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Is monogamy worthwhile; is there a point to it?

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  • #31
    Originally posted by bloodorchid View Post
    A majority of people who say they prefer it actually prefer it

    sometimes a cigar is just a cigar
    Indeed. There's no need to use subliminal messages in poetry to "free" someone else's mind to preferring non-monogamy...Oh, sorry, wrong thread!

    Originally posted by Cryptocode View Post
    Back in the 50's, it used to be that people married for 3 big reasons:
    1. To have children and do your best raising them,
    2. To build an estate (capital) sufficient for your retirement and possible sickness. At that time it was considered really bad if you had to live with your children because you had insufficient capital to support yourself in old age.
    3. To have the company of a long term partner until the end of your life.

    I'm not sure that #2 is at all possible today

    So it depends upon your own personal goals. You're young now with strong hormones and drives. That will change in time and your desires will change. It's important to determine your own life goals and stick to them.
    The security and peace of having someone that you know will be will you his/her whole life. Growing together, learning together, working together. I personally love building my life with Knifegill. He’s my BFF . He makes me laugh and is strong where I am weak. He knows me so well and is so honest that he helps me to grow and be a better person. Sure, we have our off-days, but since we're in it for the long-haul, we stick together, grow together, and make it work. We're better people in the process. I wouldn’t want it any other way.

    This marriage, of course, would be a whole lot harder if I didn't trust Knifegill. But, that's why I made sure I married someone that I respected, made me laugh, was honest with me, and helped me to be a better person. Don't get involved with someone that doesn't share your goals and you can't see living your life with, and make sure that person is someone you can trust to be in the relationship for the long-haul.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by bloodorchid View Post
      A majority of people who say they prefer it actually prefer it

      sometimes a cigar is just a cigar
      LOL!

      DH and I have actually in the past discussed a commune style something or other with maybe 3 couples, maybe in a fluid sexual arrangement, and their offspring. We live in a house that could snugly accommodate the whole bunch, I think. Economically, it seemed like the smartest possible option, especially if one or two adults were willing to be at home full time. We could just never see how it would work emotionally over the long term. Getting two people to negotiate the sticky stuff is tough enough.

      If what we have now is a pathetic substitute for what we might have had, I guess it's true, ignorance is bliss, lol.

      And thank you, KG, for the slut pond! Best chuckle I've had in a few days.
      50yo, 5'3"
      SW-195
      CW-125, part calorie counting, part transition to primal
      GW- Goals are no longer weight-related

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      • #33
        You got to remember, too, that love is not just a feeling, it's a verb. That's right, kids, luv is a verb.
        Crohn's, doing SCD

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        • #34
          Monogomy works for me, and I would not want to be with someone who didn't feel the same way. Of course, it wasn't the first person I ran across that I decided to marry and raise a family with... so for the first 21 years of my life I was not really monogamous. But, once he came around it was just that one person for me and that's that. I couldn't imagine raising children without a bonded partner and the security is comforting.

          I think it is such hard work to date and partner seek. I conserve my energy and stick with one man and I hope he sticks with me. 27 years and counting. It hasn't always been easy. It hasn't always been what I thought I wanted. I'm glad I stuck it out and it feels good to know someone who knows me so well will be there for me when I am old.

          Maybe I am boring. Who knows?
          sigpic
          Age 48
          Start date: 7-5-12
          5'3"
          121lbs
          GOAL: to live to be a healthy and active 100


          "In health there is freedom. Health is the first of all liberties."
          Henri Frederic Amiel

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          • #35
            Originally posted by magicmerl View Post
            I think it is. I'm not yet 40 but our house mortgage is <$40K.
            Good on you, MagicMerl! This raises my hopes. Do you think it depends upon where you live?
            "When the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." - Alston Chase

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            • #36
              You should study anthropology. There are many life ways that humans have lived. In some cultures you marry relatives. Also study primatology. You can see the elements of many our behaviors in apes.

              I think having grown up in our culture, a non-monogamous relationship is bound to end in jealousy. Serial monogamy seems to be the "best" we can do to be non-monogamous.
              Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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              • #37
                OP wrote: This brings me to what I'm pondering now; is there any point to monogamy? Is there a point in investing in a single person, when cheating seems such the norm? Is there a point trying to navigating the murky depths of what is appropriate and inappropriate between your partner and the opposite sex? Is there a point when you feel that cheating should mean instant break up, but you don’t know what constitutes cheating? Wouldn’t it be simpler to date multiple people, so there is never any ambiguity? So you never waste your time?

                To OP, you wonder if there is any point to monogamy. There are plenty of people that are monogamous. Just like there are plenty of people that aren't. Being monogamous means means staying with your partner and not cheating. People stay together for different reasons. It could be financial, societal pressures, sexual or emotional (or all of them together). Anyway, you mention how your g/f is quite in love with you. And if cheating occurred it would be over. You are wondering if it's all worth it.

                Several people are trying to say that monogamy is unnatural...but humans are more than just sexual beings. You need to define what your limits are...not everyone will agree with your limits (or lack thereof). You are 23. If you fear certain outcomes, then you'll never take a risk (except sexually).

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Cryptocode View Post
                  Good on you, MagicMerl! This raises my hopes. Do you think it depends upon where you live?
                  For sure. The big three things are what your income is, what your expenses are, and what the house costs. If our house cost more than a million dollars, then we wouldn't have nearly paid off the mortgage

                  Of course, it's also because most first time homeowners aren't prepared to live in 'first time homeowner' houses in our modern entitlement culture.
                  Disclaimer: I eat 'meat and vegetables' ala Primal, although I don't agree with the carb curve. I like Perfect Health Diet and WAPF Lactofermentation a lot.

