[QUOTE=2ndChance;1007112]It sounds like you could afford to eat more carbs if you feel, say, too tired to cook. My ketosis experience is much different-- I only fast when I have to (it's what Grok would've done, none of this fasting when quality food is around, forcing yourself to ignore hunger signals), like when I'm at school. I can stay sharp on ketones for hours, but when I'm home, I eat whatever I want, and however much I want. I have lived in fear of weight gain in the past, I will never again value appearance over happiness. It doesn't sound like your diet is making you happy, and to be happy is the only reason to eat anything.[/QUOTE]
I am not Leida, but enjoyed your post. When I first started to go low carb, I read don't exercise, which was great because I hated it anyways. I was on a chronic path. It did not make sense to me to exercise so much only to be hungrier. I thought it would be much easier for me to control what I ate instead. So I loved that aspect. But then I wasnt doing much of anything, though I knew I should do something. I did get some stuff done over the summer but when it got so hot, I didn't even want to do that.
And that was about the same time that I went even lower carbs, even higher fat. And my goal is weight loss, so the slow metabolism part, I am wondering if the too low of calories was my trouble, or too high of fat was my trouble. I just don't know but I am in a much better place having added some carbs back in. And not talking cakes and donuts and twinkies. Good primal carbs like a tator or an apple :)
So my exercise now, is still no where near what others do here. But I am happy with it for now. I can see vamping it up though, fine tuning that once I get the diet part figured out. I have lost almost 70lbs and find that I still do not have the diet part figured out :rolleyes:
But I am in a pretty happy place. I was very frustrated. About a month or so ago before I made the switch, I was very frustrated. Very unhappy. My goal is weightloss. I thought ketosis is what I was suppose to do for weight loss. I was doing what others were doing but just not seeing results. I just felt like I was spinning my wheels and I had been for months and months and getting nowhere, until one day I finally woke up.
I really think the exercise component of fitness is why some people do not do well in ketosis.
Leida, I know you are really dedicated to your physical fitness, but from what I have read in your posts, I think you may be overtraining. Overtraining means chronically elevated cortisol which means disturbed sleep and a host of other problems.
Back in the 80s I was a competitive bodybuilder. You can do that to your body and get by while you are young but as the years go by, the bod won't put up with that any more.
It is also a massively freeing experience mentally to turn in your gym card and just do 2x/week LHT bodyweight exercises. 1x/wk sprinting, and lots of long walks and a little hiking........AND keep the same body! It doesn't go flabby and get fat, really. All that exercise is not only not necessary, it is counterproductive.
Please, at least think about this.
[QUOTE=Leida;1007150]I do prefer my veggies steamed, in a salad or in a soup to be honest, but I would roast or fry veggies with a bit of fat, just so it is not greasy. I am afraid to fry potato or sweet potato in fat because of the deadly starch-fat combination. I would make it for my folks, but I would not eat it myself.
The one problem I find with ketosis is that it gave me a fear of vegetables - I keep eating breakfast and lunch meals without vegetables at all, so I can have some for supper. I also find that fat because of the high caloric content tends to 'push' absolutely everything else to the curb, so the portions of food become so small, it is pitiful. Feels like CW all over again.
Anyway, I think I would stick to classic Paleo rather than ketosis. And [B]I interpret ketosis as <30 g total carbs, with 70+% fat.[/QUOTE]
That would definitely give you a fear of veggies but I don't think it has to be that stringent. The AtkinsForSeizures.com plan that I go by says 60/30/10 and no more than 50gcho/day. I often do the 70-80% fat but just because I like it and I'm not that into veggies. That's a funny thing because I used to be really into veggies but, after being in ketosis for a while, thay just don't appeal that much anymore.
I have two different feelings, one for carb hunger and one for fat hunger. The desire for veggies manifests like a thirst. High water content foods are important. Veggies (and fiber-y fruits like apples, I LOVE APPLES and I will not hear anything bad said about them) are good for the digestive system, keeping you regular and all that.
