Primal Babies vs. Non-Primal Babies--Your Experiences? page

[FairyRae]

I was (a soy-reliant) vegetarian throughout my pregnancy for ds and until he was around 15 months old (and 11 years prior!) He has all sorts of food sensitivity issues (even to goodies like almonds and other nuts/seeds, strawberries, orange, pineapples and other fruits, etc...not to mention gluten/dairy/corn/soy...) that I feel were caused in large part b/c of my diet, along w/ toxin exposure (yeah, I had dental work on my AMALGAM FILLINGS 2x during pregnancy!!!! Stupid stupid stupid...).

Anyway, dh and I were talking about the possibility of having a second child. My biggest concern is dealing with the struggles of food sensitivities (night waking and crying for hours, rashes, behavior issues, etc...) again. But I have a feeling that the improvements in my diet over the past few years will have a HUGE impact on any new babe.

For those of you who have been primal through pregnancy and beyond, what have your experiences with your new babe been like? If you've got more than one (esp if one had a primal preg and another did not) do you see any differences in temperment etc. between the babes you were primal with vs the ones you were not primal with? I think we each are born w/ personality (having my son totally changed my perspective on the nature/nurture argument for sure!) but I think our diets impact EVERYTHING a ton, and just would love to hear what your experiences have been...

TIA for any thoughts/experiences you have to share!!!!

[Coconut]

Hello FairyRae. My son that turns 1 on July 1st. During pregnancy I ate everything except for the bacteria risk foods like soft cheeses, fast food. Still ate heaps of chocolate though!!! I've read more than once that soy is bad so I don't touch it anymore and didn't eat it during pregnancy.

A natropath friend of mine fed her girl heaps of soy as a baby (she was vegetarian) and now her baby has a soy intolllerance. It is a bean afterall, and how would cavemen have eaten beans if he could not boil water?

Since starting my boy on solids at 5.5months, he does not have cereal or any grains ( although daddy did give him some bread roll a few weeks ago wetted with poached egg). He's a solid strong very smart little (not so little at 11kg already!) boy. He eats heaps of raw fruits, steamed veggies and mashed meat and breastmilk. He has no allergies or food issues at this stage and no behavioural issues. Having said that, when I eat mainly fruit with some meat and veggies I feel calm, happy and incontroll. Add chocolate and junk food and I turn grouchy and irritable. I am sure this affects our kids too and is responsible for many tantrums and unexplained behavioural problems.

If a food needs to be processed to eat it, perhaps we shouldn't be eating it as caveman wouldn't have been able to.

I think stick to the basics of fruit meat and veg like our ancestors did and you can't go wrong.

Good luck with possible number 2 baby!!!!

[slesca]

This describes me. I had one non-primal pregnancy and one primal pregnancy five years later. My 2nd is only 1 month old, though, so I can't speak much to his diet or temperment. However, my non-primal daughter was a pretty average baby- she wasn't difficult, but she wasn't as easy as some of my friends' babes. For her, the key was lots and lots of sleep. As a 5 year old, sugar causes her a lot of problems. I haven't been able to eliminate bread from her diet as my husband doesn't see a problem with it and has a pretty high gluten/carb diet himself. Dinners are primal but breakfast and lunch aren't necessarily (though they are sometimes). Her personality is fiery but in a good way. She's always been physically advanced- a little taller, quick to master the gross and fine motor skills, etc. She's also academically bright, though not unusually so.

Our new baby has seemed a little needier to me, but he was born smaller and born earlier than my daughter. I think that is responsible for their differences so far. He seems to need more soothing, help falling asleep, frequent nursing, etc. Having a primal pregnancy was more noticeable for ME than it has been so far with my baby- quicker recovery, fewer unpleasant pregnancy symptoms, etc.

While I am curious to see how my children compare, I'm not sure it will be that helpful to you as my non-primal daughter has never been ill, is well-behaved (though opinionated), and eats absolutely everything under the sun. In fact, her adventuresome eating was what she was known for at her pre-school after she told her teacher how much she liked cow tongue This could all be due to genetics and her innate personality as my husband and I are both from families that enjoy an unusual amount of health and longevity. It could also be due to the fact that even when we weren't primal and hadn't even heard of the concept, we did accidentally live more primally than many, due to our more rural lifestyle that included grass fed meat, lots of produce, and high levels of physical activity. Who the heck knows? Good luck with your second baby! I'm a huge fan of kids and babies and always think more is better, so you might want to stay away from my advice

[FairyRae]

He has no allergies or food issues at this stage and no behavioural issues. Having said that, when I eat mainly fruit with some meat and veggies I feel calm, happy and incontroll. Add chocolate and junk food and I turn grouchy and irritable. I am sure this affects our kids too and is responsible for many tantrums and unexplained behavioural problems.

