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I think it is a urban legend; as a child I was told if you pour coke over a ham than you would see worms coming out of the ham. The ham has to be uncooked for it to happen. I never got the courage to try. :-\
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[url=http://qkme.me/3smibf]lestat - i thought you said she was grassfed[/url]
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[QUOTE=cori93437;1065887]Mmmmm.... making carnitas today. :o
This thread inspired me.
Thanks ya'll. :cool:[/QUOTE]
Pork picnic shoulder ready for the crock pot tomorrow along with lime, cumin, garlic, onion, bay, parsley...
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[QUOTE=RichMahogany;1065795]I meant populations. As you allude to. So you're on a website about "The Primal Blueprint," but you don't accept that what evolution designed us for is still good for us? Or only applies if we actually go live on the Savannah? This represents a disconnect in your thought patterns, not the actual evidence.
Propose a mechanism by which clean red meat, the kind those of us on this website advocate, would cause any of the problems you're so scared of and we can debunk away.[/QUOTE]
Heme iron, Neu5Gc, carcinogens, exogenous AGEs and amines can be potentially problematic if overconsumed.
Also I copied this from a guy who used to post here.
I advise people to purchase grass-fed meat, to not overcook it, and to eat a diet with a lot of fruit or other high flavanoid foods, and fiber, and then I think that there is little chance of such problems.
(1) [url]http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=7879337&fulltextType=RA&fileId=S0007114510001042[/url] (2) [url]http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/86/5/1286.full[/url] (3) [url]http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/91/4/940.full[/url] (4) [url]http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/96/5/1409.full[/url] (5) [url]http://edrv.endojournals.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/33/03_MeetingAbstracts/OR03-1[/url] (6) [url]http://www.springerlink.com/content/87145111527p5771/?MUD=MP[/url] (7) [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17823788[/url] (8) [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17237312[/url]
Red meat is high in fats which induce intestinal barrier dysfunction and result in the translocation of endotoxin from the gut into the blood stream which trigger the inflammatory cascade. The mechanism is oxidative stress from the bile acids needed to digest fats, damaging the intestinal muscosal barrier(1)(2). Naturally, one would expect certain antioxidants to prevent this, and indeed many from fruit including oranges and grapes do.(3)(4) Dietary fiber has been shown to prevent this acutely (5)(6), and perhaps chronically (7), perhaps chronically via the actions of butyrate, a product of bacterial fermentation of fibers which protects the gut, and because it binds bile acids and facilitates their excretion (from 5 and 6).
Some may suggest other mechanisms, however I urge them to reconsider, as there is very little evidence, and some to contradict it, that red meat actually increases inflammation chronically (8). It can acutely under certain easily preventable circumstances that I have alluded to.
I advise people to purchase grass-fed meat, to not overcook it, and to eat a diet with a lot of fruit or other high flavanoid foods, and fiber, and then I think that there is little chance of such problems.
That is unless you have an allergy, in which case you have my deepest sympathies. Stuffy nose makes its plausible.
(1) [url]http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=7879337&fulltextType=RA&fileId=S0007114510001042[/url] (2) [url]http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/86/5/1286.full[/url] (3) [url]http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/91/4/940.full[/url] (4) [url]http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/96/5/1409.full[/url] (5) [url]http://edrv.endojournals.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/33/03_MeetingAbstracts/OR03-1[/url] (6) [url]http://www.springerlink.com/content/87145111527p5771/?MUD=MP[/url] (7) [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17823788[/url] (8) [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17237312[/url]
I can respond to any questions, I suspect that there might be some.
For more Paleo Diet hacks: [url]http://paleohacks.com/questions/160751/inflammation-from-red-meat#ixzz2IPSUpKmT[/url]
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Against what virus am I now vaccinated? :D
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[QUOTE=Forgotmylastusername;1066320]
Also I copied this from a guy who used to post here.