Ever heard all that CW about red meat causing colon cancer? I think it's not that meat is bad, it's the lack of veggies that kills people. Broccoli, tubers, greens, carrots.. (organic, of course) even a bit of fruit... These things are your friends. Don't worry so much about counting them, just eat them, they're full of nutrients, phytonutrients, antioxidants, anthocyanins, all kinds of things whose roles science has yet to understand but my instincts tell me are way more important than anyone realizes.
Prioritizing weight loss is a dangerous approach. I am a former ED (eating disorder, not erectile dysfunction :p) sufferer, I promise that having a goal that is not "to be healthy" will eventually ensure that you are not healthy-- not necessarily physically, but mentally. Having an "I will not be good enough until I reach my goal weight" mentality is far more destructive than eating the occasional potato.
When I'm in ketosis and fully adapted I feel clear, laser-focused and even in mood. It's a great feeling. It's too hard for me to maintain indefinitely though.
Nowadays I don't count anything at all. I seem to gravitate toward more meat, and not necessarily fatty meat. I eat liberally of vegetables, potatoes and sometimes I'll add butter to my vegetables. I don't go out of my way to add a lot of fat or eat big salads unless I really want one. No force-feeding of whatever because you need more "x" in your diet.
I've started lifting weights so I can gain the strength to do real body weight exercises. I tried for 9 months to build strength for body weight exercises WITH body weight exercises and wasn't getting anywhere. I'm amazed how much stronger I feel already after only 4 weeks. But it does make me damn hungry so I eat a lot of steak and potatoes.
[QUOTE=2ndChance;1007215]These things are your friends. Don't worry so much about counting them, just eat them, they're full of nutrients, phytonutrients, all kinds of things whose roles science has yet to understand but my instincts tell me are way more important than anyone realizes.
Prioritizing weight loss is a dangerous approach. I am a former ED sufferer, I promise that having a goal that is not "to be healthy" will eventually ensure that you are not healthy-- not necessarily physically, but mentally. Having an "I will not be good enough until I reach my goal weight" mentality is far more destructive than eating the occasional potato.[/QUOTE]
I agree with both paragraphs.
The first one, when your goal is ketosis, it is hard to think about eating fruits and even veggies. And it just depends on how low on the carb scale you want to go. You can get quite a bit around 50. And net 50 even more. For me, the higher the fat, the lower the carbs, which meant fewer and fewer apples and other veggies.
I can see my pattern of 60% fat is 4-5lbs weight loss per month. That is where I started out the gate with primal. I had already cut the bad carbs. That wasnt bad. Hunger was a non issue. When I am up around 70+, weight loss stops. So that tells me that might be where I need to be for maintenance once the weight is off. Either up the fat or up the calories so that I do not continue to lose weight. (I can't imagine having that problem, so that will be a pleasant change to deal with) But high fat does not mean weight loss for me anymore. Maybe after adding in some carbs, it will once again but for now, this is working so I dont want to rock the boat. I am bad about trying to fix things that aren't broken.
On the second part, I agree with prioritizing weight loss is dangerous if not based on the basic principal of health. I started out my journey as just wanting to save my life, prolong my life. Prevent the preventable. I didnt have anything wrong YET, but on the verge of everything. I felt like a 90 year old woman trapped in a 46 year old body. I had settled into aches and pains and I thought this was my retirement and an early grave was eminent.
Once I made the commitment to change the course I was on, life just looked so much better. For me, weight loss and better health is one and the same. It is not about being 105lbs or 150lbs or even 250lbs. I just feel better getting the weight off. I know my body is much happier. With each pound I lose, I just feel so much better, about everything. Sex is better, sleep is better, socializing with friends is better, riding my horse is better, riding the bike with DH is better and I am able to once again thing about things like my life's purpose, what I am meant to do with the rest of my life rather than sitting around waiting on a heartattack.