If a food needs to be processed to eat it, perhaps we shouldn't be eating it as caveman wouldn't have been able to.

I think stick to the basics of fruit meat and veg like our ancestors did and you can't go wrong.

I totally agree--and am glad to hear your ds has been fine as he's eating a primal diet (and sounds like you are now too!) I KNOW this makes a huge difference in EVERYTHING.

I feel like I had major deficiencies (that I've been working to fix) so I'm hoping that my diet over the past 2 years (gluten/dairy/soy/corn free, nourishing traditions style whole foods, fermented foods, liver at times, etc.) along w/ switching to totally grain free/primal this past October (w/ my 20% of dark chocolate and some potatoes--the latter of which I'm working to drop), and supping w/ a good multi, vit D, fish oil and probiotics will all help prevent future issues. I'm betting a lot of the reactions my son had throughout infancy and toddlerhood won't even happen to a new babe b/c I'm not eating those trigger foods, but I'm still nervous a/b it. Ds was for sure a 'high needs', 'fussy' baby, but I really feel it was food/toxin related... But we are still working on gut healing for both of us (although he has more issues than me). These deficiency issues can have powerful effects, and I'm just hoping to skip those if we decide to TTC again, you know?

[FairyRae]

Fascinating slesca! And I'm betting this played a part in your daughter's health:

It could also be due to the fact that even when we weren't primal and hadn't even heard of the concept, we did accidentally live more primally than many, due to our more rural lifestyle that included grass fed meat, lots of produce, and high levels of physical activity.

I think the inclusion of really really good nutrient dense foods is more important than just excluding crappy or suboptimal foods (although eating more good foods will naturally force you to eat less crappy foods). Whole foods w/ good meats is WAYYYYYYYY better than my pregnancy veg diet (which had been shitty for years b/4--I felt like I was finally eating really healthily the year b/4 and during my pregnancy w/ all my organic fake soy meats and whole grains, and *low* fat eating...)

Thanks both of you for your input--so helpful! Keep it coming folks!

[cillakat]

the child from my higher vitamin d pregnancy is much easier than my other child. the first was born in april.....the second in september.

Most of the allergy thing and not dealing well with toxins thing is simply a function of 25(OH)D status.

[twinmama]

I don't know... Sometimes a kid is just more sensitive.

I was not primal with my twin PG. I don't eat soy however (other reasons).

My guys were born early. One just over 5 lbs, the other a little more than 3 lbs. They were born with with ZERO medical issues requiring NICU. No breathing, no heart. They stayed 4 days to make sure they could maintain body temp, and could easily gain weight. No probs there either.

Then I had a horror of a time breastfeeding. They were not strong enough (not being full term) to nurse. My boobs got huge, but NOTHING came out. No pump could extract it. Stingy boobs I guess!

The were formula fed. Milk based. Then whole foods fed. (well, ground up whole food. No jars in my house.) They are 5. And in 5 years, have had maybe 4-6 colds each. (a few extra when they hit pre school). No flus. 1 ear infection for one of them, and NEVER a diaper rash, which, unless a child has a yeast infection is most often caused by pee or poop being allowed to sit on skin, burning it, with WAY too much rubbing to get it off.

In fact, I've been the one who gets easily ill lately. And I really beleive that has to do with total exhaustion and all that can start to go wrong with a body that does not get adequate sleep.

My point is. One child has little to any sensititivies. I can't think of anything. Has slept like a rock rather quickly. The other has a few sensitivities. His skin rashes out under certain food circumstances (or when grandma busts out the bubble bath...YUCK!). Is WAY more picky. And took forever to sleep through the night. FOREVER! They are feakishly developed with their motor skills. A bit behind on speech, but now caught up. Common among people that communicate quite well with each other through a series of grunts.

