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Obesity is now a Disease

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  • #16
    There are two people in my office that are considerably heavy. One's on my team, and has a tendency to destroy the office chairs he's issued - just had to replace one the other day - because thon breaks the wheels. Considering buying the one on my team a copy of the Primal Blueprint and just leaving it on their desk, but the last thing I want to do is alienate a teammate. The one on my team is probably in the 400 pound range, if I had to guess.

    M.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by MEversbergII View Post
      There are two people in my office that are considerably heavy. One's on my team, and has a tendency to destroy the office chairs he's issued - just had to replace one the other day - because thon breaks the wheels. Considering buying the one on my team a copy of the Primal Blueprint and just leaving it on their desk, but the last thing I want to do is alienate a teammate. The one on my team is probably in the 400 pound range, if I had to guess.

      M.
      I ordered a copy of Everyday Paleo, and sent it to a friend anonymously. Maybe they will use it, maybe not. At least it's worth a try to help out a friend.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by jammies View Post
        I'm a bit confused. So are you saying that anything an individual causes themselves shouldn't be considered a disease? Or are you saying that because it is a normal physiologic state that it is not a disease?

        It's because it's a normal physiologic state, that I am baffled at it being a disease. Your body is meant to store fat; you will store even more if you're going through a drive-thru and eating 500 calories in fries. People with those extra genes that makes them 'predisposed' to obesity, well, their bodies work even better than mine! They are extra efficient at fat-storing, good for them. Now that the food/environment changes, it's suddenly a disease?

        My problem is this country's (well, Western/European culture in general) incessant habit of treating the symptom and not the cause. This article states that it will encourage physicians to address obesity as a problem, but some of the examples of "solutions" are surgeries and pills. Ugh. So get surgery, that the rest of us and our employers subsidize by paying insurance premiums, and go back to the same lifestyle that made you obese in the first place.

        I'm not saying it's not a problem, but recognizing it as a disease isn't going to help. How about some change in lifestyle? Let kids out for recess? Give insurance breaks and incentives for those with healthy weight, or those who bike the work? I don't have the solution, but recognizing it as a "disease" just comes across as a step backwards, not forwards (IMHO).
        Stumbled into Primal due to food allergies, and subsequent elimination of non-primal foods.

        Start Gluten-Free/Soy-Free: December 2012; start weight 158lbs, Ladies size 6
        Start Primal: March 2013, start weight 150lbs, Ladies size 6
        Current: 132lbs, Ladies size 2
        F/23/5'9"

        26lbs lost since cutting the crap.

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        • #19
          Great story, well done for making the leap! must have taken some courage to defy your doc and CW.
          Man seeks to change the foods available in nature to suit his tastes, thereby putting an end to the very essence of life contained in them.
          www.primaljoy.co.uk

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          • #20
            I'm torn about this actually. On one hand I was morbidly obese at one point and abhor the kind of fat-shaming I've read on this forum since I joined last month. But on the other hand, as soon as we label something a 'disease' it tends to give people something to blame other than themselves. Despite the fact that I have valid medical reasons for being overweight, I wouldn't want to think of myself as being a victim of some disease. That would make it too easy for me to accept it, rather than do something about it.

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            • #21
              Yep, I agree with your last post kathleen, obesity is NOT a disease, but it can lead to a countless numbers of diseases, because it is not healthy getting too fat...
              "All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident."

              - Schopenhauer

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              • #22
                But Slacker, you DID do something even though you knew it was a disease. Other obese people though, they are not as capable as you? Their personal autonomy is not as important as yours?

                Recently a prominent researcher was reprimanded because he had been arguing that public health research should not be made available to the public- he thought it was better if people like him shaped their access to scientific information to fit what he wanted them to know.

                Obese people are being treated like they are either mentally deficient, or, as Macey suggests, morally deficient, by people who happened to be lucky in the disease lottery... and by other obese people.
                “In God we trust; all others must bring data.” W. Edwards Deming
                Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by aspexil
                  No courage. Sheer desperation/fear. I don't want to die of a heart attack like many of my friends and colleagues my age. Or have to get stents either. And I'd like to look trim one day before I do go. So just a little bit of narcissism too.
                  Narcissism and vanity are honestly the best motivators, I think. I decided I needed to lose weight because I couldn't fit into my jeans, not because I stepped on a scale, or a doctor told me to.

                  Kids these days are taught not to care what they look like, or what others think. People leave the house looking like they don't care, and many of those people are obese. I don't know whether it's a correlation to obesity, but people have a lazy, easy-fix mentality. Jeans don't fit? Buy a new pair! Better yet? Throw on some yoga pants, they're stretchy.
                  Stumbled into Primal due to food allergies, and subsequent elimination of non-primal foods.

