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    aussieluke's Avatar
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    Try telling a bunch of bread makers that gluten is bad (awesome)

    Primal Fuel
    Just stumble across this.

    Someone posted a link to this site and got slammed.

    Gluten bad for you - WTF? | The Fresh Loaf

    "Gluten has been around for a long time, and has been consumed by millions. It's not poison. Dont limit your diet, as removing all gluten foods is extremely limiting, due to fear."


    Sometimes I just wish I could punch the internet in the face!

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    slacker's Avatar
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    Don't feel bad. A couple of my best friends are wheat farmers. =8O

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    I'm pretty sure I just read research scientists are trying to make gluten-free wheat...... Just more confusion for the clueless public.

    What we all need is HERITAGE wheat:
    Heritage Grain Conservancy

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    Did they call it rice?
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    If bakers didn't know about the switch from older wheat to dwarf hybrid wheat, we're in trouble.

    I dunno about gluten free wheat... at least it doesn't have the addictive gliadin unnatural gluten proteins. If all the bread is flat and icky, maybe no one will eat it anyway.
    5'0" female, 43 years old. Started Primal October 31, 2011, at a skinny fat 111.5 lbs. Low weight: 99.5 lb on a fast. Current weight: skinny-fat 106.5 lbs because of sugar cheating.

    MY PRIMAL: I (try to) follow by-the-book primal as advocated by Mark Sisson, except for whey powder and a bit of cream. I aim for 80-90 g carb/day and advocate a two-month strict adjustment for newbies. But everybody is different and other need to tweak Primal to their own needs.

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    Isn't gluten one of those "trust your body" and YMMV things?

    I've eaten gluten-laden bread for decades. I've baked. I've also gone though long periods without gluten (zero wheat of any kind) not because of paleo or anything like that but because I needed cheap food that stored well and cooked without fancy tools. Rice fit the bill, so I ate lots of rice.

    I have never felt ANY evidence that - TO ME - gluten is either harmful or helpful compared to other protein (or anything else in my diet). I'll accept the argument that fresh vegetables are less energy-dense and nutrient-rich, that starches and sugars are metabolized differently or don't provide long term satiety, that my socioeconomic situation is such that cheap bulk foods are now unwise and unneccessary, and so on, but the idea that gluten is somehow especially bad for me? No, it doesn't jive with my personal experience. I don't have any food alergies. There are foods I have never enjoyed (e.g. peanut butter...I didn't like it when I was 6, and I just don't like it now) but I'm not alergic to those foods. I have friends who do have honest food alergies and every time we eat together I'm reminded of how glad I am not to share that affliction.

    I'm not going to say that gluten is great for celiacs or other gluten-sensitive people, any more than walnuts are great for someone with a walnut alergy, but the fact that YOU are alergic to walnuts, or shrimp, or gluten, or whatever, doesn't mean that I am, or that those foods are bad in any way. If you are of a healthy weight (which MANY bread-eaters are) and in otherwise good health (which, again, is true for MANY bread-eaters), and don't have other issues, then enjoy your bread, gluten and all. If you find you have a problem, make changes. Is that wrong?

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    Yup, I think it is wrong. Gluten can wreak havoc on your health regardless of outwardly noticeable symptoms. Also, with second-degree symptoms that you might never realize can be caused or facilitated by gluten. Gut permeability and all that. You could feel fine and wake up with an autoimmune disease tomorrow. Obviously there's not conclusive studies to cite, but plenty of evidence of same exists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Him View Post
    Isn't gluten one of those "trust your body" and YMMV things?

    I've eaten gluten-laden bread for decades. I've baked. I've also gone though long periods without gluten (zero wheat of any kind) not because of paleo or anything like that but because I needed cheap food that stored well and cooked without fancy tools. Rice fit the bill, so I ate lots of rice.

    I have never felt ANY evidence that - TO ME - gluten is either harmful or helpful compared to other protein (or anything else in my diet). I'll accept the argument that fresh vegetables are less energy-dense and nutrient-rich, that starches and sugars are metabolized differently or don't provide long term satiety, that my socioeconomic situation is such that cheap bulk foods are now unwise and unneccessary, and so on, but the idea that gluten is somehow especially bad for me? No, it doesn't jive with my personal experience. I don't have any food alergies. There are foods I have never enjoyed (e.g. peanut butter...I didn't like it when I was 6, and I just don't like it now) but I'm not alergic to those foods. I have friends who do have honest food alergies and every time we eat together I'm reminded of how glad I am not to share that affliction.

    I'm not going to say that gluten is great for celiacs or other gluten-sensitive people, any more than walnuts are great for someone with a walnut alergy, but the fact that YOU are alergic to walnuts, or shrimp, or gluten, or whatever, doesn't mean that I am, or that those foods are bad in any way. If you are of a healthy weight (which MANY bread-eaters are) and in otherwise good health (which, again, is true for MANY bread-eaters), and don't have other issues, then enjoy your bread, gluten and all. If you find you have a problem, make changes. Is that wrong?
    There's a YouTube video floating around here from a science guy talking all about why gluten and gliatin are bad for everyone. It's an interesting view, but he is kind of bouncy and high on caffeine. Never the less he lays it out quite nicely and easily. Gliatin has a way of getting past the defense mechanism in your gut and making micro-tears all over your insides = not good. Plus it messes with your immune response system. I don't remember all the details off hand, but it was enough to convince me.

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    Him's Avatar
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    Obviously there's not conclusive studies to cite, but plenty of evidence of same exists.
    Obviously I could be struck by a meteor tonight as I sleep. That's a controllable risk, too. With minor lifestyle changes (moving into a salt mine for example) I could severely reduce the impact of such an impact. Is it worth doing?

    It's a matter of odds. If the odds of being struck by a meteor were 1:1, then yes by all means let's move underground. 1:100... again, probably a good idea to take some preventive steps. 1:1000? It would be smart. 1:10,000? It's not crazy. 1:100,000? Eh.1:1,000,000? No, the risks involved in taking action are probably higher than the risks you are avoiding. 1:1,000,000,000? Now that would be crazy.

    So what are the odds of waking up with a gluten-induced autoimmune disease tomorrow? I know a few people with autoimmune diseases so it could happen...but at least two of them tried gluten free and it didn't help so you can't automatically blame gluten anyway.

    It's like lactose intolerance. You may be lactose intolerant. Avoiding dairy may be very important for you. That doesn't mean dairy is a problem for me.

    As for micro-tears and the like... that's interesting. I'd find it more compelling if I had experienced any symptoms myself, but I'll accept it as somewhat of a theoretical basis (assuming it isn't pseudoscientific BS like a lot of the anti-salt, anti-fat, anti-meat, anti-whatever-I-don't-like ranting).
    Last edited by Him; 12-07-2012 at 11:54 AM.

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