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  • #91
    Originally posted by TheyCallMeLazarus View Post
    It is not new that women use ridiculous metrics to gauge their attractiveness. (Or, in my opinion, are told so by men) What I DO find new and kind of troubling is that there seems to be just a few distinct "camps" of women in regards to fitness, many of which are not healthy.

    1) Women (and many more men) that don't give a rat's behind, are on the SAD, and spend an inordinate amount of time deriding anyone that looks better than them out of jealousy. Make no mistake, this is the vast majority. You walked around lately? Ain't too many women that look remotely like anyone in any of those pics, skinny or ripped. Sad but true. I hear from some of my female friends that for them it's even more grim....

    2) Women that use genetic and diet freaks as metrics for their fitness. Yes, Hannah Davis is low body fat, has no "thigh gap", and has breasts. That is called a genetic jackpot, as is the case with some models. No, she isn't starving. She's just lucky. Get over it. Many others that MIMIC this genetic luck are concerned JUST with the aesthetics of the mainstream definition of attractiveness, which is unhealthy, unrealistic, then pushed upon them by insane women and insecure men. Some men and women can be healthy AND be low BF% AND attractive. It's genes. I say this because I have always found it silly when a woman or man can't just say "wow, they look amazing." Not every attractive woman plays with Mr. Pukey. Not every ripped guy is on roids. I'm a baseball fan, and I love the phrase "Sometimes, you just have to tip your hat to them."

    3) The "true health" camp of women, like the ones on here, or your local Amazon chick at the gym deadlifting 400#. They hate that group #2 gets any attention, whether that is from being genetic freaks or masochists. They see other women that are weak, prissy, likely unhealthy, and get pissed that men give them attention at all compared to them....to which I say relax! These women are just NOT crazy or genetic jackpot winners. They were probably headed down #1 or #2, didn't like what they saw, and DID something about it. That is the most attractive feature any woman (or likely man) can have: The drive to improve themselves in ways that don't just count in the mirror.

    Which is why I don't find it weird at all to ask on a first date: "So, what do you deadlift?"
    You sound very angry at women in general to feel the need to characterize us this way. We all "hate" or "are jealous" of members of your other groups, and especially of the ultra-slender women who won your genetic lottery. You are upset we won't compliment women we think look extremely unhealthy, whose body fat may be in the single digits. Why so?

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    • #92
      Which is why I am currently wearing a pencil skirt and a straight jacket.
      Pic or it did not happen

      http://maggiesfeast.wordpress.com/
      Check out my blog. Hope to share lots of great recipes and ideas!

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      • #93
        *Slightly Off Topic Rant*

        I love live music so I spend a lot of time in bars. I see a lot of couples from the young to the old.

        I see a lot of thin guys with chubby gals. I see thin gals with pot-bellied men. I see thin with thin and fat with fat.

        It's all cool.

        What confounds me the most, however, is tall guys (6'+) with SHORT gals (5'3 or shorter). If this was an occasional phenomenon, I might not get so bent about it. But, I see it all the freaking time! And, as a 5'11 female, I'm jealous of those little ladies. I'm married now (he's 5'9!), but except for one or two notable exceptions, I've only seemed to attract the shorter guys. I always wanted to date someone I could literally look up to. Alas, it was not to be.

        I do love my husband, but I prefer for him to stand on the curb and me in the street when we kiss in public.

        I know - I went kind of off topic. But, if we're talking about what men find attractive in women, why do the tall guys like their women 8" inches shorter than they are? What's wrong with my long legs?

        *Done Ranting*

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        • #94
          Something I've never quite understood is why it's considered acceptable to talk down about people being too skinny, yet people generally come to the defense of anyone considered 'curvy'.

          As an ectomorph growing up, I was constantly told I needed more meat on my bones, needed to eat more, needed to stop starving myself, asked if I was anorexic or bulimic. In spite of eating all I could, mostly things people considered highly fattening, and only vomiting in cases of severe illness. I was constantly being offered food at get-togethers, if I ever refused I was told I should eat more. Media constantly told me that aspiring to be as thin as I was already was dangerous and signaled eating disorders, that curvy women were sexier than matchsticks, that if I didn't gain weight I would always look like a prepubescent boy and who the hell finds that attractive? What made it even more demoralizing was seeing that people who were overweight were constantly given outs. Hormone problems, can't afford healthy foods, not enough time to exercise, they are just naturally 'big' or 'curvy'. No one ever came to my rescue for being naturally thin.