For more Paleo Diet hacks: [url=http://paleohacks.com/questions/160751/inflammation-from-red-meat#ixzz2IPSUpKmT]Inflammation from red meat - PaleoHacks.com[/url][/QUOTE]
Yeah, stabby always posts some pretty good stuff. But seriously first look at his [I]whole[/I] response, then also realize he was being asked to postulate a possible mechanism for something that IMO may or may not exist as an actual issue to overall health.....just a localized event in the body. He does so.
Please also see that three of the four postulated mechanisms revolve around buying good meat and not burning it (cooking low and slow to be safe). Easy enough. The only one you quoted was the fourth one. Not a bad little bit, but it in no way states any reason to limit your intake....again just pruposes a mechanism for oxidative stress, which in many aspects is not just some damaging event but an integral part of cells signaling systems. I don't think you can draw any real conclusion that red meat = bad out of that. Eat primal be happy :)
The iron bit may actually have some backing and we're kinda waiting on those studies. So give blood once in a while...you should anyhow. I was reading a De Vany's blog the other day and came across an interesting tidbit on this and people of European decent being at higher risk due to the weaning out process from the bubonic plague....
[url=http://artdevanyonline.com/1/post/2012/8/post-title-click-and-type-to-edit.html]Iron, hemochromatosis, and bacteria - Art De Vany on Line[/url]
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It’s not up to members of this board to postulate a single mechanism about why red meat may be bad, there may be various mechanisms, and working on falsification and verifications of several hypothesis and theories is the global work of the scientist community and will take many years still too come. But we can see clearly on a statistically basis from all the studies and meta-studies that there is something [I]not-that-healthy[/I] around red meat, and that consuming it is best to be moderated and also that white meat is a healthier option. So, it is up to everybody to draw his own conclusions of course, but the picture seem pretty clear to me for taking a decision about how I plan my eating, and I don’t have to know the underlying mechanisms for doing that…
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[QUOTE=Gorbag;1066493]It’s not up to members of this board to postulate a single mechanism about why red meat may be bad, there may be various mechanisms, and working on falsification and verifications of several hypothesis and theories is the global work of the scientist community and will take many years still too come. But we can see clearly on a statistically basis from all the studies and meta-studies that there is something [I]not-that-healthy[/I] around red meat, and that consuming it is best to be moderated and also that white meat is a healthier option. So, it is up to everybody to draw his own conclusions of course, but the picture seem pretty clear to me for taking a decision about how I plan my eating, and I don’t have to know the underlying mechanisms for doing that…[/QUOTE]
Nope...wrong on just about every level. It actually is up to every individual to use their brains and either accept or reject postulated mechanisms based on previous knowledge and logic. Anybody with a brain can employ the scientific method, it is not exclusive to use by the scientific community alone. In fact your reaction and that of many peoples is to a headline the media likely reports with sensationalistic claims that are in no way actually backed by the data.
We can see NOTHING clearly based on poorly done meta-analysis and actually CAN point out numerable problems with the actual study in question that leaves us with no real answers.....
So in the end what we do know is that you can monkey with statistics enough to present a bias as fact if you like. You also have douchebag media reps that take these results out of context to report with sensational headlines. You then have John Q. Public completely duped EXCEPT for those who actually know how to read studies.
But, eat what you like! There are plenty of meats to choose from, and variety is a good idea....Pork IS a white meat too. Have at it. I mean thats what this thread WAS about anyhow.
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Dude there is nothing wrong with red meat. By your other recommendations it sounds almost like the same advice they give on mens health magazine
I would eat red meat far before I would eat poultry or fatty fish
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Funny..I have heard that too but had totally forgotten. While I am not going to try it, I am sticking it in the realm of urban legend.
[QUOTE=phigment;1065956]I think it is a urban legend; as a child I was told if you pour coke over a ham than you would see worms coming out of the ham. The ham has to be uncooked for it to happen. I never got the courage to try. :-\[/QUOTE]
