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  1. #4381
    NorthernMonkeyGirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justyouraveragecavemen View Post
    Is there something going on in his life that you might be jumping to a conclusion about this? Not downplaying it at all, but sometimes I say stuff that comes out of my mouth wrong. But I'm with Canio, I wouldn't ignore it.
    I would agree here, sometimes "everything" might mean, I dunno, the current stressful situation, the job hunting.... (I don't know your particular situations, but you see what I'm getting at?)
    I also agree he needs a bit of extra help right now, try to stick out today (can you ring him from work?) so you can be there with him tomorrow.
    Good luck

  2. #4382
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    Quote Originally Posted by billp View Post
    Most places have no treaty as taxes as so much lower it just isn't worth it. I can assure you that the US is almost unique in demanding non-resident citizens pay tax. That is most definitely not the norm in the rest of the world and is regarded as ridiculous and unenforceable.
    That's because of tax treaties. United States Income Tax Treaties - A to Z Tax treaty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  3. #4383
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saoirse View Post
    billp, having spent the last 8 years of my life as a stay-at-home mom, that is really shitty advice you've given
    Did you read what I actually said, or are you just leaping on the bandwaggon? If you did read it, and Naid's comment I replied to, why is it such terrible advice? You would have thought I had brought a pork chop into a mosque from the reactions.

  4. #4384
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    Quote Originally Posted by billp View Post
    Depends on how you define "responsible". I don't consider accepting a lifetime of debt slavery and broken dreams to be a responsible choice.

    Anyway, these days we have the Internet and Skype, and long haul jetliners. You don't need to lose touch with your old friends and family. In fact, with Facebook and visits that tends to carry on much as before. And summing up motherhood as "popping out some brats" hardly covers the full joys of parenthood. Would your own mother describe your childhood in those terms? I doubt it. Children are far more fun than any job or hobby, in fact them make all the other stuff look very pale. Parenthood is very fulfilling. Do you think I would hold down a job at all if I didn't need to? Of course not, but a man doesn't have the same choices.
    Of course parenthood is fulfilling. Else no one would do it. But it's damn hard to do and do well.
    However, either your true opinion or your tone of voice implied that *all* women would do better being housewife than "fighting through the corporate structure". I know women born to be mothers, and that's fine. I also know women who couldn't think of anything worse, and for some reason society - with "advice" like yours - really shits on them. That ain't on.

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  5. #4385
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernMonkeyGirl View Post
    I would agree here, sometimes "everything" might mean, I dunno, the current stressful situation, the job hunting.... (I don't know your particular situations, but you see what I'm getting at?)
    I also agree he needs a bit of extra help right now, try to stick out today (can you ring him from work?) so you can be there with him tomorrow.
    Good luck
    Long vent session in my journal, but in short, he's been injured since November, recovering from the surgery since January, still in a lot of pain, getting sick periodically, it all adds up to him missing classes, and then getting depressed & missing more classes because of all of the above. It's the usual vicious cycle. I've known he's been depressed for a while now, but after what he said last night and the way he's been behaving lately, it's worse than I thought. I just don't know objectively "how bad" it is because I've been there too much and I know how painful it is.

    I'm going to call him around noon when the last alarm goes off, check in, see what I can do. See if he might consider going to a counselor tomorrow, and if he feels like he needs me to go with him. Whatever I do, I'm trying really hard not to say or do anything or ask anything of him that might make me feel more useless and depressed.
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  6. #4386
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    Quote Originally Posted by billp View Post
    Did you read what I actually said, or are you just leaping on the bandwaggon? If you did read it, and Naid's comment I replied to, why is it such terrible advice? You would have thought I had brought a pork chop into a mosque from the reactions.
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  7. #4387
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    Quote Originally Posted by billp View Post
    Did you read what I actually said, or are you just leaping on the bandwaggon? If you did read it, and Naid's comment I replied to, why is it such terrible advice? You would have thought I had brought a pork chop into a mosque from the reactions.
    I read both what you wrote and what she wrote. it's terrible advice because she clearly wants to be in the workforce. basically, you're telling her to just give up and have kids. meanwhile, she likely has student loan debts (and her husband likely does too). you can't support a household and two student loan burdens on one income, or at least it's highly abnormal to be able to. and don't give me that "live simply crap." we do, and we also have to endure a long-distance relationship just to make it work financially on one income; and even with our tight budgeting the grocery $$ always runs out a week before the next paycheck. meanwhile, if my husband died or lost his job, we would have to go on state aid because i have no marketable job skills.

    and actually, men do have the same option if their wives are willing to work and can make the same or better income. my FIL basically is a "house husband;" he does a little work from home (environmental engineer) and spends the rest of his time working on housing projects. my MIL works full-time outside of the home.

    as far as the "joys of parenthood" go, sure it's really rewarding. as dull as i've found it, i still wouldn't go back and change my mind. but, the rewards are quite different. different skills are needed for staying at home. you need patience, the ability to function well emotionally on little to no sleep, and a lot of self-discipline. you don't "need" a high IQ or specialized skills to do what i do. so for those of us who gain a sense of identity from our intellects being needed, it can be a little demoralizing. and that's under ideal scenarios of a happy marriage. throw a little marital instability in there, and you can have a really difficult situation for a woman to be in.
    Last edited by Saoirse; 04-12-2012 at 08:23 AM.

