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Pretend NonPrimal Foods: good or bad?

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  • Pretend NonPrimal Foods: good or bad?

    I bought this low-carb pumpkin bread - not 100% primal but I thought it would be a good 'transition' food and good for the kids. So yesterday I had some with my breakfast egg, and today... it was toasted pumpkin bread and tea for breakfast.

    I realized then that this sort of thing is quite dangerous when you're trying to make changes: it's just like the lazy toast-and-tea snack that I'd have instead of real food before I started doing PB. Because it's 'mostly' good stuff, it's easier to rationalize than regular bread, but even while it's low carb and got some reasonable nutrition, it's really a cheat.

    Ditto for the pancakes: if I understand it correctly, the omega-3s in flax or nut flours are going to be damaged by frying.

    I see a lot of us (self included here) looking for stuff - marmite, mayo, biscuits, breads - that are part of conventional eating habits. We want a bowl of porridge-like stuff or toast-like stuff for breakfast, and a biscuit with our coffee and a sauce for our meat.

    As an occasional treat, these are good, but I have to question their value if they are frequently used. It seems to me that they are likely to keep us firmly entrenched in our old ways.
    Last edited by Helen in Oz; 05-20-2010, 09:06 PM. Reason: better title

  • #2
    I totally agree Helen. imo, it's not about finding substitudes for the unhealty things, it's about ditching them and replacing them with biologically appropriate foods. There is no 'bread' that is primally acceptable regardless of the flour it's made from. Mayo is fine - it's just oil and eggs and can easily be made primally.

    K



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    • #3
      Originally posted by cillakat View Post
      Mayo is fine - it's just oil and eggs and can easily be made primally.
      liar, liar, liar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      I've tried and failed to make mayo 3 times, following the directions to a T. Fuck.

      OK, the show's over, move along...
      I began this Primal journey on December 30th, 2009 and in that time I've lost over 125 LBS.

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      • #4
        I think it's only something each person can decide for themselves. One person's slippery downward slope is another's first step forward in a journey of a thousand miles.

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        • #5
          I totally disagree. It doesn't have to be all-or-nothing. I'd rather see somebody make gradual changes and stick with it than be totally primal for one month and then say "screw it" while diving face-first into a pile of Twinkies because it was too drastic a change.

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          • #6
            Perhaps 'good or bad' was not a good choice of words.

            That's why I got some - to help with this transition phase.

            Ultimately, aren't most of these things just another kind of 'fake'? I could have my sorta-primal bread and butter with a cup of black tea for breakfast, my salad with my nearly-primal mayo for lunch and my dinner with meat and veg the arrowroot-thickened gravy for dinner, oh and my coffee with cream of course with some chocolate, and maybe a low-carb flax muffin... is this primal or am I living the same as I always did, really?

            Surely at some point we need to let go of the crutches and be content with sometimes having an empty stomach, with grabbing a handful of nuts and a bit of fruit, or a big roasted hunk of meat and some veggies and be done with it. We sort of talked about this a bit in the "over analyze" thread.

            Not saying we should never have traditional family foods, that we need to squat by the fire with our meat on a stick (though damn that would be fun, if it wasn't for the fire bans). Just seems to be a bit of a theme I've noticed in my own food and on the forum.

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            • #7
              to me, part of this is about our health. We are all here I suspect because we want to change our eating habits. We've learnt from reading the blog, the book, the forums, that too many carbs and sugars and trans fats are bad for us, making us fat, causing inflammation etc. Good stuff, I never knew it before or else never really paid attention to it.

              However, freaking out and worrying about what I'm eating (or not eating, or wanting to eat) seems just as bad for me! If I feel like a piece of bread, I'll have a piece of bread, (knowing that there might be a healthier bread option out there is certainly appealing for those times when the craving for bread hits). I'm lengthening my life with the subtle changes made, perhaps over time I'll completely adapt and stuff I normally crave/want/desire will pass, but in the meantime, I am not going to stress. Each to their own, some dive straight in, others like to dip their toes in the ocean before they get in but if they really want a swim, they eventually get in the water fully. And if they dont, they get out!

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              • #8
                I think this becomes sort of an elitist "I'm better than you because I eat plain roasted meat and veg, not like you with your bacon mayo and almond flour pancakes." I've seen threads like this before and just wonder what the big deal is.

                If someone love pancakes, why wouldn't it be awesome for them to start making almond flour pancakes with berries on top instead of Bisquick with tons of Aunt Jemmima's maple flavored corn syrup on top?

                BAS with real mayo is the bomb, and I don't see how it's a crutch in any way.

                I don't mind baking the occasional treat for my kiddos and friends, or when I'm entertaining guests, but I really like having primal alternatives and have fun experimenting with these. They are much healthier for my body so I use them.