Personally, I would eat in a fashion that makes you feel good, and keeps you healthy, creating the healthiest growing environment you can. Avoiding foods known to be occassionaly disasterious. It's always sad to hear about an infected placenta because someone just had to have brie. But, I'm assuming that you're already doing well primally. And I wouldn't worry much beyond that. Because, as it can turn out, ALL VARIABLES, EXACTLY THE SAME, you can still end up with one child whose DNA causes him/her to react negatively and another who is just fine. I can see how a mom of singletons has an easier time beating herself up over "I should have done..." But it just isn't always so...

Best wishes!

[FairyRae]

Most of the allergy thing and not dealing well with toxins thing is simply a function of 25(OH)D status.

Thanks Cillakat--we're working on it. We're all supping (a bit over the amounts you rec for weight on your vit D pages while we build up our levels) so hopefully I'll see the changes soon. You and all your info have been a GREAT help. Glad to hear it made such a difference in the two kids!!

Twinmama, now that is really fascinating! Are your kiddos identical or fraternal (just wondering--not sure how twins' DNA makeup is.)

This makes sense (esp as I've taken so many measures in healing already, and currently eat almost strictly paleo/primally):

Personally, I would eat in a fashion that makes you feel good, and keeps you healthy, creating the healthiest growing environment you can. Avoiding foods known to be occassionaly disasterious.

Thank you again for the input folks. It sounds like EVERYONE who has posted has probably had a better prenatal diet than I had with my ds (even if you were not primal)--although I've read Cillakat's stuff and know you were veg for at least one (maybe both) pregnancies? I do think eating in this manner can make a huge difference, and am really glad I found this way of eating, no matter what we decide as far as another child goes...

If you've got more to share, please do! Very interesting to me!

[FairyRae]

Glad to hear it made such a difference in the two kids!!

I mean between your two kids.

[Bisous]

Mine were born in July and then in April. Both pregnancies I would describe as "whole, real foods" - a Michael Pollan diet, not a primal diet by any means (I ate grains), but I wasn't eating a lot of vegetable oil (not much processed food, cooked with butter or olive oil), and I was supplementing with omega 3, and soy has skeeved me out for a long time, so no soy. There was a lot of sugar in the beginning because I was sick as a dog, and creaminess of any kind made me puke. I drank diet coke during the second one because I was so bone tired, as the first one still wasn't sleeping though the night (we finally let her cry it out when nothing else worked - she loves to cry. It's kind of her schtick. Now she sleeps fine.) Took the same multivitamin with 1000 IU D3 through both pregnancies, and I would guess my level was around 40, as it was about 31 when I had it checked about 4 months after stopping all vitamins when I weaned the second one. First was breastfed 14 months, second 10 months (by mutual agreement). They both had a certain amount of rice cereal from 6-9 months, but if I have another, no rice cereal! After 9 months, both went on a whole, organic food diet (at least at home). They drink organic whole milk with algae source DHA supplemented, and I give them vit D gummy vitamins, and the older one (like most toddlers) can go for years without eating much at all, so I started her on a multivitamin with minerals too.

So all and all, pretty similar. The first is nearly three, bright, sensitive, and stubborn. Poor sleeper, fights every nap and bedtime. Personable and makes new friends everywhere she goes - drives mama crazy but in a cute way.

Second is just over one - always sweet, great sleeper, also seems to be pretty bright, but who can tell. More shy, I think. Not sensitive - will have tremendous pratfalls and then pick herself up and toddle along - the older one always made a big drama of such things, doesn't mind hanging out in her crib with her stuffed animals. She eats more primal than the older one.

I don't notice any difference in temperament in either one with regards to amount of sugar, or wheat. They've never been to the doctor aside from well-checks - a couple colds each, and the oldest had roseola. No ear infections (knock on wood). No food sensitivities. Younger one gets heat rashes and gets diaper rash more easily, but typically when her father is taking care of her and doesn't change the diaper quite often enough. Neither has ever had a GI bug. They're both above the charts for height and bounce around between 40-70% for weight. The older one walked at 13 months, the younger 10 months. The older one is not yet three, but knows all her letters and numbers, colors, and shapes, can count to 30, and can read a few words she's memorized - like "off" and "on" and her name, her sister's name, "Bob" (as in Bob the Builder) and "airplane" for some reason. She is adept at the computer and loves Starfall (starfall.com) and (unfortunately) netflix.