                  Griff's cholesterol primer
                  5,000 Cal Fat <> 5,000 Cal Carbs
                  Winterbike: What I eat every day is what other people eat to treat themselves.
                  TQP: I find for me that nutrition is much more important than what I do in the gym.
                  bloodorchid is always right

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                  • #39
                    I find all the responses here quite interesting and balanced, I don't see anybody trying to force their opinion, it seems laid back and basically "do what you feel works for you".
                    I think part of the problem is that I don't know what works for me. I've dated several women at once, but it was only on an extremely casual level. I'm not sure I could date multiple girls when my girlfriend thinks I'm the love of her life.
                    Despite my uncertainty I'm not really in a position to date around. Working life sucks, I'm dead tired all day and have little time to hang out.

                    I do think its worth clarifying with my girlfriend, the nature of the relationship and what her boundaries are. Then from there we'll both have a clearer idea of how to make each other happy, and not upsetting each other.
                    http://lifemutt.blogspot.sg/ - Gaming, Food Reviews and Life in Singapore

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                    • #40
                      I don't know about monogamy, but later in life divorce will cost you. Almost every couple I know that is doing well financially have been together since a couple years after college or longer. No matter whether you're the primary income source or not, after a number of years, or if children are present, divorce sets you back financially. So, marry someone you'll want to be with for a very long time, or be a one percenter who can afford to lose half of your assets every time you change your mind.
                      "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                      B*tch-lite

                      Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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                      • #41
                        Does no more sloppy seconds count as plus for monogamy?

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by AMonkey View Post
                          I think part of the problem is that I don't know what works for me. I've dated several women at once, but it was only on an extremely casual level. I'm not sure I could date multiple girls when my girlfriend thinks I'm the love of her life.
                          Despite my uncertainty I'm not really in a position to date around. Working life sucks, I'm dead tired all day and have little time to hang out.

                          I do think its worth clarifying with my girlfriend, the nature of the relationship and what her boundaries are. Then from there we'll both have a clearer idea of how to make each other happy, and not upsetting each other.
                          You are young. You should not commit to anyone right now.

                          The thing with the way humans pair up or otherwise join together is that there is no culture on earth that does not have rules around it, some a lot more strict and with a lot less equality between the sexes than the basic serial monogamy of modern Western culture. Having rules around how to join households is as old as humanity and isn't something you can just do away with. Maybe even older than humanity. It appears to be some kind of innate thing.

                          In the end, it is very difficult to bond with people in a way that does not fit in with the culture you live in. This is not a value judgement, just a reality. You can try whatever you like, but you do risk being hurt or hurting others because we are all enculturated with certain norms, whether we think we buy into those norms or not. Sometimes you just have to experiment to find your way.
                          Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                            You are young. You should not commit to anyone right now.

                            The thing with the way humans pair up or otherwise join together is that there is no culture on earth that does not have rules around it, some a lot more strict and with a lot less equality between the sexes than the basic serial monogamy of modern Western culture. Having rules around how to join households is as old as humanity and isn't something you can just do away with. Maybe even older than humanity. It appears to be some kind of innate thing.

                            In the end, it is very difficult to bond with people in a way that does not fit in with the culture you live in. This is not a value judgement, just a reality. You can try whatever you like, but you do risk being hurt or hurting others because we are all enculturated with certain norms, whether we think we buy into those norms or not. Sometimes you just have to experiment to find your way.
                            +1
                            The Champagne of Beards

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Cryptocode View Post
                              Back in the 50's, it used to be that people married for 3 big reasons:
                              1. To have children and do your best raising them,
                              2. To build an estate (capital) sufficient for your retirement and possible sickness. At that time it was considered really bad if you had to live with your children because you had insufficient capital to support yourself in old age.
                              3. To have the company of a long term partner until the end of your life.

                              I'm not sure that #2 is at all possible today

                              So it depends upon your own personal goals. You're young now with strong hormones and drives. That will change in time and your desires will change. It's important to determine your own life goals and stick to them.

                              you just left social pressure and family shaming off of the list entirely...?

                              half of my ancestry is italian, one grandparent for each parent, and they both have some unmarried aunts in the picture. Not a friendly lifestyle niche for that generation.
                              "Ah, those endless forests, and their horror-haunted gloom! For what eternities have I wandered through them, a timid, hunted creature, starting at the least sound, frightened of my own shadow, keyed-up, ever alert and vigilant, ready on the instant to dash away in mad flight for my life. For I was the prey of all manner of fierce life that dwelt in the forest, and it was in ecstasies of fear that I fled before the hunting monsters."

                              Jack london, "Before Adam"

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
                                You are young. You should not commit to anyone right now.

                                The thing with the way humans pair up or otherwise join together is that there is no culture on earth that does not have rules around it, some a lot more strict and with a lot less equality between the sexes than the basic serial monogamy of modern Western culture. Having rules around how to join households is as old as humanity and isn't something you can just do away with. Maybe even older than humanity. It appears to be some kind of innate thing.

                                In the end, it is very difficult to bond with people in a way that does not fit in with the culture you live in. This is not a value judgement, just a reality. You can try whatever you like, but you do risk being hurt or hurting others because we are all enculturated with certain norms, whether we think we buy into those norms or not. Sometimes you just have to experiment to find your way.
                                Originally posted by secret agent girl
                                I think you're asking the wrong question. I wonder why you are getting so quickly and deeply invested in a relationship before putting in the requisite time to ascertain your partner's values and build the trust necessary for viable monogamy. Assuming that's what you want. You appear to be leaning that way, but seems like you are exploring other options.
                                all of this
                                beautiful
                                yeah you are

                                Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
                                lol

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