          I've gotten a lot more comfortable with my body over time, but I still flinch when I hear people saying those same things over and over.
          Primal Journal

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          • #95
            I agree with TheyCallMeLazarus, and Quies. The funniest thing is when the same women throw out double standards when it comes to what an attractive male looks like(fit, rich, dresses nice), and will in the same vein call a fat or skinny poor male unattractive, but when the sword is turned against them, they will profusely claim all women are attractive, and they shouldn't have to be held up to the same standards
            Last edited by Derpamix; 06-27-2013, 06:42 PM.
            Make America Great Again

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            • #96
              Originally posted by Incindiary View Post
              What confounds me the most, however, is tall guys (6'+) with SHORT gals (5'3 or shorter). If this was an occasional phenomenon, I might not get so bent about it. But, I see it all the freaking time! And, as a 5'11 female, I'm jealous of those little ladies. I'm married now (he's 5'9!), but except for one or two notable exceptions, I've only seemed to attract the shorter guys. I always wanted to date someone I could literally look up to. Alas, it was not to be.

              I do love my husband, but I prefer for him to stand on the curb and me in the street when we kiss in public.

              I know - I went kind of off topic. But, if we're talking about what men find attractive in women, why do the tall guys like their women 8" inches shorter than they are? What's wrong with my long legs?

              *Done Ranting*

              Tell me about it! I'm 5'9 1/2 and my last two boyfriends have been 5'6 and 5'8 respectively. I'm sure all the slouching has been terrible for my posture. Also, they were both really insecure about the height difference, and were always mentioning it. It didn't bother me at all at first, but gradually I started to feel weird because they seemed to have such a hang-up about it. Also, many men who claim to be 6' tall actually seem to be closer to 5'9 because I usually seem to be taller than they are when we stand next to each other, and I don't wear crazy heels or anything.

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              • #97
                I hate the word curvy. I see it used as a euphemism for "overweight". Quies is right. A lot of women will come up with any excuse to put another woman down.
                As God is my witness, I'll never be hungry again.

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                • #98
                  Quies makes a point about what may at times be a double-standard. I may not have gotten the degree of grief you describe but certainly got some of the same attitude from even well meaning family--it sucks.

                  But when I saw that "thigh gap" link, it was on Pinterest, where people promote what they like or think is cool. As a goal being promoted out to other women, especially young women, it seems misguided. It seems arguably unhealthy. Like bound feet.

                  “you aren't what you eat - you are what you don't poop.” Wavy Gravy

                  Today I am Fillyjonk. Tommorow I will be Snufkin.

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                  • #99
                    Originally posted by Quies View Post
                    Something I've never quite understood is why it's considered acceptable to talk down about people being too skinny, yet people generally come to the defense of anyone considered 'curvy'.

                    As an ectomorph growing up, I was constantly told I needed more meat on my bones, needed to eat more, needed to stop starving myself, asked if I was anorexic or bulimic. In spite of eating all I could, mostly things people considered highly fattening, and only vomiting in cases of severe illness. I was constantly being offered food at get-togethers, if I ever refused I was told I should eat more. Media constantly told me that aspiring to be as thin as I was already was dangerous and signaled eating disorders, that curvy women were sexier than matchsticks, that if I didn't gain weight I would always look like a prepubescent boy and who the hell finds that attractive? What made it even more demoralizing was seeing that people who were overweight were constantly given outs. Hormone problems, can't afford healthy foods, not enough time to exercise, they are just naturally 'big' or 'curvy'. No one ever came to my rescue for being naturally thin.

                    I've gotten a lot more comfortable with my body over time, but I still flinch when I hear people saying those same things over and over.
                    Seriously, you think it's considered socially unacceptable to talk down to women who are overweight or obese, and on the rare instances it does happen someone comes to their defense and puts down the critic? I'm wondering how it can be you and I live in such different realities. Media blankets us with the message that obese people are to blame for society's ills. It is socially acceptable to discriminate against obese people in hiring. "Fat-shaming" is considered a moral imperative, on the idea that people who are fat don't know it's universally considered disgusting and would simply choose differently if they were harassed enough.

                    Even "curvy" women are constantly told they are an assault on the eyes of onlookers who think every self-respecting woman should have "thigh gap" and a concave belly.

                    Society needs to keep women in their place, and the easiest way to do it is have an ever-moving standard that no one can meet for more than a moment in time.

                    Comment


                    • Quies,I was the same way growing up, my Mom used to say "eat it's good for you" whether it was cake or meat. I wasn't trying to be thin it was just how my body was and trust me no one found it attractive, not the girls or the boys. I was always teased for having skinny legs and a flat chest. One time a friend of mine came to my defense and called the boy who called me "flat chested" dickless, boy did that shut him up. The girls were not much kinder I remember overhearing some of my "friends" referring to me as a late, late, late bloomer.

                      My legs don't touch at all and as far I know no one is finding that irresistibly attractive, it could be because it's not offset by buoyant boobs.

