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    brahnamin's Avatar
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    Big Fat Leangains

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    So, I'm a wee bit familiar with Martin's methods and protocols and I've had decent success with IF (I have always prefered the 16/8 breakdown), but I'm a little leery on including carby refeeds right now because I still have a substantial amount of weight to lose and I am a diabetic still showing fasting numbers over 100 and likely still sporting a fair amount of insulin resistance (though there is also a good bit of evidence that that is clearing up nicely).

    I'm pretty well convinced that diet is a good deal more important than exercise when it comes to fat loss, but I also want to build strength (not necessarily bulk) and am intending to increase both the effectiveness and frequency of my workouts (focusing more on strength training than conditioning).

    I already do squats, lunges, push ups, and Australian pull ups and I plan to incorporate dead lifts again as well (primal style log deadlifts - thanks for the tips, fitness-forum groks!). To start I'm planning on 2 days a week, with a third day for conditioning workouts with my K-bells just because they're fun.

    Anyone have an opinion on the refeeds - particularly how they might affect a recovering diabetic?

  2. #2
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    Ex morbidly obese diabetic here. Now at 10% body fat and no meds whatsoever for anything. Took >2 years to get here.

    When I first started, I did once a week "refeeds". Ate whatever I wanted on Sundays. Didn't get me anywhere. Sure I lost fat, but stalled in a few months.

    Cut out the refeeds and really bumped up the intensity of my workouts. Body fat really started to melt off. Fasting BG is around 70 now. And post prandial BG is never over 100 (I eat clean).

    I would say forget about the refeeds until you're near the level of leaness you want to be at. Then play around with it. You may find the refeeds totally unnecessary or detrimental. I exercise fasted, always. And I exercise hard. No issues after your body adapts to using fat more than glucose.

    My definition of a refeed now is simply eating more than usual (way over my caloric requirements) but still low carb. Never any sugar/fake sugar or processed carbs. At most ONE small sweet potato or some good cheese. Other than that, I eat way more ribeye or fatty fish than I usually do.

    This way, I feel completely satisfied without getting fat and all the bad stuff that comes with being fat.

  4. #4
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    "I would say forget about the refeeds until you're near the level of leaness you want to be at. Then play around with it. You may find the refeeds totally unnecessary or detrimental. I exercise fasted, always. And I exercise hard. No issues after your body adapts to using fat more than glucose."
    I'm sorry chickenblade, but that is just plain wrong. If you are restricting calories, your body will use fat for fuel, not glucose.

    Here's what you need brahnamin:
    The Leangains Guide
    And definitely:
    Fitday Calculate your calorie intake by multiplying your dodyweight in lbs. by 14, to lose subtract 500 from that on rest days
    "I'm pretty well convinced that diet is a good deal more important than exercise when it comes to fat loss, but I also want to build strength (not necessarily bulk) and am intending to increase both the effectiveness and frequency of my workouts (focusing more on strength training than conditioning)." Just read:
    Workout approach

    As for this little gem "...I'm a little leery on including carby refeeds right now because I still have a substantial amount of weight to lose..." While your history with diabetes will require some experimentation or even elimination with post-workout carbs, I'll ask you now wrt weight loss and refeeds, are you blind or just plain stupid?

    You're welcome.
    Last edited by enriquegp; 02-16-2011 at 04:34 PM.

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    Primalvore's Avatar
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    Hey brahnamin,

    I've been experimenting with Leangains for about a month now, and I had one of my first real "refeeds" today. You know much more about your diabetes than I do, and though I do have some small problems with insulin (dang PCOS) anyone is free to nullify my advice if it puts you at risk!

    Personally, I'm starting with refeeds once a week and seeing how it goes. As a carb-phobic person, this might be more for my mental well being than for physical reasons.

    I usually take in about 50 g carbs a day. Today I doubled that by adding a sweet potato at lunch. That's about it. And that's pretty much as far as I'm going to push it. I also kept fat relatively low today. I'm hoping this works well.

    The only thing that I can tell you for sure is something that's been mentioned and that you probably already know: don't go about this by doing a "refeed" day where you cheat and have whatever you want. This is what I used to do, and like chickenbackside it always backfired on me. Go with a small sweet potato, or a little winter squash, and eat it closest to your workout time (when are you working out, by the way?)

    And if you're not, read Leangains like it's your job. It can be hard to muddle through because I don't think the sitemap is that great or the progress is very logical, but it will all come together soon.

    I'm blogging daily about my Leangains experience, so if you want to learn from my mistakes or add some insight feel free

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    Dragonfly's Avatar
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    My understanding is that refeeds are only for dropping the last few percentages of body fat, assuming you have been eating VLC for awhile.

  7. #7
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    yeah im having trouble understand leangains too. Basiclly you eat low carbs high fat on rest days, high(er) carb low fat on workout days, right?

    Thats what I did this week. On workout days I (eating primal) ate more carbs and little fat (had 3 sweet potatoes, fruit and stuff. Very low fat.

    thats the main principle right? besides the 16/8 fasting which i get.

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    MalPaz's Avatar
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    his whole process is based more on calories in and out then it is on carbs. theres never high fat....its always HIGH protein(like upwards of 2g/lb) and more carbs when you workout less whenyou dont. fat isnt ever high, but always as low as possible on lifting days...with occassional refeeds on calories, but it really takes a LEAN body and the perfect timing to do it right. im lean and i wouldnt even think of a refeed

  9. #9
    brahnamin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by enriquegp View Post
    are you blind or just plain stupid?
    I'm going to go out on a limb and say I am neither.

    What I am is new to the Leangains approach and as it happens I am familiar with all the links you included in your post. (In fact, it was Richard's latest posts on his Leangain experiences that sent me back over to Martin's site after a year).

    What I want to know is how this approach might affect an extremely overweight diabetic. See, THIS is the biggest before-picture-guy in the Client Update post. And THIS is me. (I'm the one in the glasses).

    I don't question whether Leangains gets results. It plainly does. I question if it's anything I should be messing with at this juncture or if it's something I should put off until I've slimmed down a bit. In particular I was wondering if anyone knew (or had experience with) how it might affect a diabetic with numbers in the range I listed.
    Last edited by brahnamin; 02-16-2011 at 08:45 PM. Reason: to remove snarkiness.

  10. #10
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    I was somewhere between you and the biggest leangains client. BUT, being 5ft 8" short, you can guess I looked worse.

    If you still have some ways to go, I'd say this is just background noise. Just concentrate on eating only real unprocessed food, cutting out all sugar, dairy, nuts and fruit (except a moderate amount of berries). Drink only water or unsweetened coffee/tea. Exercise hard but short. Sleep as well as you possibly can. Get as much sun as you can without burning. Don't stress the small things in life.

    If you can already see a 4-pack on your abs and want to work towards a 6-pack, then implementing an IF lifestyle, playing with refeeds, tweaking your exercise program for specific goals...etc would then make more sense.
    Last edited by chickenbackside; 02-16-2011 at 09:30 PM.

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