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  • #31
    Originally posted by Rojo View Post
    I've seen little evidence of this "big thinking". Libertarianism largely stole its precepts and rhetoric from anarchism, stripped away the Marxism and re-purposed it to quash democracy.
    The American system of Government is NOT supposed to be a Democracy. It's supposed to be a democratically elected Republic

    Would I be putting a grain-feed cow on a fad diet if I took it out of the feedlot and put it on pasture eating the grass nature intended?

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    • #32
      Originally posted by JoanieL View Post
      Huh? Do you know what anarchism is? Or maybe I don't.
      You don't.

      There's government and then there's the state. A collectivity making decisions democratically is government. The police, FBI, military, etc.. is the state. It exists to safeguard private property.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by kenn View Post
        Stalin would approve
        Big thinking.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Scott F View Post
          The American system of Government is NOT supposed to be a Democracy. It's supposed to be a democratically elected Republic

          It's also "supposed" to be ruled by white men. Times change.

          Democracy means "rule by the people". Aren't you one of the people?

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Rojo View Post
            It's also "supposed" to be ruled by white men. Times change.

            Democracy means "rule by the people". Aren't you one of the people?
            Bull shit, you racist. After reading you reply to JoanieL you don't know what you are talking about. This system of government was/is supposed to be based upon philosophical principals and laws that were reasoned out over prior centuries. You have a long line of moral philosophy that led to the the Founders' integrating that into the government they set up.

            Just like modern people are smug about presupposing Grok was a dumb ass caveman, which he was not. Modern people presuppose the Founding Fathers didn't have the luxury to have at their disposal what we know about political history. If anything, they were much better studied and read then people today are. They had access to, and read, up on Greek and Roman democratic systems and how/why those democracies failed.

            That video I posted is very accurate, historically. Did you even watch it or are you too busy?
            Would I be putting a grain-feed cow on a fad diet if I took it out of the feedlot and put it on pasture eating the grass nature intended?

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Scott F View Post
              They had access to, and read, up on Greek and Roman democratic systems and how/why those democracies failed.
              We still have that access, plus two-hundred years more experience. Since the Founding Fathers: industrial revolution, Darwin, electricity, mass media/communication, internet.

              That video I posted is very accurate, historically. Did you even watch it or are you too busy?
              I can't. I'm at work. But, boy, I wish you guys would look past youtubes.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Rojo View Post
                We still have that access, plus two-hundred years more experience. Since the Founding Fathers: industrial revolution, Darwin, electricity, mass media/communication, internet.
                Of what relevance is that....really? 200 years more experience...when evolutionary, wise, your emotional and psychological values and needs are exactly the same as Grok's. Just because you/we have access to the internet and mass media that doesn't mean squat if the time spent is on....what color Snooky's cloths are today.


                Originally posted by Rojo View Post
                I can't. I'm at work. But, boy, I wish you guys would look past youtubes.
                And what's wrong with YouTube? You credit the internet as giving us an advantage over the Founders. YouTube is just like anything else. It's and information medium...so are books. It's all in how you use it and access that info - is the info accurate.

                If I want to know how to install something like a GE dishwasher I can look it up on YouTube and have someone show me what to do......in much the same way Grok would've asked someone to teach him how to do something in person. It's the accuracy of the learning and not the source that counts. And the same can be said about political philosophies irregardless of the color of skin that thinking came from.
                Would I be putting a grain-feed cow on a fad diet if I took it out of the feedlot and put it on pasture eating the grass nature intended?

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by Rojo View Post
                  Big thinking.
                  Just keeping it at your level
                  Starting Date: Dec 18, 2010
                  Starting Weight: 294 pounds
                  Current Weight: 235 pounds
                  Goal Weight: 195 pounds

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                  • #39
                    Fellas Fellas! Let's just say you are both right!

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Scott F View Post
                      Of what relevance is that....really? 200 years more experience...when evolutionary, wise, your emotional and psychological values and needs are exactly the same as Grok's.
                      The world around us has changed immensely.


                      And what's wrong with YouTube?
                      Nothing. But if you don't venture past youtubes, you won't learn much.

                      It's the accuracy of the learning and not the source that counts.
                      Sure. Now can we stop referencing the Founding Fathers.

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                      • #41
                        The Founding Fathers broke the law and committed treason against the government at that time. Now, average citizens are expected to obey the laws that the founders created, while the elite have the money and power to get around these laws. Sounds familiar...

