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Thread: Health, not weight page 20

  1. #191
    DFH's Avatar
    DFH
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    If you don't like negativity, why are you stinking up this thread with it?

    The site has strong differences of opinion because PB attracts a wide variety of people, and they don't always mix well on forums.

    People who are already fit don't always know what works, they think what THEY do works, but they could eat crap and do well, and claim that works too. That doesnt help the rest of us.

    I'm sick of people saying that if you are not fit, you are doing it to yourself and not trying hard enough. Mine started with 2years on Prednisone, and after that 15 years of listening to fit people blame it on me and give me advice that doesn't help. I don't listen to people who blame the victim, I know better, and I know how much effort I put into it. I don't have to post a pic for credentials either, that's bullshit. If you must have a pic, look at the blog in my sig and hit the my diet and plan page.

    I had to get a good dr and turned it around. I like PB, but the chances of it fixing the wreck I was in are zero. I think after 15 years of hearing bullshit, I have some experience with bullshit!

  2. #192
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    Fat people get defensive. I know because I have been one for a damned long time. Luckily, I am over the defensive stage because I'm egotistical enough not to give a fuck what some dude on the internet thinks of me. That said, for many, being fat = poor body image = poor self esteem = over active defense mechanisms. We also tend to circle the wagons around one of our own. Griff lost 100+ pounds, got out of a wheel chair, got his diabetes under control etc. That is a primal success. Now he is happy where he is. Okay, great for him. I would not be happy at 290 and neither would many of the rest of us. So what? Whether Griff never loses another pound or not he still lost a whole person's weight and has valuable advise to give. Just be smart enough to stop listening when it gets to the part that doesn't fit.

    It is much like dboxing. He works with athletes. He gets them down to great body fat numbers. Awesome. When I lose another 50 pounds I'll start to listen, but frankly, right now, most of his advice would not fit my situation. Be smart enough to know when to listen.

    As for posting pics and credability...how do you define credability? There are some hot looking folks over in the before/after thread but who has more credibility a guy who went from a 400 pound, wheel chair bound, diabetic to a 290 pound far healthier guy or someone who went from 12% body fat to 8%? I can tell you which one will look better in a picture, but speaking as a former 300 pound guy, Mr. low body fat wouldn't have had much to offer me at the beginning. It is about time and place.

    When someone is a new poster, 100+ pounds overweight and diabetic then Griff is the perfect source...he lost 100 pounds, he beat his diabetes. If someone is an in shape person who wants to get cut then go read about carb refeeds or whatever. If you weight is stalled out read about IF or Leptin resets. Where we seem to get pissy is that too many of us have one rigid mindset about what works. YMMV is often the rule. Don't take it personally. If someone posts something you disagree with then disagree but don't kill the messanger.

    That said, read the F'ing book. It is about as close to 'one size fits all' as I have ever found. Beyond that it's a WOE, it's a lifestyle. Live yours, enjoy it.

  3. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by canio6 View Post
    Fat people get defensive. I know because I have been one for a damned long time. Luckily, I am over the defensive stage because I'm egotistical enough not to give a fuck what some dude on the internet thinks of me. That said, for many, being fat = poor body image = poor self esteem = over active defense mechanisms. We also tend to circle the wagons around one of our own. Griff lost 100+ pounds, got out of a wheel chair, got his diabetes under control etc. That is a primal success. Now he is happy where he is. Okay, great for him. I would not be happy at 290 and neither would many of the rest of us. So what? Whether Griff never loses another pound or not he still lost a whole person's weight and has valuable advise to give. Just be smart enough to stop listening when it gets to the part that doesn't fit.

    It is much like dboxing. He works with athletes. He gets them down to great body fat numbers. Awesome. When I lose another 50 pounds I'll start to listen, but frankly, right now, most of his advice would not fit my situation. Be smart enough to know when to listen.

    As for posting pics and credability...how do you define credability? There are some hot looking folks over in the before/after thread but who has more credibility a guy who went from a 400 pound, wheel chair bound, diabetic to a 290 pound far healthier guy or someone who went from 12% body fat to 8%? I can tell you which one will look better in a picture, but speaking as a former 300 pound guy, Mr. low body fat wouldn't have had much to offer me at the beginning. It is about time and place.

    When someone is a new poster, 100+ pounds overweight and diabetic then Griff is the perfect source...he lost 100 pounds, he beat his diabetes. If someone is an in shape person who wants to get cut then go read about carb refeeds or whatever. If you weight is stalled out read about IF or Leptin resets. Where we seem to get pissy is that too many of us have one rigid mindset about what works. YMMV is often the rule. Don't take it personally. If someone posts something you disagree with then disagree but don't kill the messanger.

    That said, read the F'ing book. It is about as close to 'one size fits all' as I have ever found. Beyond that it's a WOE, it's a lifestyle. Live yours, enjoy it.
    Your voice of reason will quickly be shouted over by the dogma police.
    Thanks for the post though, I agree 100%
    People too weak to follow their own dreams will always try to discourage others.

  4. #194
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    I'm not posting photos. I like my privacy and have good reasons for managing my internet presence carefully.

    I've never been obese. In my adult life, I've ranged from lean athlete (when I was training TKD 3x weekly, running 4x weekly, and doing ballroom 2x weekly) to somewhat overweight (in my mid-20s lazy smoker years and then again recently after spending a year caring for a sick family member and then experiencing a major sports injury after returning to training). I've been lucky to dodge most of the SAD metabolic damage for whatever reason. I've always had a flat belly, and I've never had to shop in a plus store or had to deal with the mockery and discrimination that a fat person faces. For me, talking about treating people who are fat with some respect is a human rights issue, plain and simple.

