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Thread: Reluctantly joining the calorie counting camp... page

  1. #1
    Camille's Avatar
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    Reluctantly joining the calorie counting camp...

    Primal Fuel
    So here's my story, I'm about a week short of 2 months PB. In the beginning I dropped about 4 lbs of water weight very quickly. I battled a crazy bad month long carb flu in which I ate as much primal food as I wanted in order to feel better. I started at about 175 (I'm female, 5'-5", 26 yrs old) and now I'm flip flopping between 170-172. It's very frustrating, I should be down more in almost two months! And, no, my clothes don't fit that much better.

    I tracked carbs and calories in the first week and then stopped; I thought got the hang of it and could stop counting calories forever! But can't eat whatever I want within PB parameters, it seems. Now that I'm over the carb flu and have my wits about me, I'm thinking I'll have to start counting calories again to lose fat (since the beginning of the year to the start of PB in March, I was counting calories daily and lost maybe a total of 2 lbs on CW dieting).

    I've cut down on dairy, nuts, and fruit, but I'm still allowing myself some. I supplement magnesium citrate, D3, fish oil, and take a b-complex. I eat enough fat. I have about 2 tablespoons of coconut oil daily. I stopped working out during my carb flu period, but I'm now slowly incorporating walking, sprinting, and circuit training. I don't IF, and I'm not really sold on it just yet.

    I've rarely been a normal healthy weight my entire life, usually 10-30 lbs overweight, so I'm pretty sure I'm simply dealing with the short end of the metabolic stick. The only time I was ever thin, I was 16 and eating two Weight Watchers frozen meals everyday. Otherwise, I'm very healthy - no thyroid issues or anything like that. I'm just doomed to count calories in order to lose weight.

    My concern is... do I need to be eating 1200 calories a day to reach my goal?? That just makes me sad!

    From tracking for the past two days I've eaten an average of 1935 calories, 60 grams of carbs, 160 grams of fat, and 90 grams of protein (yesterday was protein skimpy I'll admit). I know I can maintain on this at least.

    I know I just need to play with my numbers to see what works. Anybody else in calorie counting prison? What should I do to figure out where I need to be? What do all of you PB calorie counters do?

    Feedback is much appreciated!

    - Camille

  2. #2
    Stabby's Avatar
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    I wouldn't throw in the towel and go primal weight-watchers just yet. Check this check-list. If you pass the check list then you can go primal weight-watchers.

    -Total body nutritional sufficiency? Good that you're taking magnesium and vitamin d, but what about others like potassium that tend to be low on low carb diets? That includes iodine. A lot of people are deficient in good iodine. We'll automatically have hypothyroid if we have too little. Various toxins just make the problem worse. You say you have no thyroid issues but we can never be sure that the lack of a diagnosis means that everything is all well.

    -Total amount of omega 6 in diet? What kind of fish oil are you taking? I'm really not a fan of fish oil, simply fatty fish cooked lightly. Sometimes with fish oil all it ends up doing is causing oxidative stress or suppressing the immune system, or nothing at all. The way to improve cellular DHA status is truly to eat fatty fish.

    -Gut health? Have you considered trying as hard as you can to heal the gut? Gelatin helps and a good quality probiotic is important. Combine that with fermentable fiber like chicory root of jicama to help heal the gut and produce butyrate to improve insulin sensitivity and decrease inflammation.

    - After that, Try a higher carb intake to the tune of 25% calories as mostly starchy carbohydrate before trying a low calorie diet. It's amazing how some people respond to good primal carbs. Often it resolves cortisol issues that some people get on a very low carbohydrate diet.

    -How are exercise and sleep? How is temperament?

    If you have tried all of that, THEN maybe try less calories but I don't like that. It just ends up causing problems and misery down the road and treats the symptoms of a problem that should be taken care of anyway. You have a history of weight watchers and I would count that as a potential metabolic antagonist. Our brains loath being starved when they are already starving due to poor leptin signaling. If anything you should probably eat more food and work on health instead of making a goal as quickly as possible.
    Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

    Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

  3. #3
    spakesneaker's Avatar
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    I agree with Stabby but this thread also provides a lot of opinions and info on counting calories: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread24580.html

    But my first reaction is, if the thought of actively restricting yourself to eating 1200 calories a day depresses you... don't do it. You haven't been doing this for very long, I say give it some time and focus on good nutrition, exercise, sleep, and positive thinking.

