now?



    I'll remember that, thanks very much for the advice. It's very timely since my doc just gave me the Rx for ritalin today. Your story is very illuminating, I'll have to come back to it later as I test out the ritalin, and if necessary go to adderall or dexedrine. Thanks so much for sharing.



    I hear a lot of debate about this one. I know it's huge for creative people, the whole 'I can't take meds, they destroy my creativity' thing. I guess I have to count my blessings since it IS so black and white for me. My freaking brain just DOES NOT WORK without chemical assistance. Like, it's not whether I can fly the plane better on or off meds, it's that without meds, I'm not even getting the engine to start.

    I do see a lot of people trying to get off their meds, though. It was very interesting to read through this conversation here.



    I agree. I've noticed this in spades. It goes double for women, too. Hell, it seems to go like, twenty times over for mothers in particular. I know my mom AND my sister (who has a 18 month old daughter) both struggle with this, but also seem to just accept it as 'normal'.



    I'm curious about meditation. I do think that I need pharmaceutical assistance first and foremost. But after that, these lifestyle practices can't hurt. My psychologist was suggesting the technique of visualizing a billion buddhas each sitting upon a gold lotus with a billion petals. Just try picturing THAT, lol.

    Sure shut off the chatterbox in my brain.

    Nice of all of you guys to stop by. I really appreciate the advice.
    If you haven't read Women With Attention Deficit Disorder by Sari Solden I highly recommend it. Women often have issues specific to our sex, ADD tends to turn us into the exact opposite of what is expected of us as women, and many, many women find this book to be a godsend in terms of acceptance.

    I've been clean for about 15 years. After getting off the hard stuff I still really wanted to use, still drank too much, used a few recreationals from time to time, but nothing ever felt like smack did. I was chasing a high that wasn't coming. Then when I completely quit everything I got depressed as hell. Therapy helped identify why I felt I needed to get high, SSRIs helped pull me out of that particular funk but then real life settled in again and I had to do something about that. My experience is that if you've lived all your life with an unidentified problem, sometimes you need chemical assistance to sort things out, learn how to live all over again. For some people it can be temporary. It may be for me. It's been three years, so 41 years of being a mess have to be sorted out. But I don't think I could have gotten healthier without meds. I wasn't motivated, long term goals meant nothing to me because I could only see the short term. This was the biggest things for me. ADD messes with your reward center, which is why many of us have weight issues. If eating properly for a day doesn't fix things then why bother . . . It took meds to get me to the point where I could see the bigger picture. Now that I've established a healthier pattern I may well be able to stop at some point. I'll have to see.

  10. #20
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    Be careful with the Ritalin! My experience was wasn't used to taking it and took it during finals week to write some papers (I had an Rx for it, but yeah, was not using it properly). I CRASHED. I ended up IRONING PAPER.

    I still think it was a productive use of my time. It was brown paper from packages, I ironed it to use for wrapping things and then folded it neatly! It took 2 hrs of pacing back and forth in my room on the phone with my then almost boyfriend (now boyfriend) to wear through it.

    I'm ADD-like, but the doctor called it "executive functioning disorder" which I think has more to do with the way I learn than anything. I think it has less to do with chemistry and more to do with the way I was raised and observing my mom with the same "scatter-brained" behaviour. Recently, keeping fairly low carb has kept my brain is high-functioning order. I'm still scatter-brained, but it took 2 months of Primal eating to see that I could function like that, I just need to multi-task!
    Journal on depression/anxiety
    Currently trying to figure out WTF to eat (for IBS-C).

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