A thread wherein guys rant, complain, and chat about MANLY MAN THINGS page 481

[Blackcatbone]

Nice bumper sticker. Lemme know when you have thoughts of your own.

[kenn]

Nice bumper sticker. Lemme know when you have thoughts of your own.

coming from the person that keeps spouting progressive propaganda

I lol'd

[Grumpycakes]

Wow which Europeans taught female genital mutilation again?

[kenn]

You obviously don't understand how colonialism works. Not surprising. Not that I thought being old made one wise . . . .

Nice dodge again

[wildwabbit]

You obviously don't understand how colonialism works. Not surprising. Not that I thought being old made one wise . . . .

There! Thats more like it! +1 for even adding a zippy zinger on the end! I can get to like this side of you!

Let me be clear, colonialism for the greatest part was a quite a bad thing for those colonized, to the extent that the good things that survived don't even tip the scale back to any degree (and where people debate that, its to a matter of +- a few degrees). I am not a supporter of colonialism. (Though I am a big fan of ancient roman foreign policy)

What I have issue with is the belief that colonialism lasting into the early 20th century is responsible for 21st century problems. Tribes, kingdoms, countries, empires, all over the world have been conquering their neighbors for centuries, often for times lasting centuries. Its like saying the current Greek financial crisis is due to the 700 or so years of Ottoman rule (but the greeks had it coming to them since the days of Alexander! damn them!)

[Chaohinon]

When you blow up a school, a church is going to go up in its place. The outgrowth of bassackwards religious values is an after-effect of poverty, which is in itself an after-effect of violent western imperialism.

Not to excuse what muslims do, but the west is at least partially responsible for bombing them back into the stone age. Not only that, but when faced with a foreign (white, christian) invasion, the common people are going to huddle under leaders they would normally be itching to overthrow.

What I have issue with is the belief that colonialism lasting into the early 20th century is responsible for 21st century problems.

Except that colonialism in arab countries has been occurring up to as recently as, uh, RIGHT NOW.

[Blackcatbone]

Nice dodge again

Did you say something? Because all I heard was

[kenn]

Did you say something? Because all I heard was

[wildwabbit]

Except that colonialism in arab countries has been occurring up to as recently as, uh, RIGHT NOW.

Uh, let me know when the US military actions (at a cost of untold billions of dollars to the american people) results in seriously reduced price of gas at our pumps here in the good ol' US of A. You can hate on it all you want, and call it alot of bad things, but to borrow a phrase from a certain kitty kitty sleeping in Tennessee: "You obviously don't understand how colonialism works".

[Blackcatbone]

What I have issue with is the belief that colonialism lasting into the early 20th century is responsible for 21st century problems. Tribes, kingdoms, countries, empires, all over the world have been conquering their neighbors for centuries, often for times lasting centuries. Its like saying the current Greek financial crisis is due to the 700 or so years of Ottoman rule (but the greeks had it coming to them since the days of Alexander! damn them!)

Unfortunately it does. Rwanda is the perfect example of colonialism disrupting what would have been normal disputes by neighboring ethnic groups and turning them into bloodbaths of epic proportions. Not only did the colonizers put the machetes in their hands but they created the environment for the massacres to happen. But in other instances, like Chaohinon mentions, when a country is decimated by outside forces, the natives have a tendency to support leaders they would normally want to overthrow. I never meant that these behaviors are taught by those doing the colonizing (as Grumpy implied with FGM, which is absolutely abhorrent and such instances are why I am not a cultural relativist) but rather an environment exists where such behaviors can arise. Iran is the perfect example of a country making progress only to be plunged backwards due to outside interference. Did the US teach these behaviors? Of course not. But we did set the stage for them.