  4. #4
    Sue's Avatar
    Sue
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    Camille, I would keep the protein and carb the same and cut the fat down to 100g.
    60g carbs - 240 cals
    90g protein - 360 cals
    100g fat - 900 cals
    TOTAL 1,500 cals
    See what happens when you do that for a week.

  5. #5
    StoneAgeQueen's Avatar
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    Calories only seem to matter to me if I'm not in ketosis, when I'm in ketosis the weight falls off me. You don't need to be in ketosis to lose weight, but it seems to help some people enormously. I know if I ate even a small amount of fruit I wouldn't be in ketosis any more. Please try other things before you cut down your calorie intake - such as cutting OUT fruit and dairy. If you have fructose issues even a small amount of berries would be enough to stall weight loss.

  6. #6
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    DFH
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    I don't agree with most of the responses at all. Your diet is balanced enough and things should have changed by now, assuming a normal metabolism, which may not be the case.

    When I read your post, my first thought was thyroid/metabolism, and too much food! Just because a doc says your thyroid numbers are good, it doesn't mean it's true. Many, many people have symptoms and slow metabolism even though docs say numbers are good. The reason is the tests are not good enough.

    You should be able to get to any weight you want the way you are eating now, unless metabolism is slow, which means just eat less. Not everyone can consume that many calories and lose at the same time. (I'm in this group too, i would get huge on 2,000 calories)

    Not everyone agrees, and many people with normal metabolism just don't get it. They keep saying "don't count calories, eat the bacon, you will be fine and weight will fall off," but won't! Some of us just need to eat less.

  7. #7
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    I got to my lowest by cutting out anything that wasn't meat/veggies. I would allow myself some small amount of coconut bark in the evening made with coconut butter, almond butter, and dark cocoa powder...but not the kind made with fruit. I cut out dairy completely and fruit basically. It was going well too until my cycle showed up lol. So I'm working on fixing that slip up every month to see how I progress.

    I just posted a response on another post that talks about fruit and if you don't need it to restore your glycogen levels it goes immediately for fat storage. So I think it's an important one to cut out until you reach goal weight. As for the dairy, it has caused so many bloating problems for me not to mention digestive problems. Substitute coconut milk if you have to have something and just nix the cheese/sour cream/cream cheese/yogurt/etc. all together. Butter doesn't count, though. It isn't "real" dairy.

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    StoneAgeQueen's Avatar
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    I agree with Goldensparrow. When people post all these 'why am I not losing weight' threads, I can spot the culprit immediately. A lot of people can't do fruit or dairy, it's as simple as that.

  9. #9
    spakesneaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DFH View Post
    Not everyone agrees, and many people with normal metabolism just don't get it. They keep saying "don't count calories, eat the bacon, you will be fine and weight will fall off," but won't! Some of us just need to eat less.
    I don't have a normal metabolism and I think that's dangerous advice. Ultimately it will come down to being in a caloric deficit, but I don't think it is healthy to actively restrict yourself if you go into it feeling like it will make you miserable, like the OP does... that just leads to more misery and binging later on, especially when coming from a long dieting history like Camille seems to be (and especially being a young woman). I think your food intake may regulate itself and naturally decrease now that you've just come out of the carb flu. But why don't you post what you eat in a sample day?

    Intermittent Fasting may be a way of achieving caloric restriction that doesn't feel like you're restricting yourself. FWIW, the ladies on the "Reality Check: Counting Calories" thread came to the conclusion that eating more protein and less fat seemed to be the key for them.

    Dairy may have to go completely because it causes inflammation in many people, keeping them from losing weight. But if you want to eat some fruit I would suggest tracking and just not eating too much of it, everyone has different thresholds for what takes them out of ketosis.

  10. #10
    JKC's Avatar
    JKC
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    I have stalled out too, and we are both started around the same time. I think that happens when you don't have much to lose. Your body may have decided to setpoint here, which means you may well have to change things to lose, since that is your goal. Rather than calorie count, drop fruit or dairy entirely, or other things that are more extreme, can you just keep a closer eye on what you are eating and your fullness cues. Maintaining is easy on this way of eating, but I would not be surprised if losing (for some of us) takes a little extra attention. I have logged an average day's calories, and I know my average calories are enough to lose slowly, but I do not actively count every day. In the long run it should come off, or I should build muscle and lose fat - really, I don't care that much which.

    I am feeling a little impatient, but really, if the lbs are going to stay off permanently, does it matter that much if it happens this week or in 3 months or so?
    Karin

    A joyful heart is good medicine

    He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliot

    Mmmmm. Real food is good.

    My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread29685.html

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