    We all engage in unhealthy behaviours. I do things like hiking in the mountains, riding motorcycles, and other somtimes risky sports. Other people smoke (lots of people around here do without taking nearly the shit that fat folks do, despite smoking being a huge health risk and decidedly not primal). Some people around here regularly eat grain on their cheat days and definitely do less than 80% primal. Yet it's the fat people who are trying to do this, who are eating primally and following most of the other laws (in Griff's case, he misses on the LHT and sprints), that take most of the abuse despite taking major steps to improve their health and losing more pounds than some folks around here weigh total. I personally think there's a lot of internalized self-hate expressed in people's attitudes toward others' bodies.

    In the end, what harm is someone doing you by talking about a research study that shows some people can be as healthy as *an average person* and still be fat? I did not see anyone here saying that people should do nothing to improve their health. We can also all recognize, I think, that average health and ideal health are not the same thing (I'd argue that people like Mark are much closer to ideal health than the average person!). However, maybe for some people, making even the most healthy choices still won't give them a body that looks like Mark's or even what my body looks like at its fattest.

    Could Griff do more? Possibly. That offers no guarantee that he'll ever get below a BMI of 25 or even below 30 (the obesity cutoff). Does that matter so much to people that they can't recognize that the man found a way to be able to walk again, get his blood sugar and other numbers normal, and have a happier, healthier life? In most circles, losing more than 100 pounds is grounds for admiration, not trashing.

    And either way, that doesn't erase the other folks who are eating primal, doing primal fitness, and living primal lifestyles but are still not thin. They're around here on these boards. Their voices still matter, even if they don't pass a bullshit swimsuit test.
    “If I didn't define myself for myself, I would be crunched into other people's fantasies for me and eaten alive.” --Audre Lorde

    Owly's Journal

  5. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by canio6 View Post
    ..
    As for posting pics and credability...how do you define credability? There are some hot looking folks over in the before/after thread but who has more credibility a guy who went from a 400 pound, wheel chair bound, diabetic to a 290 pound far healthier guy or someone who went from 12% body fat to 8%? I can tell you which one will look better in a picture, but speaking as a former 300 pound guy, Mr. low body fat wouldn't have had much to offer me at the beginning. It is about time and place.
    .
    Yep.

    It cracks me up when I see so many guys posting shirtless pics to show off, as if their muscle shapes make them smart or worth believing. Just about every single bodybuilding site has them. "Look at me, believe me." No thanks. I would much rather believe someone that learned about how to overcome a problem and has some real experience than someone that never had to go through it and they think their fitness makes them smart.

    A lot of the showoffs are doing supplements they can't admit, and some of them would be just as fit eating pizza to be honest.

  6. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by DFH View Post
    Yep.

    It cracks me up when I see so many guys posting shirtless pics to show off, as if their muscle shapes make them smart or worth believing. Just about every single bodybuilding site has them. "Look at me, believe me." No thanks. I would much rather believe someone that learned about how to overcome a problem and has some real experience than someone that never had to go through it and they think their fitness makes them smart.

    A lot of the showoffs are doing supplements they can't admit, and some of them would be just as fit eating pizza to be honest.

    That may be the case for some but many/most of the people in the before/after thread have made significant progress whether it be in weight loss or muscle gain (or both). I find the thread to be interesting and often inspiring. (It helps that primal women tend to be hot). But I agree, just because someone is ripped does not mean their advice fits my situation. Nor does still being overweight/obese mean that my opinion should be tossed under the bus (presuming my advice is primal and not "EAT ALL THE THINGS!!!").

  7. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Owly View Post
    In the end, what harm is someone doing you by talking about a research study that shows some people can be as healthy as *an average person* and still be fat?
    The study is really interesting from a theoretical perspective--and I'm glad Griff posted it--but since it highlights the non-majority of the population, its sort of a distraction from reality, pragmatically-speaking.

  8. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by DFH View Post
    Yep.

    It cracks me up when I see so many guys posting shirtless pics to show off, as if their muscle shapes make them smart or worth believing. Just about every single bodybuilding site has them. "Look at me, believe me." No thanks. I would much rather believe someone that learned about how to overcome a problem and has some real experience than someone that never had to go through it and they think their fitness makes them smart.

    A lot of the showoffs are doing supplements they can't admit, and some of them would be just as fit eating pizza to be honest.
    It's called personal accountability. I keep/kept a journal with pics to keep myself on track. You God-damned right I'm proud of going from 212# to 148#. Going from obese to 9% bf ain't fucking easy. No real experience? Ha ha - I may be a loudmouthed prick sometimes, but I can back my shit up and I have never failed at anything I wanted bad enough - ever.

    I could give 2 shits about any of this -- the point is that this forum is being diluted with opinoins from obese and unhealthy people. Jeez, just look at your pizza sentence - unfuckingbelievable.

    Lets start an accountability thread - who wants to keep each other on track for the next year? Put up or shut up.

    And fuck you, DFH if you are insinuating I 'supplement'. My journal is 100% accurate and truthful.

    Edited to add: This type of post, your web site, and your adgenda here is exactly what is wrong with this forum. A leaner person is being told what doesn't work by a fatter person who hates lean people. Everyday here. I know, I make five figures - why don't I go over to the Berkshire Hathaway Forum and run my mouth to the posters about how the way they made billions don't work. Yeah, and I'll post contradictions abound to Warren Buffets book too - the book site is designed around.

    .
    Last edited by Voyageur; 08-18-2011 at 09:48 AM.
    There is a huge difference between talking about how to do something and getting it fucking done.

  9. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voyageur View Post
    Lets start an accountability thread - who wants to keep each other on track for the next year? Put up or shut up.
    I'm down.

  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by canio6 View Post
    I'm down.
    Great idea: hot bod thread.

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