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by itchy166 View Post
                          I think eating Primal is a huge political statement. Its the rejection of corporate/consumerism, along the same lines as avoiding banks, buying used clothing, gardening, hunting, turning off your TV, home schooling, etc.

                          As the movement grows, look for more and more articles attacking the lifestyle, and/or watch governments try and stop it (unpasteurized milk in the U.S. or ridiculous marketing standards for vegetables in the EU for example).

                          There isn't a government on the planet that wants a population of independent, clear-headed, strong, healthy Groks running around....
                          In fact I'd not thought of connecting paleo with politics, but now that you ask I think Itchy has it right here.

                          I was born into a Military family so I began as a Republican, before the days of neo-cons. I was very active in Goldwater's campaign and was very sorry he lost.

                          After that I was busy completing my PhD, getting married, having children and beginning my career. I didn't seriously think about national politics again until I retired. We used to have a social understanding that each person should "do his civic duty" and that our society was one containing a wide variety of civil institutions and organizations.

                          My husband and I each did our "civic duty" as did our friends. In our state, all offices below the state level are non-partisan. He was mayor for 12 years, I was planning commissioner for city, county, and sub-state. Then enough was enough, we had performed our civic duties to the best of our abilities and had never been in it for riches or power.

                          Today even those concepts "civil duty" and "civil societies" are completely gone, along wilth most civil institutions. Over the years I voted for both party presidents fairly evenly, and learned not to trust either party.

                          After retirement I studied economics for 6 years and that really opened my eyes. In the US there are basically 3 schools of economics, Keyensian (at most Ivy league schools), Monetary (the Chicago School) and Austrian (the Von Mises Institute - which is now expanding to many southern Univs). They have a site - mises.org. The Austrian school is also very active in teaching HS and undergraduate students classical economics and classical-liberal history and economic history. As a mathematician and physicist I cannot accept the math and statistics used by the Keyensians and Monetarists.

                          But I do think Obama has an idea there, in his $1T coin. If we can have the Chinese buying our completely worthless dollars now, maybe they will take the cool-aid coin. I shows Obama has accepted reality.

                          After this education, no more neo-lib or neo-con for me. I'm a Libertarian, and further, an anarcho-capitalist. I think our history, along with that of many other attempts at limited fovernment, proves that limited government is impossible. Once started, like cancer, there is no stopping the monster from growing eternally.



                          So now, I have a question for you all. What would our country look like under the perfect conditions you would create if you were God or Totally Magic?

                          Somehow, I think that Paleo people are going to be more similar than not on this.
                          "When the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." - Alston Chase

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Cryptocode View Post
                            After retirement I studied economics for 6 years and that really opened my eyes. In the US there are basically 3 schools of economics, Keyensian (at most Ivy league schools), Monetary (the Chicago School) and Austrian
                            How about Marx? I don't see how you can fully accept "free market" capitalism if you haven't studied it's most trenchant critic. Due diligence.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by john_e_turner_ii View Post
                              The Founding Fathers broke the law and committed treason against the government at that time. Now, average citizens are expected to obey the laws that the founders created, while the elite have the money and power to get around these laws. Sounds familiar...
                              This is by far the dumbest comment I have ever read on this forum

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Rojo View Post
                                How about Marx? I don't see how you can fully accept "free market" capitalism if you haven't studied it's most trenchant critic. Due diligence.
                                Yes, I also studied Marx. Marx is taught in all 3 schools. But Marx was in error, which occured early in his analysis. It goes like this:

                                The inputs are 3 factors, Rents (or land), labor, and materials. The output, or product, is sold ( a risk factor here) at a price higher than the sum of the 3 input factors. Marx attributes the gain or profit to an unrecognized additional labors' input, and does not attribute it to the organizations' owner or originator, the person who rented and supplied the materials, and hired the laborers and paid them while they were working.

                                Consider, The owner paid the laborers before the product was sold. If the laborer wants to make something by first saving some of his pay, using that saved money to buy materials without any return pay at that time, then sell the product and finally get his return on his investments, he is welcome to do so.

                                Marx never included interest on investment. In fact he didn't really believe in interest. That owner we speak of could have not been an entreprenour but instead invested his money as a share of someone else's enterprise and probably gained the same return on investment (interest). But then the laborer would never have been hired.

                                Marxian economice is taught as a full degreed course at U.C. Berkley if you're interested.
                                "When the search for truth is confused with political advocacy, the pursuit of knowledge is reduced to the quest for power." - Alston Chase

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