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Thread: Vegetables - Do We Really Need Them? page 10

  1. #91
    Stabby's Avatar
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    The book Perfect Health Diet says that while some fiber is good because it yields butyrate and good flora, too much increases the need for immune activity - inflammation in the gut, which is bad. There's a goldilocks zone. Sorry I don't know of the reference but I have seen studies where they killed some rats dead with too much fiber and where they improved the health of rats with a little fiber. Sorry I'm too lazy to produce those references. You guys believe me! I'm raccoon Jesus. Holy as hell.
    Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

    Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Owly View Post
    Anyone who's ever consumed too much fibre will tell you exactly how it's bad for you!
    You originally said:
    Quote Originally Posted by Owly View Post
    I think fibre is similar to other things, such as cardio, that are good in moderate quantities but bad at the high levels encouraged by CW.
    I take it you're not being serious any more. I eat at least as much fibre as recommended by CW. Why demonise it?
    Four years Primal with influences from Jaminet & Shanahan and a focus on being anti-inflammatory. Using Primal to treat CVD and prevent stents from blocking free of drugs.

    Eat creatures nose-to-tail (animal, fowl, fish, crustacea, molluscs), a large variety of vegetables (raw, cooked and fermented, including safe starches), dairy (cheese & yoghurt), occasional fruit, cocoa, turmeric & red wine

  3. #93
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    One of the reasons high levels of fiber will make you (ahem) poop is because fiber, particularly the insoluble type, irritates the intestinal tract. Some is good, but too much can create inflammation and damage, as Stabby mentions above. We really don't need to pass a gigantic volume of crap multiple times a day to be healthy. I think we do need some, but I'm pretty skeptical of the idea that we all need to be downing oatmeal and Metamucil or our digestion will grind to a screeching halt.

    A lot of things we need are the same way. Salt is necessary, but too much is bad. Even water can be toxic if you have too much.
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  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by peril View Post
    You originally said:

    I take it you're not being serious any more. I eat at least as much fibre as recommended by CW. Why demonise it?
    I agree.

    I actually suspect that a true paleolithic diet would include more fiber than CW would suggest, not less.

    I've never had a problem with a high fiber diet. In fact I feel much better, cleaner and more healthy.

  5. #95
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  6. #96
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    Read Fiber Menace by Konstantin Monastyrsky to see how and why fiber causes digestive disorders.
    FiberMenace: About the book

    Most of the information is on the web site.

  7. #97
    peril's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adrianag View Post
    Read Fiber Menace by Konstantin Monastyrsky to see how and why fiber causes digestive disorders.
    FiberMenace: About the book

    Most of the information is on the web site.
    Only had a quick look, but there doesn't seem to be a distinction between fibre from vegetables and fibre from grains and legumes
    Four years Primal with influences from Jaminet & Shanahan and a focus on being anti-inflammatory. Using Primal to treat CVD and prevent stents from blocking free of drugs.

    Eat creatures nose-to-tail (animal, fowl, fish, crustacea, molluscs), a large variety of vegetables (raw, cooked and fermented, including safe starches), dairy (cheese & yoghurt), occasional fruit, cocoa, turmeric & red wine

  8. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by captaineight View Post
    Why do you think it is debatable whether fibre is good for us or not?
    Pretty much what everyone else has said. The studies just don't support the need to aggressively promote eating a tonne of fibre every day. However these studies mostly use bran fibre!!! There are populations who eat a large amount of fibre (kitavans) and are healthy. Benefits like Butyrate and feeding gut flora show the need for some.

    I do think there is a range for optimal and from my n=1 experiement somewhere between 15g +/- a few seems to work well for me.
    "My mom made two dishes: Take it or Leave it." -- Stephen Wright, comedian

  9. #99
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    LISTEN TO YOUR BODY. If you need certain nutrients, above and beyond what you're getting from good quality meats/fish/eggs, your body will tell you. If you're craving green things, there's a reason for it. Do you think hunter-gatherers would've listened to anybody else telling them what was good for them? They only had their instincts to go by.

    Perhaps populations in the past may have survived or even thrived exclusively on animal products, but given the lower nutrient density we get in today's animal produce, there is more of an argument for supplementing with some green veggies. And whilst vegetables may not contain the high amounts of vitamins as do meats, maitaining a stable acid/alkali base within the diet is important to prevent minerals and vitamins leaking from where they're needed in the body.

    Great article: 5-a-day fruit and vegetables is a myth claims nutrition expert | Mail Online big up the daily mail!!

  10. #100
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    Each day passes and we are moving more and more away from nature. The environment is less pristine than before. Humans are bombarded with external toxins and poisons that our bodies (most of us) fail to catch up with to eliminate.

    So hell yes we need vegetables and we also need fruit.

    Anyone who thinks we can merely thrive on solely a meat/fat diet is just ignorant.

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