                I personally don't make breads or use gluten free breads or other products because since being diagnosed celiac and finding primal, I have really enjoyed delving into this new way of cooking and eating. But I think there's definitely a place for primal waffles, sugar free bbq sauce recipes, and DEFINITELY mayo! lol It's all about why imo. Are you guzzling diet pop because you love fizz? If so why not try kombucha? Your 3 yr old wants cupcakes for his birthday? Why not make them with coconut flour? Is there really a need to become purists?
                The more I see the less I know for sure.
                -John Lennon

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by lil_earthmomma View Post
                  Is there really a need to become purists?
                  In my opinion.... no!

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                  • #10
                    Interesting. I took the post to mean, essentially, is it harmful or helpful to sub cw foods for primal versions when those primal versions may be not be primal.

                    If someone's doing it as move to get away from SAD, then yes, it's so much better. No doubt about it.

                    Is it really primal? No. But I certainly wouldn't begrudge anyone their own food choices. I make my own - good and bad - all day every day.




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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Helen in Oz View Post
                      Ultimately, aren't most of these things just another kind of 'fake'? I could have my sorta-primal bread and butter with a cup of black tea for breakfast, my salad with my nearly-primal mayo for lunch and my dinner with meat and veg the arrowroot-thickened gravy for dinner, oh and my coffee with cream of course with some chocolate, and maybe a low-carb flax muffin... is this primal or am I living the same as I always did, really?
                      It's more veggies. But it's definitely not primal.

                      Originally posted by Helen in Oz View Post
                      Surely at some point we need to let go of the crutches and be content with sometimes having an empty stomach, with grabbing a handful of nuts and a bit of fruit, or a big roasted hunk of meat and some veggies and be done with it. We sort of talked about this a bit in the "over analyze" thread.
                      Yes, yes, yes and yes.

                      K



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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by lil_earthmomma View Post
                        I think this becomes sort of an elitist "I'm better than you because I eat plain roasted meat and veg, not like you with your bacon mayo and almond flour pancakes." I've seen threads like this before and just wonder what the big deal is.
                        Oh I hope not, that's not my intention at all.

                        Everyone is at different places: I know my approach would probably be shredded by 'elitists', especially if we got into an exercise discussion!

                        I think the main point I'm making is: lots of time and effort making it look like the old stuff, and still staying in the same mental place. (is that going to help the cravings, or perpetuate them?)

                        If someone love pancakes, why wouldn't it be awesome for them to start making almond flour pancakes with berries on top instead of Bisquick with tons of Aunt Jemmima's maple flavored corn syrup on top?
                        I'm making them on an almost daily basis. But is the cooked almond flour sabotaging my omega3? If we're talking optimizing, should these be a rare treat?

                        Your 3 yr old wants cupcakes for his birthday? Why not make them with coconut flour? Is there really a need to become purists?
                        That's different. Go the cupcakes for sure. I'm not talking treats - I'm talking daily habits.

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                        • #13
                          I edited the title to ditch the "good or bad" to "help or hinder" which might be more useful.

                          Nothing against mayo btw - just came to mind cos I've seen a couple of recipe threads.

                          The Natufians made a sort of grain flatbread; I guess they were Neolithic... I've still got a lot of prehistory to brush up on!

                          Maybe continuing to live as always but just finding good, healthy substitutions for CW food is something that will really work well for most people, and it's certainly something that most of the other 'low carb' type sites I've browsed seem to aim for. Maybe my looking at it with suspicion is because I'm overall not content with modern life; I always feel that there's an artificiality to everything that we do. Not sure what is at the root of that.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Helen in Oz View Post

                            That's different. Go the cupcakes for sure. I'm not talking treats - I'm talking daily habits.
                            I can see where you're coming from. I've seen a couple of threads that get into a more primal less primal than thou and I just think it's ridiculous. You're right, focusing on health should be the main goal.
                            The more I see the less I know for sure.
                            -John Lennon

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                            • #15
                              I think different things work for different people. I said when I started that I was an all or nothing kind of a person, which is why I was so successful at the beginning when I began my anti-inflammatory diet brought to me by my PT, before I became primal. I was SO desperate to make a change to my life that the 'rules' about what I should and shouldn't eat were what I needed to point me in the right direction.

                              Once I had lost over 30 pounds, I let a few non-primal things back in and whilst I didn't put any weight on, my form went a bit 'puffy' and I wasn't as toned - that was the inflammation kicking back in from a few (gluten-free) crackers, more cheese than a little bit, the odd biscuit or whatver and so on. There's my true proof that for me, I need to be really rather strict with myself. But that doesn't mean other people can't go 80/20, or whatever works for them.

                              Since going back to 100% primal, it seems as if my body has received a wake-up call on all fronts. And psychologically i feel much more balanced (if not overwhelmingly positive) than I did when I was back-sliding too much for me.

                              Each to their own. We're none of us perfect!

                              Grok on...

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