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  • #16
    Originally posted by ProtoAlex View Post
    The good news is: Every man has a built in barometer of heart health that tells you each morning whether things are going well or not. If your barometer turgidly points up then your heart is doing well, if you get no reading (like many aging men) most mornings then there are some issues.
    Not reliable. I had a heart attack despite regular morning glory
    Four years Primal with influences from Jaminet & Shanahan and a focus on being anti-inflammatory. Using Primal to treat CVD and prevent stents from blocking free of drugs.

    Eat creatures nose-to-tail (animal, fowl, fish, crustacea, molluscs), a large variety of vegetables (raw, cooked and fermented, including safe starches), dairy (cheese & yoghurt), occasional fruit, cocoa, turmeric & red wine

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    • #17
      My wife doesn't believe that my diet is what keeps me slim and healthy. She attributes my 10kg weightloss wholly to my exercise regime. Just to prove her point she started walking and meditating every day and lost a couple of kilos. But then she stopped taking her multi in advance of surgery and had no energy to keep exercising. Only supplements I take are D, Mg & Zn

      There isn't even any point discussing it with her. She won't read what I read. I just tell her I'll listen to her when she's slim and healthy
      Four years Primal with influences from Jaminet & Shanahan and a focus on being anti-inflammatory. Using Primal to treat CVD and prevent stents from blocking free of drugs.

      Eat creatures nose-to-tail (animal, fowl, fish, crustacea, molluscs), a large variety of vegetables (raw, cooked and fermented, including safe starches), dairy (cheese & yoghurt), occasional fruit, cocoa, turmeric & red wine

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Bushrat View Post
        Unless she is prepared to change her mind then she won't. No amount of evidence will do that. And arguing with her will just force her to dig in her heels because people have a hard time admitting they were wrong (or that everything that thought they knew and advocated is bullshit). Proving it with your results is the best bet.
        Not completely true. I was a CW health-nut for the longest time, and laughed at the people who eventually got me into primal eating. It started with a book, and their results... 8 months later, I'm a changed woman!

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        • #19
          Wow, thanks to everyone for the advice so far! Unfortunately, if it's in the book, it's automatically disqualified as a point of evidence. She's, to put it mildly, not a fan of Mr. Sisson, or as she calls him, "The Space Lord" (See cult leader). I've tried pointing things out from the book, studies and whatnot, and things from the site, and it's the standard "Well there's just as much evidence showing the opposite" response.

          But I'll definitely recommend her to Mr. Taubes work, and the "Show me the science" link was great! I'm beginning to think she'll never be convinced, but maybe I can at least get her to not think I'm in a cult.

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          • #20
            Heh, the whole "there's just as much evidence for X proposition" thing always makes me scratch my head.Reality doesn't contradict itself, it is either that something is the case or it is not (or I suppose it could be the case under one condition but not another, either way...) and so we have to admit that some of this purported evidence is bunk and doesn't demonstrate what people say it does. We actually have to have the discussion.
            Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

            Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

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            • #21
              I would advocate you NOT ask her to read good calories/bad calories right off the bat. That's a hardcore book that 75% of people can't wrap their heads around. There is just TOO MUCH DETAIL for the layman to grasp. I would rather have you suggest she read Taubes newer book, "Why we Get Fat". It's kind of like GCBC for the everyday reader, much easier to comprehend and still well written and sourced. I would also suggest the Paleo Solution by Robb Wolf (granted she has already read your copy of the PB). Then go about living the lifestyle and she will see all the positive changes in you and jump on board regardless.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Stabby View Post
                Heh, the whole "there's just as much evidence for X proposition" thing always makes me scratch my head.Reality doesn't contradict itself, it is either that something is the case or it is not (or I suppose it could be the case under one condition but not another, either way...) and so we have to admit that some of this purported evidence is bunk and doesn't demonstrate what people say it does. We actually have to have the discussion.
                Most people though are never taught how to evaluate arguments (let alone statistics) and so they have to rely on appeals to authority, and since you can get an 'academic' to publish just about anything, there ends up being a mountain of evidence on either side and people's heads metaphorically explode and they can happily go on not having to upset their world view. And God forbid you try to explain why X's argument/position/scientific paper/study is wrong; people's eyes become Krispy Kremes.
                A steak a day keeps the doctor away

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                • #23
                  That last comment gave me a great mental image, heh.

                  I understand that it is annoying to have to debate the finer points of an issue, especially when one is over one's head in new information, I don't like the feeling of not understanding and I certainly don't like finding out that I'm wrong about something and that there was this whole other complicated view of things that I was previously ignorant about. But then the task becomes to learn to like it. It's not like someone has to change their mind all at once. Best to ruminate, but only if it's a genuine speculation.
                  Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

                  Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

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                  • #24
                    As has already been said - most people who ask for scientific evidence are either looking to be told what to do or want something to 'push back' against. Intelligent, reasoned people find their own research and come to conclusions themselves.
                    Sandbag Training For MMA & Combat Sports
                    Sandbag Training Guide on Kindle
                    The Complete Guide To Sandbag Training
                    Brute Force Sandbags
                    www.facebook.com/sandbagfitness
                    http://fitedia.com/ - Health and Fitness eBooks, video, audio and workshops

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                    • #25
                      Following up on Stabby's point, maybe just start with the first step, you don't need to sell her the whole program. There is plenty of evidence out there that grains, but most importantly gluten grains, are not good for anyone. If she has nagging health concerns that might be a selling point. I would work on compiling evidence for gluten-avoidance first. Dr. Davis at Heartscan blog, Dr. Eades at proteinpower blog, and Dr. Hyman at HuffPost are all good advocates for gluten-free, and Robb Wolf has an excellent post at 4 Hour Body called How to Keep Feces Out of Your Bloodstream. There's also tons of info at celiac.com.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Bushrat View Post
                        Most people though are never taught how to evaluate arguments (let alone statistics) and so they have to rely on appeals to authority, and since you can get an 'academic' to publish just about anything, there ends up being a mountain of evidence on either side and people's heads metaphorically explode and they can happily go on not having to upset their world view. And God forbid you try to explain why X's argument/position/scientific paper/study is wrong; people's eyes become Krispy Kremes.
                        @.@
                        Ancestral Health Info

                        I design websites and blogs for a living. If you would like a blog or website designed by someone who understands Primal, see my web page.

                        Primal Blueprint Explorer My blog for people who are not into the Grok thing. Since starting the blog, I have moved close to being Archevore instead of Primal. But Mark's Daily Apple is still the best source of information about living an ancestral lifestyle.

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                        • #27
                          What is PB? OR are you talking about blood pressure (BP)?

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by happyme View Post
                            What is PB? OR are you talking about blood pressure (BP)?
                            PB = Primal Blueprint.
                            -James
                            Just a n00b

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                            • #29
                              I have nothing to add besides this:

                              Dang, Quelsen! You are mighty convincing!

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                              • #30
                                Buy and read all the books from my Amazon Store.

                                Or you could go to Paleo Pepper's blog. She is collecting a huge archive of links about every aspect of the Primal/Paleo lifestyle.
                                Last edited by Bodhi; 06-06-2011, 10:16 AM. Reason: Added link to Paleo Pepper's blog
                                ...how do you look, feel, and perform? -- Robb Wolf

                                My Blog.

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