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Thread: The Journey begins with me page 320

  1. #3191
    athomeontherange's Avatar
    athomeontherange is offline Senior Member
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    I will say though that LC is good for me- almost NC. I see what you are saying Ruth. Gluten, potatoes and dairy give me issues therefor I need to steer clear and can honestly say I do pretty well. I know when gluten is in something because I hobble like an old woman the next day because the inflammation is terrible.

    I need to find my speed stuff and see if I can not find a happy medium with EMF/SPEED. They each want to focus on high protein or high fat. I need to find a happy medium of the 2.
    Karin


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  2. #3192
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    So then maybe you just need to work your macros somewhere between EMF and SPEED. They are both still pretty high fat right.

    we cross posted...I think it is just a matter of going a bit higher on the protein than EMF calls for and lower than SPEED calls for, it will definitely still be high fat as they are both pretty low carb (SPEED agrees with Mark in the under 50g category for carbs)
    Last edited by demuralist; 04-10-2013 at 12:46 PM.

  3. #3193
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    At the end of the day, for many (but not all) of us, it's going to be about calories. Having said that, I think nutrition is important, both for overall health and because eating 1,000 calories of chocolate cake each day is going to leave us HUNGRY and unable to get to goal. [I also happen to believe that a body that is very nutrient deficient will hang onto fat for dear life, although I have absolutely no proof of that at all.] Finding the right macros makes sticking to any plan easier. Let me think about some suggestions for you

    PS - got your text. Will respond shortly. Have been working today and actually forgot about it

  4. #3194
    demuralist's Avatar
    demuralist is online now Senior Member
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    So, Karin, at what approximate calorie level do you begin to actually lose weight?

    I am thinking macro % wise, what if you did 60%fat, 30% protein, and 10% carb (since you don't really like veggies and we can all agree that sugars are not a great idea). It is still high fat but it gets you back the protein you seem to need?

    p.s. I think it is probably all about the calories for all of us, I am just not sure you can regulate them as much as we think we can. And I do not believe for a second that it doesn't matter what the composition of those calories are.
    Last edited by demuralist; 04-10-2013 at 01:59 PM.

  5. #3195
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    Remember, the EMF original formula was based on the optimal diet protein macros which can be very low depending on what "hot stuff" goal weight you chose. Then we lowered the protein even more with the cancer/blood sugar stuff.

    Phinney and Volek, the current top NK gurus, actually recommend a range of 76-159 grams of protein/day (5'7" person), carbs 50 or under and fat in a range between 65% and 85%.

  6. #3196
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    Pebbles67 is online now Senior Member
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    double post

  7. #3197
    demuralist's Avatar
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    ah, see our efforts to be extreme so that we could lose the fat bit us in the butt.

    I would still love to know why I don't seem to register ketones. I will test tomorrow morning as it looks like (assuming the rest of my day goes well) I am very low carb and low cal today. We shall see what it says. I keep forgetting to get more blood sugar testing strips though.

  8. #3198
    RMS123's Avatar
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    I think we are all making this too hard (and I'm the leader of going down the "hard" trail). As opposed to NK (which I think is STRICT), there's also Barry Groves Eat Fat Get Thin, which I frankly think is like Primal and SPEED (except we need to adjust that crazy protein requirement on SPEED - that seems high for women at higher weights!).

    1. Looking back at your data, at what calorie level do you lose weight? I thought you were losing at 1700 calories? [Maybe not] Personally, I'd pick the highest number and go down from there If I estimate your BMR, and I assume little to no activity (it's what I assume), then I get 2121. If I then do a 20% reduction, I get 1697 calories.... If you go all the way down to a 40% reduction, you are at 1272. Honestly, when I was at your weight, I could lose at around 1700 calories. When I was in the 170s/180s, then I needed around 1400, 160s, 12-1300, and now (based on my results and past history) less.

