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[QUOTE=Ripped;1099331]I would agree that there are better ways to do it. I'd rather have the muscle. But I'm not going to bash the guy if he didn't know or take that route. Give the guy a break! [U][B]He probably saved his own life!!![/B][/U]
Aside from that, crash dieting actually has it's place. While it's a definite no-no for a person of normal healthy weight, it still has it's place with obese individuals. Doctors actually prescribe it to obese individuals in the form of a protein sparing modified fast (PSMF). When they do it, they restrict calories severely, but they still make sure the patient still gets all their essential nutrients such as protein, fats, vitamins, and minerals.
While it is commonly believed that such would be bad for someone, I am convinced that such is only dogma and fear for no reason. The reason why is due to the lack of proof. Even if there was any proof of possible danger with such a protocol, the doctors would still do it because the risks of not doing it outweigh the risks of doing it. When obese, the patient is already at risk, and they need to fix it ASAP in order to get better. Otherwise they risk disease and possible death.
PS.
[B][I][U]Being 175 lbs isn't anorexic.[/U][/I][/B] To think so is just some more modern world nonsense. It's disgusting. I'm probably offending everyone by saying this. But I don't care. People are fat in the modern world because of beliefs in society that allow them to continue to allow themselves to be that way. It shouldn't be acceptable. If people didn't accept it, it wouldn't happen.
I mean, when I was heavy, nobody ever told me so. I guess they just didn't want to hurt my feelings. They waited until I lost weight to tell me that I used to be fat. That clearly didn't help me at all, because I didn't know I was fat. Luckily, I had one friend who was mean enough to tell me the truth; I was so mad. Hearing the truth is what made me want to change. So I did. And years later I went back and thanked him. At that point he told me the truth again, that I looked the best I ever did since he knew me.[/QUOTE]
+1. If he's 5'10" he would still screen as overweight by BMI. If he's 6'0" he's in the upper range of normal for that height. He doesn't look 6'0" unless he just hangs out with taller women. I agree. Losing that much weight keeping it off that long and and the taller women is better than just staying 450lbs any day. :)
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[QUOTE=Ripped;1099222]This is why fat people are fat. Because they can't understand simple concepts. They allow others to confuse them so they lose sight of what really works. Eat less and you won't be fat anymore. If this weren't the case, POW's and the kids in Africa would be obese. But they aren't.
Here's a guy who figured it out. He was over 450 lbs, then one day decided he was going to start eating less and working out regularly. He stuck to it and worked his ass off, and lost 250 lbs in a year. Now he's been around 175 lbs for a decade.
[url=http://blog.juststopeatingsomuch.com/]Just Stop Eating So Much![/url]
Wow, what a genius. Who would have known? I mean, I never would have guessed that if you just ate less and exercised more you'd lose fat. Because all the fat people, who all seem to be the biggest experts on diet, they all keep saying you have to eat more in order to keep the metabolism high.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, that's great, except it has nothing to do with your original post or mine. Starving yourself = weight loss, yeah, obviously.
Fyi, kids in Africa eat a primarily carb heavy diet.
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[QUOTE=zoebird;1099341]I think that most people who are fat know that they are fat.
I say this because I hear so many people calling themselves fat. People who are 10 lbs overweight to people who are 100 lbs overweight. They all call themselves fat -- a lot. Frequently.[/QUOTE]
I havent followed this thread, but saw the last few posts this morning, and this sort of jumped out at me.
Many of us fat ppl are also good at denial. I didnt say "I am fat" until I started to lose weight. But I was overweight for almost 2 decades. Various degrees of fat and overweight. I knew I was heavy and weighed too much. But never thought or said, I am fat. You think oh geesh, at least I am not Xlbs. And then pretty soon you are. And then you think, well at least I am not Xlbs! And then one day you are. Once the initial shock wears off, you just settle in to what it is. For the most part, I never used a scale so it was easy to be in denial. DH still loved me, we enjoyed most every evening out together --- eating out. I never (hardly ever) cooked at home.
I do think plenty of ppl do say they are fat, but I know for me, it took me a long time to get to that place of saying it outloud. I really don't think I said, "I am fat" until I had already started to do something about it, which may be why you hear it frequently if they are already at a place of working on it. Even now, I still think I am okay or at least maybe not so bad, until I am reminded by a picture that I am still a long ways from my goal. I spent so many years hiding from the camera, and if I didn't see it, it must not be true.
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[QUOTE=gopintos;1100604]I havent followed this thread, but saw the last few posts this morning, and this sort of jumped out at me.
Many of us fat ppl are also good at denial. I didnt say "I am fat" until I started to lose weight. But I was overweight for almost 2 decades. Various degrees of fat and overweight. I knew I was heavy and weighed too much. But never thought or said, I am fat. You think oh geesh, at least I am not Xlbs. And then pretty soon you are. And then you think, well at least I am not Xlbs! And then one day you are. Once the initial shock wears off, you just settle in to what it is. For the most part, I never used a scale so it was easy to be in denial. DH still loved me, we enjoyed most every evening out together --- eating out. I never (hardly ever) cooked at home.