When ppl ask me what my goal weight is, I really dont have one but I do know that I am no where close yet, but I am happy again. On the way UP the scale, when I reached this weight, I was anything but happy. And now to be back down to it, I am very happy but know that I can do much better, and my body will be much better, my health will be much better. I am way past being worried about vanity. I have 4 kids, 2 step children, 9 grandkids and have been married twice, 10 years once (started at 17) and now going on 20 years. I have devoted most of my life to others in one way or another. So I am at that age where I really could give a rat's @$$ what anyone else thinks about me, especially what my body looks like in a bikini, or even nekkid, and I have to think about my own health now and do the things that I need/want to do to accomplish my health goals. My goal is weight loss. Get the fat off. I feel like that will help me to ward off the diabetes that was imminent the high blood pressure, the high cholesterol. My knees do not hurt like they did. My back feels better. Less fat makes me more healthy, at least it seems to. It is not about the way I look in the mirror or nekkid, I am way beyond worrying about that, though I would like to think those things might improve also. :cool:
[quote]I don't count macros, I probably eat >50g carbs daily, but I still enter ketosis once in awhile.[/quote]
If you are eating that many carbs, why do you think you are ketonic? When I eat more carbs, i.e. more than 30 g & indulge in tubers and fruit, I feel just great, very energetic and happy as a clam. In other words, it is exactly the same experience as you have. I am pretty sure I am not in ketosis & burn sugars.
[quote]Leida, I know you are really dedicated to your physical fitness, but from what I have read in your posts, I think you may be overtraining. Overtraining means chronically elevated cortisol which means disturbed sleep and a host of other problems.[/quote]
If I was overtraining, or over-reaching, I would not feel like a champ just because I switched from fat a touch protein and a few leaves of spinach to copious veggies, fruit, dairy and meat.
It sounds kind of ass-backwards to severely limit one's lifestyle and things one can do in order to achieve a nutrition ratio. It makes more sense for me to fuel myself with good, nutritious food to support my lifestyle which includes a fair bit of things I want to do but if I don't hvae energy they turn into horrid chores!
[QUOTE=Neckhammer;1007016]Since your not trolling feel free to educate yourself [url=http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolutionary-psychiatry/201104/your-brain-ketones]Your Brain On Ketones | Psychology Today[/url][/QUOTE]
Are you seriously trying to convince me of something with this regurgitated nonsense? I've read enough of this crap to last several lifetimes. I know how I felt on a very low carb diet, and I listened to my body when it was obviously under extreme stress. My hair, skin, digestion, body odor, libido, mood, sleep quality, body temperature were all TERRIBLE. I was freezing in 70 degree weather. I honestly felt like I was dying. I have no idea why I did that to myself other than self-experimentation. I thought since others claimed ketosis was some magical promise land of mental clarity and energy that I would give it a shot. Worst mistake I've ever made, and I only tried it for a month.
[QUOTE=Leida;1007291]If you are eating that many carbs, why do you think you are ketonic? When I eat more carbs, i.e. more than 30 g & indulge in tubers and fruit, I feel just great, very energetic and happy as a clam. In other words, it is exactly the same experience as you have. I am pretty sure I am not in ketosis & burn sugars.[/QUOTE]
I guess I don't know for sure that I'm in ketosis, but it sure feels like it. After several hours without food, I feel like a switch has flipped and my body has stopped looking to the stomach for nutrients and has switched to energy-saver mode, sending impulses to, say, my thighs and upper arms to find tissue that can be repurposed and burned for energy.
My goal isn't to be in ketosis. I accept ketosis as inevitable when I'm away from home for awhile--some days I'm out for 9 hours and I typically eat breakfast before leaving home and dinner upon returning. In both those meals I don't limit my carbohydrates--but I don't really have to, because my instinctual urge is to eat an average of maybe 50-75g of carbs a day.
I think I just have a really fast metabolism. I rarely do cardio aside from quick things like running up the stairs to my apartment instead of walking but I do yoga daily and it's hard to describe the way it makes me feel, but I can tell that it ups my inner fat burner. Do a plank and see how your body shakes trying to maintain the position... I can't describe it but you can tell it's good.
Sometimes if I'm not being particularly low carb on a regular basis and I go for a very long hike with only a small snack for food, I can smell the ketones in the shower later. You can slip into and out of ketosis without having to live there permanently.
Leida, I think PB didn't mean you should alter your physical activities to support a lower carb way of eating, but that you should perhaps look into altering your physical activities because the level you are doing them at may be interfering with your body composition goals.