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Thread: Grains Are Ok To Eat Says My Father page

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    Primal Toad's Avatar
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    Grains Are Ok To Eat Says My Father

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    Grains were again brought up in conversation today with my parents. My Dad reassured me that he has cut back ever since I went primal 4 months ago and I have noticed it. He eats more salads and more eggs and less sandwiches and does not eat cereal as much. Since I make Dinner most of the time for my family and always cook up a primal meal its difficult for him to eat grains for Dinner.

    During conversation today he brought up a Dr. who studied the digestive tract, etc. The dr. dissected a human being and determined that grains are great for the body and we need fiber. Blah and blah. I am just wondering... how would YOU respond to this?

    Since he is still for grains he is always going to find information that supports his theory. I am 100% against grains so I always find stuff that supports my theory. Its how the world works.
    Find me at aToadontheRoad.com. Cheers!

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    I do what I gotta do; you do what you gotta do.

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    You might print off Professor Cordain's Cereal Grains: Humanity’s Double-Edged Sword and give it to him to read. I'm not a great fan, but I think this paper is very well-researched and well-written, and should make most people think again:

    http://www.direct-ms.org/pdf/Evoluti...al%20Sword.pdf

    I don't see how one can tell "grains are great for the body" from dissection. I think one could find that the villi were damaged by gluten. I'm not sure how one could find anything positive, and what it would be. Moreover, it's sometimes possible for doctors to make assumptions and not look as closely as they should. Dr Burkitt was a great man for fibre - on the basis of what he thought he'd found out in Africa. However:

    What Burkitt and Trowell failed to recognize is that Africans do not eat their grain foods as we do in the west, in the form of quick rise breads, cold cereals, energy bars and pasta, but as a sour or acid porridge. Throughout Africa, these porridges are prepared by the fermentation of maize, sorghum, millet or cassava. Preparation "at the homestead" begins with washing the grains, then steeping them in water for 24 to 72 hours. The grain is drained and the water discarded. Soaked grains are wet milled and passed through a sieve. The hulls or leavings in the sieve are discarded. In other words, the Africans throw away the bran. The smooth paste that passes through the sieve may undergo further fermentation.
    http://www.westonaprice.org/traditio...of-africa.html

    This is from an article by two very clever women, who are, I think, very dryly putting a hasty male who hasn't seen any importance in food preparation and hasn't thought to observe it in his intellectual place.

    I think Robb Wolf has a good way of "selling" Stone Age-type diets. He says he says to people, Just try it for a month, and then consider how you look, how you feel, and how you perform. After that period of time - when you've gone cold-turkry on grains, legumes, and dairy - you can gradually re-introduce and see if you get a reaction. If you do, then you know. And if you don't, then you know. I suspect most people can probably take full-fat dairy products - specially if they're from grass-fed animals or raw (unpasteurized) or fermented - or all three. And goats' milk and ewes' milk seem to be far less problematic. But I can certainly imagine a whole range of symptoms clearing up when grains are eliminated, and people not even wanting to go back once they've actually tried.

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    I think it's very hard for many people to walk away from grains when they continually hear or read that we must have grains (preferably whole grains) to be healthy. Mr. Ski still likes his cold cereal in the summer and oatmeal in the winter although when he sees what I am having he always puts the cereal box back in the cupboard and asks, "Is there enough for me?????" Of course, I always make enough for two. Devious? Perhaps...but it works.

    He still eats bread occasionally and yes, I still bake it for him. I started baking bread several years ago when I tried to avoid soy and noticed that most commercial breads used soy and a ton of other crap. I figure what I bake for him is superior to his going out and buying a loaf of wonder bread.

    What has helped him to venture toward grain-free is that he notices that when he eats like I do, his blood sugar numbers are great; when he has grains, it shoots up. It's right there in black and white. For me, I found a direct correlation between eating grains and arthritis pain. It only took about a month of being grain-free to notice I no longer had any pain and I haven't had to take any of my arthritis meds for over a year. Although I'm sometimes tempted by the aroma of that freshly baked bread coming out of the oven, the thought of being in pain again (it was so bad that I had to walk with a cane) makes it easy to stay away. One year grain and pain free works for me.