                      At any rate this thread comes back to the tired and worn out conversation of discussing women's bodies in terms of what is more attractive. The ideal form will always be unattainable for the majority insuring discontent in the majority. Discontent sells.
                      Life is death. We all take turns. It's sacred to eat during our turn and be eaten when our turn is over. RichMahogany.

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                      • @eKatherine
                        "You are upset we won't compliment women we think look extremely unhealthy, whose body fat may be in the single digits."

                        Absolutely not. I am suggesting that people grow the hell up, both men and women....I can tell you as a man, we have our own "societal ideal" that we are expected to live up to. We are supposed to be rich providers, to own nice cars, dress up, act like James Bond on a date and be hypermasculine the rest of the time. We are supposed to be physically imposing, have a full head of hair, speak directly, and not be too sensitive.

                        And if you, as a man, listen to THAT voice, you are a juvenile. If you let that voice get to you, you need to do some actual growing up and become a man. It is okay for you to be bohemian or sensitive or write French poetry or have toothpick arms or be bald... It's part of being a man. A real man doesn't judge himself by other men. He judges himself by the man he used to be, and wakes up every day trying to be better than he was the day before. That is part of maturing, to tell that voice to go fist itself

                        What I am suggesting, and always applaud, is for women to do that same. Yes, some men are much richer and fitter and drive faster cars than me. That's okay. Tip my hat. Well done man, but it ain't my concern. I compete with me, not you. I am suggesting that women have the same standard applied to them....a man is considered a juvenile to me if he still listens to that artificial, materialistic voice that society tells him he needs to be. He acts wealthy when he's not. He wears TapOut shirts 3 sizes too small. He is an infant inside. A boy in a man's muscles.

                        What I am suggesting is not at all that women should worship that voice from society. They should tell it to go to hell, give credit where it is legitimately due, just as men should do. I'm not suggesting women should conform. I am suggesting they should stop listening, like I have for the stupid BS I'm told I should be. BIG difference.
                        Last edited by TheyCallMeLazarus; 06-27-2013, 07:34 PM.
                        "The soul that does not attempt flight; does not notice its chains."

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by eKatherine View Post
                          Seriously, you think it's considered socially unacceptable to talk down to women who are overweight or obese, and on the rare instances it does happen someone comes to their defense and puts down the critic? I'm wondering how it can be you and I live in such different realities. Media blankets us with the message that obese people are to blame for society's ills. It is socially acceptable to discriminate against obese people in hiring. "Fat-shaming" is considered a moral imperative, on the idea that people who are fat don't know it's universally considered disgusting and would simply choose differently if they were harassed enough.

                          Even "curvy" women are constantly told they are an assault on the eyes of onlookers who think every self-respecting woman should have "thigh gap" and a concave belly.

                          Society needs to keep women in their place, and the easiest way to do it is have an ever-moving standard that no one can meet for more than a moment in time.
                          I didn't say that someone comes to their defense every time but I see it happen reasonably often whereas I have never seen it happen for someone who is skinny. I see laws against weight discrimination popping up, talk of food deserts, obesity as a disease... While models showing a little bone are considered to be promoting eating disorders. "Thin-shaming" is considered a moral imperative, on the idea that people who are thin don't know it's universally considered disgusting and would simply choose differently if they were harassed enough.

                          I frequently see people bragging about being curvy rather than thin and had never heard of a thigh gap until today.

                          Different experiences, different perspectives.
                          Primal Journal

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                          • Originally posted by namelesswonder View Post
                            Just a nice measly 4 each way . With a safe route, I'd totally be willing to ride farther. I can do at least 12 miles in a trip on fairly level ground, but I haven't done a "how far can I go?" trip in over a month.
                            Oh, that's nothing in the rain! Just get a good rainkit. I use Spiewak.

                            Originally posted by Incindiary View Post
                            What confounds me the most, however, is tall guys (6'+) with SHORT gals (5'3 or shorter). If this was an occasional phenomenon, I might not get so bent about it. But, I see it all the freaking time! And, as a 5'11 female, I'm jealous of those little ladies. I'm married now (he's 5'9!), but except for one or two notable exceptions, I've only seemed to attract the shorter guys. I always wanted to date someone I could literally look up to. Alas, it was not to be.
                            I'm a 5'3" male. Those tall guys taking all the shorter women make it that much harder. Lucky for me I got a long term relationship these days.

                            M.

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                            • it's all fun and games until someone tells you that you need to check your "thin privilege".
                              Make America Great Again

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                              • Originally posted by magnolia1973 View Post
                                Camera phone, mirror. Points if topless with nice abs. Assume you are a guy.
                                Here we go: First pic ever on here. I want bonus pts!

                                Close up pic.jpg
                                "The soul that does not attempt flight; does not notice its chains."

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