The people you love to hate page 3

[Tarlach]

[quote]

Tarlach, Mark certainly doesn't eat the way you describe and I would say he has gotten pretty fantastic results despite your statement that no one who eats like that will get results as good as you . </blockquote>


My point was that someone who commit 100% will get better results than if they commit 80%, not that 80% is of little value.


80% will get you as good as Mark has done and that is better than 95% of the population is experiencing.

[musajen]

dalvarez - I'll wait for the documentary, it's due out shortly.


What I hate is the weight watchers points system. It turns usually intelligent people (mostly women) into fat and protein haters.


What can possibly be good about choosing a weight watcher 2 pt snack bar (i.e. sugar) over nuts and berries or an avocado.


I'm surrounded by this at work and have to really hold my tongue when someone passes up the meat and cheease tray and reaches for the high-fiber crackers instead because it's "fewer points."


Doh!

[Tarlach]

They are trying to start a Weight Watchers at Work program in my office (trying to get all of the overweight people to join in).


I just cringe when I think of it...

[SerialSinner]

I agree with Tarlach on that any consistent deviation from a primal diet could perfectly be the cause of chronic illnesses. Research seems to confirm this more and more. So at the end it depends on how much of a "health-nut" one really is.


To me, it's like buying a home theater sound system. It's cheap to go from a crappy to a decent one, it's expensive to go from a decent to a premium one, and it's extremely expensive to go from a premium one to the state-of-the-art.


Sometimes it's not worth to pay for upgrades we won't notice or at the cost of living in a shack. The question is where do we stop upgrading.


Tarlach have you found any peer-reviewed papers mentioning nightshades as a probable *cause* for arthritis? I am starting to worry.

[Tarlach]

Nothing at hand, mostly just anecdotal evidence from people who have stopped eating them.


Once I found that nightshades were new age foods,I stopped eating them and didn't spend a lot of time researching more.


I would be interested if anyone did find some scientific evidence (either way) though...

[Nick]

Here's a study looking at the effects of solanine on intestinal epithelial cells:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17973450

Many nightshades contain solanine, particularly the deadly ones, but also potatoes and tomatoes. The above study may tell you why traditional Chinese medicine uses solanine-containing extract to treat digestive cancers. In fact, it's effective against many types of cancer cell:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16029012

Over in the Netherlands, where they aren't quite so beholden to any agricultural interests (except tulips and weed), we get studies like this one:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15649828

For those of you not up on your poisons and toxicity, acetylcholinesterase inhibition is the same effect you get from organophosphate nerve gases like VX and Serin, and pesticides like diazinon. We also get one of our antidotes, atropine, from the nightshades, incidentally.

It's also kind of shocking how little the multiple is between the amount of solanine normally consumed and what's required for a toxic dose:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19286450

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18614268

Frying green tomatoes, for instance, only reduces solanine by about 50%, so you if you eat a couple of pounds of fried green tomatoes, you could die, or at least do some serious damage to your gut.


That solanine kills cancer cells is all well and good, and if I ever have cancer maybe I'll look into it as a form of chemo (Vitamin D is probably a better idea). However, if you note in the study it also killed plenty of non-cancerous cells, and the other studies in epithelial cells tell us it messes around significantly with Bcl2-family pro-apoptotic proteins, and therefore the same capability to nuke colon cancer may mean it kills a healthy person's intestinal lining in some proportion. Once absorbed into the bloodstream, it will probably also do the same thing to any tissue it comes in contact with.


I don't want to give up my tomatoes and hot peppers as much as anyone, but Tarlach's definitely not just crying wolf about nightshades.

[deepthought]

Tarlach: Why dont you suggest an "alternative" program, and have your group beat the WW program? THAT would be an interresting project, to se who can loose wheight and feel good at the same time(and stay on their new wheight)!

[Grumpycakes]

Just to play Devil's Advocate, what if hating isn't primal? In my imagination, back in Grok's day, we all had to live and work harmoniously in our own little bands or die. Outside stresses like a rival band or predatory animals or harsh weather were clear-cut and could be dealt with directly one way or another. I think we humans begin to "hate" when we can't effectively deal with sources of stress, like loud neighbors or annoying bosses or jobs we'd much rather not be doing.

[ahhgrr]

@Primalchild, having trained as a historian (a zillion years ago), I can pretty confidently say that hate, dislike, etc., all seems to be pretty well ingrained in human society from time immemorial.


Animals don't all get along, why should we?


That said, I try not to "hate" people so much, as that in itself raises stress levels. I do get annoyed with a vast number of things, though.


And re: nightshades -- I've seen a lot of the anti-nightshade stuff as well, and find it all rather depressing since I love tomatoes and peppers. My path is to not eat them quite as often as I'd like at the moment.

[Daniel Doiron]

Comment on original post:

'' I'm thoroughly convinced that eating primal is great for me. I look good - I feel good.

But there's this little part of me that gets super irritated/jealous of the two girls in my office who load up on Starbucks, Diet Coke, Gummy Bears and tofu burgers and yet manage to stay super slim. Is there a PB explanation for these types? ''


I am sure if you would take a nice big 'pinch' of those triceps (if female) or belly (if male), you will soon find that they are not SLIM, but SMALL ... VERY IMPORTANT DIFFERENCE HERE!

Take out the muscle, add a little fat...you've still got a 'small' person, but not slim !!