Massive volcano wiped out Neanderthals page 2

[Bushrat]

LOL. There is evidence to support the interbreeding of Early Humans and Neanderthals. So, uh, case in point. Good at ****ing.

::edit:: Here is a link: http://www.sciencenews.org/view/gene...ng_with_humans

I'm mean, we all know a few people who look like they are "de-evolving" the species. It's definitely plausible. Go to Walmart on any given Friday night.

What's to say, logically, that some of the recessive genes from Northern Europeans like blond and red hair, blue and green eyes, and lighter skin didn't come from interbreeding with the predominantly northern Neanderthals? We have human mummies, but not Neanderthal. We have no accurate picture of what they looked like.

Imagine telling a die hard aryan brotherhood neo-nazi they got their blue eyes and blond hair from the Neanderthal race.

No Clan of the Cave Bear There

I read somewhere that the Neanderthals were superior to humans in terms of achievements (arts and crafts) but that we killed and bred them out of existence.

I've also heard that Neanderthals were redheads and they were in America, before the Native Americas and Aztecs, who killed them off. These redheads also traded with the Chinese 1500 years before the Silk road opened up and there are some buried in the Han province. Also, the Neanderthal build was stouter and stronger than humans, but not taller. The typical caveman (big and brutish) was in fact Cro Magnon or one of the other extinct races further back.

[bUMbLeB]

I read somewhere that the Neanderthals were superior to humans in terms of achievements (arts and crafts) but that we killed and bred them out of existence.

I've also heard that Neanderthals were redheads and they were in America, before the Native Americas and Aztecs, who killed them off. These redheads also traded with the Chinese 1500 years before the Silk road opened up and there are some buried in the Han province. Also, the Neanderthal build was stouter and stronger than humans, but not taller. The typical caveman (big and brutish) was in fact Cro Magnon or one of the other extinct races further back.

While both neanderthals and modern humans appear to have started off with the same toolkit and technology, the evidence seems to show that our ancestors progressed more rapidly during their shared time together, developing ever more intricate and specialized tools, while the neanderthals persisted with the older, generalized tech until much later. Intriguingly, there is some indication that, near the end of their existence, the neanderthals did begin to adopt modern innovations, but of course we can't know if they were doing this with full awareness, or simply copying what they saw the new neighbours doing. At any rate, there's certainly no comparison between the two in terms of art (there's a higly hypothetical neanderthal "flute", but that could just be a bear's chewtoy - and I think there's one or two artifacts that hint at symbolic expression, but it's a long way from cave art).

It's true that they're suspected to have been largely redheads, unlikely that they were ever in the Americas, and almost certain that they didn't trade with anyone resembling the Chinese (unless you buy into the legend of the "Almas" - and even then...). They were shorter than us, but far stronger, and I'm pretty sure in a fair fight they would have made short work of us. It's possible their locomotion was less efficient, which can be critical in a chaotic ecosystem (as it then was), but mostly they seem to have been more intellectually conservative, and less likely to experiment. I'm sure if one was here now he'd have plenty to say about my summation, but he'd probably still be banging away on a TI-99/a, furrowing his brow in a mixture of frustration and genetic predisposition.

[shemdogg]

http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/sh...-kill-off.html

[Sam Cree]

From Wiki:

Cro-Magnon were anatomically modern, straight limbed and tall compared to the contemporary Neanderthals. Physically they only differ from their modern day descendants in Europe by being on average taller, having a more robust physique and a slightly larger cranial capacity.[20] The Cro-Magnons had long, fairly low skulls, with a wide face, a prominent nose and moderate to no prognathism, similar to features seen in modern Europeans.[21] A very distinct trait is the rectangular orbits.[22] Several works on genetics, blood types and cranial morphology indicate that the Basque people may be the descendents of the original Cro-Magnon population.[23]

Cro Magnon men were paleolithic Europeans, or "Groks." I don't think they went extinct at all, many of us are likely descended from them, and others. As well as being descended from Neanderthals. Interesting about the Cro Magnon being taller and having larger brains than modern man. Maybe they got that from following the PB, which theoretically they did.

[periquin]

About the comment that Homo Neanderthal Sapiens possibly had less efficient locomotion than Home Sapiens Sapiens-------Recent genetic mapping that discovered probable Neanderthal genes in our current gene pools led to other research that shows that the more Neanderthal genes a person has the greater is their talent for music, dance, and gymnastics. Seems to imply an ability to move more efficiently and with more grace and style.

[queen_sheba]

About the comment that Homo Neanderthal Sapiens possibly had less efficient locomotion than Home Sapiens Sapiens-------Recent genetic mapping that discovered probable Neanderthal genes in our current gene pools led to other research that shows that the more Neanderthal genes a person has the greater is their talent for music, dance, and gymnastics. Seems to imply an ability to move more efficiently and with more grace and style.

HA!

I never got ANY then

[bUMbLeB]

About the comment that Homo Neanderthal Sapiens possibly had less efficient locomotion than Home Sapiens Sapiens-------Recent genetic mapping that discovered probable Neanderthal genes in our current gene pools led to other research that shows that the more Neanderthal genes a person has the greater is their talent for music, dance, and gymnastics. Seems to imply an ability to move more efficiently and with more grace and style.

I hadn't heard this, and I'm honestly a little skeptical that these genes (which I believe were identified only earlier this year) have been mapped onto modern populations and correlated with traits like musical ability. That said, it's certainly not impossible. When I spoke of "efficiency", I meant the narrow sense of caloric expenditure - the human bipedal gait is not very fast compared to quadrupeds, and we're more at risk of tripping and hurting ourselves, but it requires very little energy to walk (not run) long distances. Chimps and bonobos can and do walk upright for short distances, but their different joints, limbs and muscles mean they burn far more energy to cover the same distance compared to humans. So I don't think it implies that neanderthals would have been less graceful or more clumsy, just that they'd have to burn (and thus consume) more calories to get around. Depending on your environment, this could be an important factor.

Of course I don't remember where I read that, and I don't insist that it's true, just wanted to clear up the bit about efficiency.

[Dan Rivera]

A quip from national geographic channel mentioned that the sheer amount of calories required for a neanderthal for day to day activities could have been extremely detrimental to them. Ice cold temps, extreme physicality in hunting, etc. etc. Their estimate was around 7,000-10,000 or some retarded Tour De France number like that.
So if food gets a little bit scarce, what happens? Skinny emo neanderthals who listen to bad music and just don't see the point anymore.
The more I learn about our evolution, the more it becomes clear to me that the ONLY reason we are still here is because
1. We are good at ****ing
2. We are good at getting fat.

[Katt]

The volcanic activity would have changed the climate, and helped decimate the large game animals upon which the Neaderthal lived. Their caloric needs were likely not met on the smaller game animals that remained, unlike our own ancestors, who had lived off these things, as well as game from the sea.

As to those who traded with the Han Chinese, those would have been the Tocharians, circa 2400-1800 BCE. They were an 'Indo-European' speaking people who likely traveled from the areas of northern Europe and were thereby related to those who became the Norse, as well as the Celtic and Germanic peoples. They were tall and fair skinned, with several of the men being upwards of 6 feet in height. But then...they were meat eaters.

The neaderthal genes we carry are from a much earlier time. Nearly 40,000 years ago. That they can be found in all populations except Africa indicates that the gene sharing occurred in the Middle East, before modern humans spread out.