    I still think, and my own experience going from 240 to 160 (albeit in the slowest path possible), this is more important than the macros for weight loss (although the macros then make life bearable).

    * What level of protein do you need? I've seen every number in the world. I stress protein because I don't want us losing any more LBM (and by this, I don't just mean "muscle", but bone, etc.) than necessary. Mark says .7-1 g of LBM. Optimal diet says +/- 10% goal weight. Assuming 150 lb goal weight....that puts you between 61 and 75 using OD. For Mark's formula, assuming you 114 lb LBM (who knows if my estimate is close), that would put you between 80 and 114 g per day or between 319 and 456 calories (of pure protein grams per day). I think we need to be mindful of protein, not get too much, but recognize that without nuts or dairy, fat is more challenging to get and protein may have to go a bit higher.
    * Next, assume you get between 15 and 20 g carb per day, which is another 80 calories.
    * Let the rest be fat.

    Anyway, some food for thought. I think we could all use to lighten up a bit about pure macros and target the calories in a way that makes sense...while keeping the general macro goal in mind.

    Here's a sample of a 1,500 calorie day (about a 30% reduction) - which seems like it would keep you totally satisfied and happy, but still with a pretty good loss.

    Breakfast Calories Carbs Fat Protein
    Eggs - Whole, raw, 3 large 221 1 15 19
    Purity Farms - Organic Ghee Clarified Butter, 3 tsp. (5 g) 135 0 15 0
    Pork - Cured, bacon, cooked, pan-fried, 2 slice cooked 84 0 6 6
    440 1 36 25

    Lunch
    Beef - Ground, 85% lean meat / 15% fat, patty, cooked, broiled (hamburger), 1 patty ( yield from 1/4 lb raw meat ) 193 0 12 20
    Santa Fe Ole - Green Chile Sauce, 1 oz 10 2 0 1
    Cucumber - Peeled, raw, 1 medium 24 4 0 1
    Homemade - Grass Fed Beef Bone Broth, 8 oz 69 1 4 6
    296 7 16 28

    Dinner
    Chicken - Thigh, meat and skin, cooked, roasted, 3 thigh, bone removed 459 0 29 47
    459 0 29 47

    Snacks
    Endangered Species Chocolate Co - Individually Wrapped Gourmet Chocolate Supreme Dark 72% Cocoa Content, 4 pieces 200 19 16 3
    Sunbutter--Organic - Sunbutter--Unsweetened, 1 Tbs. 110 3 10 3
    Add Food* 310 22 26 6



    Totals 1,505 30 107 106

  9. #3199
    demuralist's Avatar
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    Wow what a good friend you are Ruth! I totally agree. I am getting to a place where i believe that within reason the macros really make the most difference when we are talking about satiety and thus hopefully keeps us out of a binge situation.

  10. #3200
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    athomeontherange is offline Senior Member
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    I am back!! Tonight I am suppose to have internet installed at home, which will make things so much easier and not make me put things on hold until I can get to a wifi. Where I live though, still not TV unless we want satalitte which I do not.

    Ok.. finally found my speed book. Actually, I saved me download pag from SPEED and downloaded it again. Thank goodness because I coul;d not find my external harddrive where I have a copy! I also found my SPEEd journal.

    I started SPEED at 304.5 (OMG talk about your up and down), I do not see data for my macros there but I do see data when my weight went to 290. It was 1508-1658, 50g carbs (WOW that seems so high when I look at it now), 157g protein and 92g fat. It looks like I quit losing and possibly its because protein was too high?? When I was on EMF I was eating @ 1700 calories and losing.

    So perhaps I need to start at @1700 calories, 20g carbs, between 80-114 g protein and the rest fat. Oh good heavens I need to do some calculating... is it 4 calories per g of protein and carbs and 9 per fat gram?

    Ruth- you are awesome for looking into all this! Love ya sistah!
    Karin


    Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter

    What am I doing? Depends on the day.

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