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    pucca's Avatar
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    japanese and white rice

    this is a question i've been wanting to ask all the "no grain, grains are bad for you" people. the japanese have the longest life expectancy, they are thin and healthy, and they eat white rice everyday. usually with every meal. i've been to japan many times, and you just don't see fat/overweight people there. the same with koreans - my parents live there. koreans eat sooooooo much rice, and the ones who have managed to avoid the processed western food/fast food are pretty healthy looking. my mom is underweight (5'1" and about 90 lbs on a good day) and she's been eating rice 3x a day for her whole life. what's the deal????????????

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    White rice has had all the phytotoxins removed and is, essentialy, just starch. Mark writes about it here.

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    Gimme some meat protein please, Asians might be trim and lean but I do not want my kids to grow to 5'3"...I want my kids at 6'

    BTW, my folks fed me carbs and sugars growing up...my dad and uncles are 5'11" or so...I am the runt.
    Primal/Paleo is not for everyone, it's for those who have committed to understand.
    READ THE BOOK! ...as Robb Wolf says: "Trying to convince people to save their own ass will burn you out."

    Vegetarians are the enemy of everything good and decent in the human spirit, and an affront to all I stand for -- the pure enjoyment of food.” Anthony Bourdain

    and yes, calories DO count my little piggies

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    Quote Originally Posted by pucca View Post
    the japanese have the longest life expectancy, they are thin and healthy, and they eat white rice everyday.
    They are slender, yes. Healthy? Not really. They are constantly tired and catching colds. Granted, a lot of that has to do with their self-sacrificing work ethic. They may have little body fat, but they also don't have much lean tissue, either. You'll find that the ones that are truly healthy and strong are the ones who eat a larger proportion of meat.

    As for the longevity argument, yeah, they do live longer, but I would rather cash out at 70 than live another 20 years as a decrepit, bent old bag of Japanese bones. Go to rural Japan and take a look at the old folks there. More osteoporosis and other bone disfiguration than you see in third-world countries.
    You lousy kids! Get off my savannah!

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    Interestingly, there are at last report about a quarter-million fewer old people in Japan than previously thought.
    http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2010/08..._have_any.html
    "Trust me, you will soon enter a magical land full of delicious steakflowers, with butterbacons fluttering around over the extremely rompable grass and hillsides."

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    They are short. They eat at a bare sustinence level which allows them to stay thin.

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    Mark's take on rice: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/is-rice-unhealthy/

    From the post:
    White Rice
    Mostly neutral. A 100g dose (raw) contains:

    80 g carb
    1 g fiber
    0.6 g fat
    7 g protein
    0.07 mg thiamin
    1.6 g niacin
    0.8 mg iron
    25 mg magnesium
    Pretty meager, right? Not many nutrients, pretty high in starchy carbs – eating white rice and nothing but will lead to nutritional deficiencies fast, but not because white rice is leeching nutrients from you. It’s simply a matter of displacement. White rice replaces other, more nutritious foods, and in some cases, it acts as a vehicle for negative foods, like rancid oils and sugar.

    <snip>

    It’s not black and white. Rice exists on one end of the “grain suitability” continuum. You know how I’ve discussed the dairy continuum? Raw, grass-fed one on end and low-fat, homogenized, ultra-pasteurized on the other. It’s the same for grains. High-gluten wheat on one (very bad) end and rice on the other (don’t lose sleep if you eat it) end. Do I recommend ditching the entire group altogether, just to make things easy and avoid any possible irritants? Sure, but if grain consumption presents itself, or you literally are hamstrung by finances and simply need some calories, you shouldn’t beat yourself up over it just because you ate some white rice.

    Rice can even be a vehicle for the good stuff – for butter, ghee, coconut. It can also be a vehicle for the bad stuff – for vegetable oils, for sugar. In fact, it’s the essential neutrality of rice that makes it what it is. The problem with rice in most people’s diets is twofold: it serves as a vehicle for processed fat and sugar; and overweight, insulin-resistant folks with damaged metabolisms can’t handle the glucose load.

    Rice fried in rancid corn oil? Avoid.
    Rice fried in homemade ghee? Not so bad, necessarily.
    Rice if you’re trying to lose weight? Avoid.
    Rice if you’re lean and active? Not so bad, necessarily.

    The Asian Paradox
    This probably deserves a full post, but I’ll briefly discuss it here. I’m not going to sit here and claim that Asians don’t actually eat rice. They do. And they have for centuries while maintaining pretty good health and staying fairly lean. That’s changing nowadays, though, with the Westernization of their food. They’re eating more sugar and using vegetable oils for cooking, rather than traditional animal fats. These factors are deranging their metabolisms, turning the relatively benign rice starch into an enemy. It just suggests that carbs, in and of themselves, are benign in a metabolic vacuum. If you have everything else going right – insulin sensitivity, regular activity, absence of metabolic deranging foods like fructose, lectins, and excessive linoleic acid – pure starchy carbs aren’t going to be a big problem. But, especially in the States, we live in anything but a nutritional vacuum. We aren’t starting from ground zero. The overweight perimenopausal wife and mother of three working 50 hours a week is not starting from square one. She has an issue with glucose, one that might not be cured in a lifetime. For a person like that, avoidance of rice is recommended and probably necessary.

    We have to face facts. Deranged has become normal. Glucose intolerance – or perhaps “mishandling” is better – has become standard. Where rice belongs in your life depends on where you fall on the metabolic derangement continuum.
    There is a thread discussing the Perfect Health Diet (a paleo/primal diet + starchy carbs) which also talks about white rice. http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum...ct-Health-Diet

    White rice is basically a starchy carb with little/no nutrients--BUT the antinutrients/phytates etc. typically found in whole grains have been stripped so its easier to digest, and it is also gluten free which is VERY important. It's basically a starchy filler, and for *some*, does not cause harm. For others (those w/ metabolic syndrome, those trying to lose weight, etc.) it can wreak havoc. (There are WAY more folks in the West dealing w/ metabolic syndrome than the East, I believe, which matters in all this.) I think it depends on YOU whether or not it works for you. It is NOT primal, but probably, from what I've read, the best of all the grains if you're going to eat it.

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    pucca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    White rice has had all the phytotoxins removed and is, essentialy, just starch. Mark writes about it here.
    btw, the phytates and enzyme inhibitors in grains, beans and nuts (yes, nuts have a lot of phytates too, AND enzyme inhibitors) can be mostly eliminated by soaking. which is why i try to always soak my nuts, and when i eat grains and beans, which is rarely, i always soak them before cooking. i wonder why mark only talks about the phytates in grains but not in nuts? or has he talked about soaking nuts and i've just missed it?

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    What about Spanish and Hispanic? Just about daily rice eaters too. What statistics are there about those fine folk?

    They seem to be fairly robust and healthy. Last I heard, Puerto Ricans had a longer life expectancy than continental USA er's. Also, recently, Mercola had a report that Hispanics had greater life expectancy than other non-hispanic Americans. Remember that hispanics share a culture but include many races and combinations of those races.

    I don't remember too many people with bone problems in Spain or the Canary Islands. Nor in the Caribbean or any of the South and Central American countries I have visited.

    Anyone have hard facts about those rice eaters?
    Tayatha om bekandze

    Bekandze maha bekandze

    Randza samu gate soha

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