I do think plenty of ppl do say they are fat, but I know for me, it took me a long time to get to that place of saying it outloud. I really don't think I said, "I am fat" until I had already started to do something about it, which may be why you hear it frequently if they are already at a place of working on it. Even now, I still think I am okay or at least maybe not so bad, until I am reminded by a picture that I am still a long ways from my goal. I spent so many years hiding from the camera, and if I didn't see it, it must not be true.[/QUOTE]
Cheers to that one!!!
I used to be great at denial. And now days I see it more than ever now that I've changed the way I think about food.
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[QUOTE=Derpamix;1100578]Yeah, that's great, except it has nothing to do with your original post or mine. Starving yourself = weight loss, yeah, obviously.
[B]Fyi, kids in Africa eat a primarily carb heavy diet.[/B][/QUOTE]
Do you think these kids eat a heavy carb diet?
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grnrx7JeDhg]The Starving Chlidren of Africa - YouTube[/url]
People need to get real. If you're 100 lbs overweight or even of normal weight, you aren't starving, no matter how little you eat. Such people have no idea what real starvation is, and they never will.
We should all be thankful that we are lucky enough to have food at all and be alive, and not abuse our bodies by eating ourselves to the point of sickness.
Totally off topic? Maybe. But that's just what came to mind. People need to stop abusing their bodies. If they're overweight then they need to get more realistic about how much they need to eat.
Hey, I've got a great idea everyone. Do this every day. Step on the scale. Are you overweight? If yes, then take what ever money you were going to spend on food that day and give it to a charity for the starving kids in Africa. They need the food. You don't.
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[QUOTE=Ripped;1100713]
Totally off topic? Maybe. But that's just what came to mind. People need to stop abusing their bodies. If they're overweight then they need to get more realistic about how much they need to eat.
Hey, I've got a great idea everyone. Do this every day. Step on the scale. Are you overweight? If yes, then take what ever money you were going to spend on food that day and give it to a charity for the starving kids in Africa. They need the food. You don't.[/QUOTE]
I'm going to take a wild guess and say either you have never been overweight, or you were one of the overweight people for whom it was caused strictly by over-eating.
Not all of us who are overweight got that way through over-eating. In my own case, my thyroid failed. I went from being 125 lbs with a lean, athletic body to being 225 lbs despite eating the same foods, in the same portions, and doing the same activity (until I got so heavy I couldn't.) My doctor, when I asked for tests to find out what was wrong, said, "Join Weight Watchers." It took 9 years to get diagnosed as having Hashimotos Thyroiditis. After which I have steadily lost weight.
Every single day I read posts from someone like you that seems to think it's a matter or willpower and overeating in every single case of obesity. You are WRONG.
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[QUOTE=EagleRiverDee;1101077] It took 9 years to get diagnosed as having Hashimotos Thyroiditis. After which I have steadily lost weight.[/QUOTE]
I kept going every year to my doctor. About all I got from him is "my mom is in her 80's and overweight and going strong!"
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What your describing is called The Zone Diet. The developer, Barry Sears, is relatively pudgy.
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Ayla
Just went through the entire thread, you've had all the advice on Macro's and plans to get there and then some more, here's my take.
You're between a rock and a hard place, now the first thing is your concern about your son being teased, which is likely representative of other fears you have as well. Now unless you actually go on a hunger strike, which wouldn't help anyway, any other path you take you're still going to be that "Fat Mum" as you described for a while yet, so no amount of concern in that sphere is going to help you, it will just hinder your progress, so you need to address those issues upstairs first, by all means get into the diet plan and exercise, but you need to devote a significant amount of time to introspection.
You have described a long history of dieting and failure, every one of those has flipped a switch upstairs lowering self esteem, all this is reversable, but you need to work through it. I am not suggesting you go and see a shrink, just look within at your behaviours, feelings & responses, how many of these are self sabotageing, how often do you respond with a sense of obligation but internally holding feelings of resentment. It will take quite a while for you to hear what your body is saying, and gradually gain the ability to observe yourself and how your mind & emotions operate, you'll find that indeed sometimes it feels like a dozen different people up there arguing about what you should do, stand back and observe them, sometimes it can get quite funny.
An example, aquaintance calls seeking emotional support, your reaction, grab keys drive over and do your duty, but all the while resenting this inconvenience and you were planning to hang with your son, hubby, or whatever. Some say these needy people are feeding off your spiritual energy and you need to control that doorway, another might be your own needs of wanting to be loved and needed. There is a thing called active choices, friend calls, you take a breath review situation, is it life threatening, what are you sacrificing, if you do it then you deny an opportunity to be with your loved ones, that is what they call "opportunity cost" you only have so much time and love to give you need to think carefully about how you spend it, now you may well decide that you need to do it, that's fine, but you will be doing it from a position of strength and love without any resentment, it is the resentment which tells us we are harming ourselves.
