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Thread: Intermittent Fasting - A Primer ( Part 3 ) page 22

  1. #211
    PrimalFocus's Avatar
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    Hi,

    So today I had an important meeting in the afternoon and was unable/willing to eat lunch beforehand. Afterwards I had no appetite (meeting went fine, hehe) and chose to push through to dinner. Ended up with a 20-24 hour fast. It really was no issue in general. When I ate I had 1 cup of rice, 12 oz of skirt steak and a mushroom sauce made with heavy cream. It was delicious! However, I was full to the point of feeling nauseous shortly after eating. Took a little concentration to keep it down. Feel OK now, 30 minutes later. Possibly ate too fast but, uh, not ideal. Need to dial it in a little better I think. Now I am just full/satisfied. Need to figure out how to skip the nauseous step...

    Later!

  2. #212
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    Quote Originally Posted by govinca View Post
    How do you feel about taking bcaas even when not training during the fast. Do you think it would mess up the normal process of fasting and how your body responds to it?
    BCAAs are interesting.

    When it comes to fasting, there is a degree of proteolysis that goes on beyond 24 hours or so, or more specifically, once your glycogen stores are depleted, your body starts to transition to using ketones derived from fatty acid oxidation as an energy substrate. During this transitional phase, there is still largely a dependence on glucose and the glycolytic pathways for energy, even in those tissues that are capable of utilizing ketones as an energy substrate.

    However, due to the fact that you have depleted your glycogen stores, the body needs to bridge the gap, and it does so via gluconeogenesis from protein ( amino acids ) sources. The amino acids that are preferentially used in this case are BCAAs. This same process is active in folks following a ketogenic diet. I have read studies ( I don't have them right at hand, unfortunately ) that indicate that BCAA supplementation in people that are undergoing ketosis does not affect the ketotic state.

    Now, many of the metabolic effects of ketosis are pretty much identical to the fasting response, so I would speculate that BCAAs would not have a significant impact on your fast, depending on the quantity you ingest, of course. However, because you are supplementing with external BCAAs, realize that you are prolonging the transition phase from glycolytic to lipolytic metabolism. This would be pretty much irrelevant to you, however, if you never fast beyond 24 hours, as fasts of this duration predominantly cycle through glycogen ... you deplete while fasting, and replenish when feeding.

    -PK
    Last edited by pklopp; 07-19-2012 at 07:16 AM.
    My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

    Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

  3. #213
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    Quote Originally Posted by William398 View Post
    I did my 1st 40+hr fast last week. Couldn't believe how easy the last 15hrs was. When it was time to break the fast I wasn't even really hungry, could have gone on longer. After ready the above it's a good thin I didn't.
    Pretty much every time that I break my 40+ hr fast I do so because my watch tells me that it is time, not because my appetite dictates that I do so. I actually get far hungrier for my daily meal than for my 40+ hour meal...

    -PK
    My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

    Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

  4. #214
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    How long to you tend to allow for a meal eating once a day? I've been eating for 1-2 hours and done, but I see mention of 20hr fast indicating that you may snack throughout the night for the next 2-3 hours after the meal? Just curious.

  5. #215
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    Quote Originally Posted by pklopp View Post
    If you recall, in part two I made the point that our goal is to get to one large meal in the evening, and to have an inter meal interval of about 20 hours.

    This 20 hours is not intended to imply that we have a 4 hour eating window. Rather, it is intended to account for the absorptive phase associated with every meal which lasts 4 - 5 hours depending on the individual. Once you absorb your meal over several hours, you enter the post-absorptive state where your metabolism, in the absence of further meals, increasingly becomes reliant on FFAs from adipose tissue for energy. As your body transitions from glucose to FFAs as an energy substrate, you may experience a dip in blood glucose levels which could induce hunger. Were you to not eat, your hunger would naturally abate as your FFA levels rise and your tissues are no longer energy deficient.

    With the above in mind, if you eat like clockwork every evening at 1:00 PM. Your are spending approximately 20 hours in the post absorptive state. Now, lets consider the eating window concept of IF and the 16/8 split. If you are typical, you will break your fast at the beginning of the 8 hour window, otherwise, you would call it a 17/7 or a 18/6 split, or whatever, to reflect when you actually began eating. So, you eat at the beginning of your window, within 5 hours or so, you begin to transition to the post-absorptive phase, you experience a momentary dip in blood glucose, and you get hungry, so, about 7 hours into your eating window, you eat again, initiating another 5 hour absorptive phase, which will terminate about 12 hours after you broke your fast. The result of this is that you will spend only 12 hours in the post-absorptive state vs. 19-20 if you were to only eat one large meal in the evening. This represents a 40% reduction in the time you spend oxidizing FFAs as an energy source, and I have no doubt that it would significantly affect the results you see.

    Again, the goal is one large meal, not an eating window.

    -PK
    Found my answer . Lots of pages in this three part series....you need to do a FAQ on your blog for this series . BTW I have visited.

  6. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Found my answer . Lots of pages in this three part series....you need to do a FAQ on your blog for this series . BTW I have visited.

    My head was starting to spin a bit, but I think I followed.... I really enjoy all this info also.
    65lbs gone and counting!!

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  7. #217
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    Thanks pklopp. I too have read your blog. I think that it's great, and your posts. One thing that your blog *could* have, is maybe an index or table of contents? (could that fit in the welcome, or would it make the top post take half the screen?).

    I had fallen naturally into dropping lunch, but reading through I've experimented with dropping breakfast as well this week. Except for one day when I relented and had breakfast (I was stuffed all day, and didn't feel like dinner that night).

    It's a challenge to increase my calories at my evening meal (bananas and cream are my go-to), because as you mentioned, I have found that my stomach has shrunk so it's hard to over stuff it.
    Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

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  8. #218
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    One thing I do miss is my eggs since I've been eating my one meal in the evening....I think my next 24hr break fast will be a dozen egg scramble. Mmmmmmmm.

  9. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by magicmerl View Post
    Thanks pklopp. I too have read your blog. I think that it's great, and your posts. One thing that your blog *could* have, is maybe an index or table of contents? (could that fit in the welcome, or would it make the top post take half the screen?).
    You've pretty much hit upon my pet peeve with all blogs, mine included, and that is the structure / organization and lack thereof. It's not enough to just provide good content, one needs to be able to find it easily.

    Your suggestion is interesting, and I'll definitely think about it. I have yet to hit upon a good way to deal with how to structure the content, but I am on the same page as you. Stay tuned!

    -PK
    My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

    Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

  10. #220
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neckhammer View Post
    Found my answer . Lots of pages in this three part series....you need to do a FAQ on your blog for this series . BTW I have visited.
    Bingo! That's exactly what I would have replied.

    I'm working on putting together a fasting FAQ, so keep checking, and thanks for visiting!

    -PK
    My blog : cogitoergoedo.com

    Interested in Intermittent Fasting? This might help: part 1, part 2, part 3.

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