  8. #4388
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthernMonkeyGirl View Post
    Of course parenthood is fulfilling. Else no one would do it. But it's damn hard to do and do well.
    However, either your true opinion or your tone of voice implied that *all* women would do better being housewife than "fighting through the corporate structure". I know women born to be mothers, and that's fine. I also know women who couldn't think of anything worse, and for some reason society - with "advice" like yours - really shits on them. That ain't on.
    Not all women. But "nearly all happily married women in their twenties without children who are dissatisfied with their job or can't find one they like" should definitely consider starting a family and maybe that is why they feel dissatisfied. We are all human beings first, and that matters a lot more than most people realise.

    In general, I think there is a bit of a dichotomy on this forum. Everyone is quite certain than modern grains, soy, seed oils etc. are all against our natures as human beings, and we should all get outside and play and hunt more. Fine, I agree. But almost no one see that this is likely to go rather further. The weird discussion about primal birth control. And you get people complaining that eating like this *increases* their sex drive (it does).

    Nature: We are *in* nature now. Well fed healthy humans, with plentiful meat, animal fats and nutritious veg, will inevitable want to have more children than before. This is part of who we are as animals, and is an evolutionary response to plenty. This is going to mean some large families, and that's fine, its a good thing. And yes, for well fed happily married women in their twenties and thirties, avoiding having children is likely to have negative consequences. Inevitably.

    Believe me, the corporate world is not all its cracked up to be. There is nothing special about having a job. I don't really think anyone should be working in front of a computer doing repetitive, boring and irrelevant things all day, just because its a "job". I am actively trying to make myself independent, and I am not going to recommend to to people who have perfectly valid alternatives that would be much more fun that they stick it out just because that's what society says is "right" at the moment.

    Degrees, qualifications, jobs, are all ultimately meaningless. What country you live in is meaningless too, along with ludicrous tax laws. Other things, like good food, happiness, family and children are not meaningless at all, and one can make a huge difference to ones overall pleasure in life by recognising this.

  9. #4389
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    Quote Originally Posted by billp View Post
    Did you read what I actually said, or are you just leaping on the bandwaggon? If you did read it, and Naid's comment I replied to, why is it such terrible advice? You would have thought I had brought a pork chop into a mosque from the reactions.
    The ONLY problem that "have children" should be a solution for is "I want children." That's it. The only one. "I'm having career trouble/boredom" is right up there with "The neighbors all have them" for lousy reasons to have them. I realize that YOU don't see overpopulation as a problem, but a lot of us do, which means that we need to think twice about adding to the problem. Beyond that, a woman is more than a walking uterus. Just because she CAN have children doesn't mean she SHOULD or that she should even want to. She WANTS to have a career. Therefore, she should put her efforts in that direction, yes?
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  10. #4390
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    Quote Originally Posted by billp View Post
    Not all women. But "nearly all happily married women in their twenties without children who are dissatisfied with their job or can't find one they like" should definitely consider starting a family and maybe that is why they feel dissatisfied. We are all human beings first, and that matters a lot more than most people realise.

    In general, I think there is a bit of a dichotomy on this forum. Everyone is quite certain than modern grains, soy, seed oils etc. are all against our natures as human beings, and we should all get outside and play and hunt more. Fine, I agree. But almost no one see that this is likely to go rather further. The weird discussion about primal birth control. And you get people complaining that eating like this *increases* their sex drive (it does).

    Nature: We are *in* nature now. Well fed healthy humans, with plentiful meat, animal fats and nutritious veg, will inevitable want to have more children than before. This is part of who we are as animals, and is an evolutionary response to plenty. This is going to mean some large families, and that's fine, its a good thing. And yes, for well fed happily married women in their twenties and thirties, avoiding having children is likely to have negative consequences. Inevitably.

    Believe me, the corporate world is not all its cracked up to be. There is nothing special about having a job. I don't really think anyone should be working in front of a computer doing repetitive, boring and irrelevant things all day, just because its a "job". I am actively trying to make myself independent, and I am not going to recommend to to people who have perfectly valid alternatives that would be much more fun that they stick it out just because that's what society says is "right" at the moment.

    Degrees, qualifications, jobs, are all ultimately meaningless. What country you live in is meaningless too, along with ludicrous tax laws. Other things, like good food, happiness, family and children are not meaningless at all, and one can make a huge difference to ones overall pleasure in life by recognising this.
    you're completely ignoring the fact that a woman (or a man) staying at home and raising her kids IS NOT primal. in "primal days," life was more egalitarian and men and women both worked. kids were watched by their parents, neighbors, grandparents, other extended family members, older siblings, etc. the burden did not fall on one person's shoulders. kids were welcome almost anywhere in society, so if a caretaker was feeling lonely, s/he could go almost anywhere with the kids to find company. my company is confined to "kid-safe areas" such as libraries, parks, and other women's houses. victorian society created a highly artificial social life for stay-at-home parents.

    you're also taking "primal" a little too far. maybe you should stop driving and using technology.

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