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Thread: Conflict with tooth decay mineral needs and health... page

  1. #1
    PaleoMom's Avatar
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    Conflict with tooth decay mineral needs and health...

    I just finished reading Cure Tooth Decay, where the author takes from Weston Price's work the recommendation that for optimal oral health native diets had approx. 1.5 grams of calcium and 2 grams phosphorus daily.

    That by itself isn't too bad if your into raw milk (I'm not). How in the workd would a person get that much from paleo foods and more importantly I think, how could you ever get enough magnesium to balance that?

    I have to try hard to get around 500mg. of calcium, 1300mg phosphorus and 350 magnesium at the most.

    Could our info about needing the a 1:1 ratio of cal/mag be wrong? It is suspiciously difficult to obtain. It seems all the foods with lot of magnesium still have more calcium.

  2. #2
    tfarny's Avatar
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    Are you basing your whole diet around cavity avoidance? I don't understand. I absolutely do not believe your body "NEEDS" 1:1 or any specific ratios of ANYTHING - how could we be designed so poorly? Or could WAPF be partially incorrect or overstating the case?
    If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

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    I'm more worried about my kids who just got a few mild cavities. In the book one of the things that was common among the cavity immune groups vs. the heavy cavity populations was super high calcium and phosphorus and vitamin A and D. My current way of eating is reaching the levels common to the cavity groups...

    I wish there was more info in the book. I just don't see how it is even possible without the raw milk, which I'm not going to do.

    ETA: Also, I do think that basing a diet around cavity avoidance makes some sense. Cavities, somewhat like skin, are such an obvious outward sign of how well our diet is serving our bodies. I have actually never had a cavity, but with my kids just showing a few, I feel some adjustments are needed.
    Last edited by PaleoMom; 06-26-2011 at 10:20 PM.

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    You also need Vitamin K2 in addition to A and D. Chris Masterjohn has several articles on K2 over at The Weston A. Price Foundation where he discusses how its linked to Weston Price's observations on traditional diets linked to not having cavities.

  5. #5
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    How long have your kids been primal? That common saying, "Sugar rots your teeth" is pretty true. My teeth get fuzzy from just a tiny bite of fudge or other candy. I don't even drink fruit juice anymore, as the sugar content is too high for me. Also, I would think that liquid sugar would get in between your teeth more readily than solid sugar.

    Also, there's some evidence that brushing after meals is not necessarily a good thing. Eating increases the acids in your mouth, which softens enamel. Brushing this softened enamel can strip it away. Supposedly it is better to brush before you eat, then floss and rinse after eating.

    Greens such as collards, chard, and spinach have high calcium (and taste great with bacon and garlic).

    A lot of native diets included bones, cartilage, scales, and shells. Small shrimp can be eaten with the shells on. Bones can be cooked in a slow cooker until they are soft enough to eat, or grind into something else. Don't forget to use the broth to make soups (chicken soup made with an actual chicken carcass stock is awesome!).

  6. #6
    Fairychilde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PaleoMom View Post
    I just finished reading Cure Tooth Decay, where the author takes from Weston Price's work the recommendation that for optimal oral health native diets had approx. 1.5 grams of calcium and 2 grams phosphorus daily.

    That by itself isn't too bad if your into raw milk (I'm not). How in the workd would a person get that much from paleo foods and more importantly I think, how could you ever get enough magnesium to balance that?


    I have to try hard to get around 500mg. of calcium, 1300mg phosphorus and 350 magnesium at the most.

    Could our info about needing the a 1:1 ratio of cal/mag be wrong? It is suspiciously difficult to obtain. It seems all the foods with lot of magnesium still have more calcium.
    I just finished this book too and it has some truly valuable information in it. I agree about basing a diet around cavity avoidance. We do not consume raw milk here because I am casein sensitive and react to raw milk just about as bad a pasteurized milk (which I have on occasion as a treat). I considered introducing raw milk into my 3 year old's diet after reading this book but have since changed my mind because I just don't feel that it is necessary. I made an awesome chicken stock the other night and have also started fermented veggies. We eat a ton of pastured eggs and butter and I am going to make some coconut milk kefir pretty soon. I also just ordered some fermented cod liver oil/butter oil in the chocolate flavor for my 3 year old from Green Pasture (the one he recommends in the book). I believe that between the CLO/butter oil, pastured butter and eggs, addition of fermented veggies, and most importantly AVOIDANCE of sugar that my 3 year old's teeth will be fine without the raw milk.

  7. #7
    PaleoMom's Avatar
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    Since birth, my kids get sugar only a few times a year. They have been raised on pretty healthy food except for a few "eras" before I knew as much when they did eat a lot of oatmeal and wheat. For several years they have been gluten free but still eating grains. I think this is where things were the most off. I have now eliminated the gluten free grains as well for them.

    We have always been big on pasture butter (our only dairy) we are casein sensitive, like Fairychilde. I make a lot of veggie soups with homemade bone broth. The take vit D3, CLO daily and probiotics and homemade cultured foods. We also get pastured eggs and all our meat is local grass fed.

    Personally, I think this speaks volumes for how bad grains are. They have been out of my diet for some time, but it is so much harder with the kids, so I was lazy about it. They eat so many things right, but the little part bad was enough I guess. I'm also shocked by them getting cavities when I have never had one and I grew up on a ton of whole grains, non-fat milk, and an almost fat-free diet.

    I have also started having them brush with my new homemade toothpaste without glycerin and with coral calcium powder in it, and then they swish for a few minutes with water with the coral calcium powder in it after brushing. I hope this speeds up the remineralization process. I think the brushing the glycerin toothpaste wasn't much help before.

    jfreaksho, thanks for the info on brushing after meals. I had not heard that. The girls never did that in the past, but since the cavity diagnosis I have started having them do that after breakfast. I think I'll stop and have them do it first thing in the am instead.

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