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Thread: Endurance tank is empty, keep hitting the wall page

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    dabello1125's Avatar
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    Endurance tank is empty, keep hitting the wall

    Primal Fuel
    Not sure what I am doing wrong. I have been eating paleo since the start of this year. And, I have seen my endurance drop off significantly since I dropped grains. Pasta and rice were a huge part of my training diet for duathlons and triathlons. Since committing myself to the paleo lifestyle this year to clean up my intake, I have experienced fantastic gains in short explosive power and muscle build. But I also bonk, especially on my bike, well short of my limits.

    Since I don't not race professionally, it isn't causing any real problems. But it is discouraging to be unable to keep up on my group rides, or even complete my regular cycling and running routes in the same fashion as before.

    I do have an ultimate goal to qualify for the Boston Marathon, as well as qualify for the Hawai'i Ironman before I turn 40.

    Any suggestions or feedback is well appreciated! I have read "The Paleo Diet for Athletes" and it seems very contradictory to the paleo lifestyle. But as I am reading it for a second time, it seems like it may be making more sense for someone like me.

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    Welcome to the forum!

    You're probably right about needing more carbs as outlined in the Paleo Diet for Athletes. If you're cruising along at a not-too-strenuous pace, then you can run on fat basically forever. But as you increase the pace, you increase the amount of carbohydrate that you use versus fat. You have to match your diet to your exercise level. Mark doesn't recommend extended high-intensity training, so he recommends a lower carb intake. If you're intent on being a high-level endurance athlete, you'll need carbs from a primal-friendly source such as sweet/white potatoes or white rice.

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    If you are bonking, I agree - add carbs. Bonking is a sign of needing them. Sweet potatoes, potatoes and rice are all good primal sources. The other issue is the endurance training. Mark is not against doing it occasionally - but doing high endurance regularly is hard on you - stressful on your body in a way we are not designed for. It's your call, but you might think of reducing your endurance work.
    Karin

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    Quote Originally Posted by JKC View Post
    If you are bonking, I agree - add carbs. Bonking is a sign of needing them. Sweet potatoes, potatoes and rice are all good primal sources. The other issue is the endurance training. Mark is not against doing it occasionally - but doing high endurance regularly is hard on you - stressful on your body in a way we are not designed for. It's your call, but you might think of reducing your endurance work.
    I was a power lifter through high school and college. I have also done some crossfit type workouts at a local place where I live. I just don't dig the gym settings anymore. I went for a group bike ride one day with a buddy and got hooked on cycling and endurosports. There is something about being able to travel 150-200k in a single day under your own power that excites me every time I mount up or strap on my running shoes or don my wetsuits.

    I was under the impression that white rice and potatoes are not paleo friendly. I do eat sweet potatoes regularly, tons of leafy greens, bright colored veggies (I am a member of a local organic co-op so veggies and lean meats are never in shortage) some fruits here and there.

    I do miss having my 2-3 english muffins with peanut butter, black coffee and a banana or two before I start pounding away pre-dawn most days. What would I benefit from in the early mornings that will give me the same boost of energy that those carbs and caffeine gave me. What kind of meal would I eat after rolling out of bed at 4:30am..? This is the biggest problem I have since most of my training rides and runs start by 6:00am and go until about 8:00am.

    Ahh!! I need help and a personal chef!

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    Seems like it's time to either ditch 1) strict paleo, or 2) endurance activites.

    That's why I like the primal blueprint better than strict paleo. I wouldn't have the english muffin or peanut butter, but I drink coffee enthusiastically, I make a killer banana-buckwheat bread, and you can spread almond butter on it too.

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    I had the same problem with BJJ. I upped my carbs a lot and didn't see any problems. I even became leaner over time without any particular effort. I eat more plantains, beets, turnips, bananas and potatoes and I feel fine.

    Paleo isn't automatically low-carbs. Eating less carbs is really important for people who want to lose weight, but if you're fit and very active, you can get away with quite a lot of them.

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    For any anaerobic activity, like chronic cardio, you need the carbs. Not primal but that's the choice you make pursuing chronic cardio. White rice and potatoes are the best choice of carbs if you insist on this type of activity. Doesn't mean you want be doing long term harm, just less than if using grains for the carbs
    Four years Primal with influences from Jaminet & Shanahan and a focus on being anti-inflammatory. Using Primal to treat CVD and prevent stents from blocking free of drugs.

    Eat creatures nose-to-tail (animal, fowl, fish, crustacea, molluscs), a large variety of vegetables (raw, cooked and fermented, including safe starches), dairy (cheese & yoghurt), occasional fruit, cocoa, turmeric & red wine

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    Quote Originally Posted by Winterbike View Post
    Paleo isn't automatically low-carbs. Eating less carbs is really important for people who want to lose weight, but if you're fit and very active, you can get away with quite a lot of them.
    OK, so I can eat some starchy foods such as white potatoes and rice. I prefer brown rice and sweet potatoes but I assume I can go for the white stuff when it would be most useful for me, and not just at any time. What about whole grain pasta in moderation for a boost as well?

    Just so you know, I am 6' tall and currently weigh in a little heavy for me at 203lbs because I have been having trouble maintaining my race weight of 195lbs., since I have trouble maintaining my intensity and training lengths. It is not effecting me too much but I need to shave the weight for psychological reasons.

    I have felt much better overall and maintain a perfectly stable level of energy all day long since going paleo. It's just the long distance endurance that has taken the dive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dabello1125 View Post
    What about whole grain pasta in moderation for a boost as well?
    Pasta is made from wheat, and as a grain, has health issues like phytates and lectins. The only grain that doesn't have these issues after being cooked is white rice. You could try some rice pasta, but the white rice noodles are about the best choice. Even brown rice has phytates, (if I remember correctly - it has one of them, phytates or lectins)

    Quote Originally Posted by dabello1125 View Post
    I have felt much better overall and maintain a perfectly stable level of energy all day long since going paleo. It's just the long distance endurance that has taken the dive.
    Endurance exercise is the only thing we can do that makes us need to eat carbs. Normally you can manufacture enough carb-type energy from whatever else you eat, but endurance depletes your store of glycogen, and that is why you bonk.
    Karin

    A joyful heart is good medicine

    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliot

    Mmmmm. Real food is good.

    My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread29685.html

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