                  Start Gluten-Free/Soy-Free: December 2012; start weight 158lbs, Ladies size 6
                  Start Primal: March 2013, start weight 150lbs, Ladies size 6
                  Current: 132lbs, Ladies size 2
                  F/23/5'9"

                  26lbs lost since cutting the crap.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by loafingcactus View Post
                    But Slacker, you DID do something even though you knew it was a disease.
                    I think we're both on the same side here but perhaps my post was poorly worded and I apologize for that.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Slacker62 View Post
                      I think we're both on the same side here but perhaps my post was poorly worded and I apologize for that.
                      I think so to (anyone willing to call out the fat-shaming on this board is), and I don't think an apology is necessary... just looking at where things start skidding the wrong direction.
                      “In God we trust; all others must bring data.” W. Edwards Deming
                      Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by loafingcactus View Post
                        But Slacker, you DID do something even though you knew it was a disease. Other obese people though, they are not as capable as you? Their personal autonomy is not as important as yours?

                        Recently a prominent researcher was reprimanded because he had been arguing that public health research should not be made available to the public- he thought it was better if people like him shaped their access to scientific information to fit what he wanted them to know.

                        Obese people are being treated like they are either mentally deficient, or, as Macey suggests, morally deficient, by people who happened to be lucky in the disease lottery... and by other obese people.
                        When did I mention morality or suggest a deficiency in morality causes obesity? Eating too much poor quality food and not getting enough exercise isn't an issue of morality and obesity isn't about luck. There are millions of formerly obese people who have had the strength to get healthy and it is an insult to suggest to them that they were lucky. Much of this thread is about the necessity of avoiding victimhood. Everyone on this forum has a really good excuse every day to make bad choices.
                        Man seeks to change the foods available in nature to suit his tastes, thereby putting an end to the very essence of life contained in them.
                        www.primaljoy.co.uk

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Ummm... No.
                          In any American doctors office this woman would be advised to lose weight.
                          https://www.google.com/search?q=sent...-u%3B800%3B523
                          She doesn't look unhealthy to me. And she has never seen a modern food that you are blaming her weight on.
                          Only in this backwards culture where the poor can be heavy does the role reversal of thinner and thinner become the ideal.
                          “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                          ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                          And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Socioeconomic factors have a lot to do with it. I don't know that most would agree that being stupid, poor or lazy is a type of disease though.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by MaceyUK View Post
                              When did I mention morality or suggest a deficiency in morality causes obesity? Eating too much poor quality food and not getting enough exercise isn't an issue of morality and obesity isn't about luck. There are millions of formerly obese people who have had the strength to get healthy and it is an insult to suggest to them that they were lucky. Much of this thread is about the necessity of avoiding victimhood. Everyone on this forum has a really good excuse every day to make bad choices.
                              You previously stated that obese people were failing in self control. Your contempt for them was just shown again here. It comes through in every post I have ever seen you write.

                              Please show me the newborn who chose obesity. Yes some will develop obesity for reasons we can already identify in their genes and gene activation environment, and some who live very similar lifestyles will not. And then, in addition to managing their disease, they will manage the contempt they get from people like you.

                              ETA: Oh, and do you know what the success rate for the management of obesity is? It is minuscule. So what you are saying is that if someone with obesity is not even a hero of the level of heroism that you cannot even imagine (I've done it and Im doing it again, I know whereof I speak) you have the privilege of looking down on them. That self-satisfied arrogant position of luck is what *I* have total contempt for.
                              Last edited by loafingcactus; 06-19-2013, 03:01 PM.
                              “In God we trust; all others must bring data.” W. Edwards Deming
                              Blogging at http://loafingcactus.com

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                I started this thread to discuss the implications of defining obesity as a disease, not why people are fat in the first place.

                                I don't believe in treating people like victims. I don't believe that will help the problem, just as much as I don't see how isolating autistic and ADHD kids in "Special Ed" classes will help them acclimate to the modern environment in which their social disorders cause suffering.

                                What I think is that people need to be taught how to deal with their own "diseases." Yes, it's going to be harder for the autistic kid to learn some things. It's also going to be harder for the kid with the 6 genes related to obesity to keep the weight off. But just because you've got something challenging, why should everyone else treat you like a victim? We all have challenges and setbacks. I don't think it's an excuse. I know an overweight diabetic person, who continues to eat things like wheat products and sugary pastries. It makes me very sad to watch her be so reliant on the insulin shots, yet continues on her unhealthy habits that probably caused it in the first place.

                                There is the element of personal freedom, yes, eat your donuts, keep your diabetes. But a disease? This is simply a by product of lifestyle and food available. Fix the environment, fix the food (I can go on and on about the lack of transparency in the USA's food; we don't get the right to know what's in our food to protect 'trade secrets'). Bad approach to try to fix the person who became fat because their body was acting the way it should, by storing fat.

                                Treat the cause, not the symptom. But alas, it's all economically driven in this country.
                                Stumbled into Primal due to food allergies, and subsequent elimination of non-primal foods.

                                Start Gluten-Free/Soy-Free: December 2012; start weight 158lbs, Ladies size 6
                                Start Primal: March 2013, start weight 150lbs, Ladies size 6
                                Current: 132lbs, Ladies size 2
                                F/23/5'9"

                                26lbs lost since cutting the crap.

                                Comment

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