You are standing at the base of a big mountain, don't be distracted by those racing past you up the path, or the criticisms about how you're doing it wrong, seek information as you are doing, assess it and take the bits that work for you, slow and steady wins the race, you may never get to the pic in your user id, are you ok with that, do you love yourself for who you are, it's only when you learn to love yourself that you can become truly healthy, when both your mind and body are at peace. Some of that stuff may not relate to you, just a prompter to look within, as you go through the process you will be surprised at what you find, each individual has a slightly different path to walk, there's no one size fits all.
As for practical stuff, just a couple of things I didn't see mentioned.
1 / As for exercise a morning kick start is good if you can manage it, if your metabolism is boosted in the morning it will maintain that pace during the day, if you start off slow, you will most likely idle all day.
2 / Do not discount potential thyroid issues, many times individuals may have numbers in range, but still have a subclinical condition with all the associated symptoms, one way to double check this is to monitor heart rate and body temp at least in morning when you wake up, note womens body temp fluctuates during monthly cycle, but it is a good indicator of overall health.
3 / Consider that it may be a micronutrient deficiency which has stalled your weight loss, esspecially if you have been eating less, there are nutrients you lose in the elimination process and if your body is short it will not let you lose more, so focussing on consuming nutrient dense foods may help there.
4 / Omega 6 overload may also be a factor, the ratio of O3:O6 is more important than absolute numbers, and if your weight was gained through many years of poor diet, it is likely you were substituting the so called "Healthy" vegetable and seed oils, this results in an altered adipose tissue profile, in short you may have a lot of O6 in your fat stores. So when you are loosing weight this is being released into your blood, which knocks out your ratio to O3, your body will shut down the process because of the danger of getting too much O6 in your cell walls. So possibly additional O3 supplementation, but preferably from direct food sources like wild fish, pasture meats and eggs etc. will support the serum ratio of O3:O6 and allow your body to release more from the adipose tissue. Now a lot of this stored O6 may well be oxidised as well and your body can only clear it at a set rate, no matter how much you starve yourself.
So in a nut shell, be happy and at peace, choose to do the things that you enjoy, eat as healthy as you can, but if possible ease of on some of the structuring and remember that the longest lived people, both as absolute individual ages and as averaged life expectancy, were not strictly primal, the most dominant characteristics they all shared was an active life and peace of mind, they ate with the seasons and their geography, sometimes more fruit, veg & carbs, sometimes just meat and fat.
Hope that essay may trigger some ideas that ring with you, the answer lies within you, and through the discussion you will come to it.
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[QUOTE=EagleRiverDee;1101077]I'm going to take a wild guess and say either you have never been overweight, or you were one of the overweight people for whom it was caused strictly by over-eating.[/QUOTE]
I was obese from overeating, and now I'm not anymore.
This is a frustrating road when most dietary advice out there is complete crap and you don't know what to do. Fortunately I eventually was able to figure it out for myself and apply it.
[QUOTE=EagleRiverDee;1101077][B]Not all of us who are overweight got that way through over-eating.[/B] In my own case, my thyroid failed. I went from being 125 lbs with a lean, athletic body to being 225 lbs despite eating the same foods, in the same portions, and doing the same activity (until I got so heavy I couldn't.) My doctor, when I asked for tests to find out what was wrong, said, "Join Weight Watchers." It took 9 years to get diagnosed as having Hashimotos Thyroiditis. After which I have steadily lost weight[/QUOTE]
Most people are. A case such as yours is a very rare exception and I can understand why it would be A LOT harder for you without the meds.
Can you understand how tough it might have been for me not even knowing that I was fat? I didn't because nobody told me. In such a case, it's impossible to lose weight.
Can you understand how frustrating it might have been when I thought I was just chubby due to genetics, even though I was actually obese and I could do something about it but I didn't know?
Can you understand how frustrating it might have been for me when I sought out dietary advice, yet most of the dietary advice available was impractical, confusing, and contradictory? I didn't know what to do and because of that it took me much longer to figure it out and gain complete control over my weight.
In the case of the extremely obese individuals, it can sometimes be different as well. They know they are fat. In some cases they overeat due to emotional reasons. I've known at least a few people who have had such problems.
[QUOTE=EagleRiverDee;1101077]Every single day I read posts from someone like you that seems to think it's a matter or willpower and overeating in every single case of obesity. You are WRONG.[/QUOTE]
No I am not. Most people who get fat get fat from overeating. I believe your personal story, but realize that is a rare case.
Let's be real. Roughly 66% of the population in the USA are overweight and 33% are obese. This isn't the case in other countries, even when they have McDonalds too. I know this because I've been to other countries and I've seen it with my own eyes. I've seen countless people who ate McDonalds or KFC every day and most of them were still thin, because they weren't eating too much of it.
What does this tell you about countries such as the USA? I could tell you a lot more. Portion sizes are bigger. People are always pressuring each other to eat more food all the time. Commercials and ads are everywhere telling people to eat. Even the dietary advice and programs are typically designed to get you to buy more food products and eat more; they don't care if you are fat, only if they have your money. This is the real reason why most people are fat.