    I don't know what you can tell your dad. I think how he would feel without grains would speak much louder than any studies you can find.

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    okay i could see an arugement for rice, white rice b/c it has negligible impact on the body and digestion of a nondiabetic....but grains????? wow hahaha i dunno anyone arguing their health has got a pin loose up there lol

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    Wait... The Dr. Disected ONE body? Ummm...

    Also, I think we DO need fiber. But that we're supposed to get it from Fruits and Veges. At least, I FEEL better when I eat fruits and veges. And not STICKY bread/pasta. I don't think we're supposed to DRINK the juice of an orange, and then eat a bowl of cereal. EAT THE WHOLE ORANGE. It seems to me the only reason that grains are pushed is because the average Joe does not eat enough fruits and veges. Some people may eat one pc. of fruit in a week. (now I know if you're going trying to lose weight you should watch the glycemic index here.) And some people may eat one or two pcs. of vege in a week. Or no more than 1/2-1 cup.

    So, example according to nutrition data (like this site for anti inflamitory #'s too) A 136g avocado has 21g f, 9g FIBER, 3g protein. And although the USDA recommendations have MUCH to do about insanity, they recommend 38g of fiber a day for men (25g for women). An avacodo is 1/4 of the way there for dad! They DON'T say 38g of cereal, wheat etc. These types of things are recommended if you want Fiber without calories. Which Well... And on a SAD diet, you probably NEED THAT much fiber to push through all the gross sticky stuff that you would otherwise be eating.

    I make a mean creamy broccolli soup, which seriously allows me to eat almost a pound of broccolli in one sitting. According to the pkg. (frozen) that's about 13g of fiber in one sitting. Plus lots of other goodies!

    Perhaps you can determine how many grams of fiber Dad thinks he should be getting. Then analyze a primal menu for him. My OPINION is that we should get the most nutrtionally dense food. WHOLE foods that you could go out and pick or (gulp) kill if you had the time.

    And then don't forget the 80/20 rule. Even though you're 100. Emotion is a valid variable. Don't just try to shove it to the side.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Primal Toad View Post

    During conversation today he brought up a Dr. who studied the digestive tract, etc. The dr. dissected a human being and determined that grains are great for the body and we need fiber. Blah and blah. I am just wondering... how would YOU respond to this?

    Well, it's impossible to respond to the actual evidence and logic, as he didn't give you any of it.

    The only thing he gave you was an appeal to authority. A "doctor" said it was so. That one's easy. Remind him that you can find a doctor that supports every theory out there. End of that reasoning.

    It's tough trying to convince people of things. Most of the time it's best not to try. But we're all human and we love certain people, so it's hard to not try with them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by twinmama View Post
    ... I think we DO need fiber. But that we're supposed to get it from Fruits and Veges.
    Supposed? What's the "supposed" about it?

    I doubt we need much - or any. Where do the Eskimo get it? Where do you get it in northern Canada? Or Siberia? Where did our Ice Age ancestors living in tundra get it?

    However, I doubt a moderate amount does any harm, although note that pectin can be a gut irritant, so fibre from fruit isn't always and everywhere innocuous.

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    *whew* I guess that settles it.

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    Lots of smart folks don't buy into paleo as the be-all-end-all diet. John Berardi and Lyle McDonald come to mind immediately. Lyle even has a special word for followers of the paleo diet. Everywhere you look, there's "proof" that diet A is better or worse then diet B, though often much of that "proof" is cherry picked. IME, most people gain the most benefit from cutting gluten and dairy out of their diets if they have issues with inflammation. Others do best dropping carbs way down if they have an issue with their weight. Trying to convince someone who really only has something as nebulous as "health" to gain when they feel fine that their diet is crap is pretty hard.

    To turn it around, what's happening with your father that makes you want to insist he drops 100% of the grains from his diet?

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