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  • #31
    Originally posted by RitaRose View Post
    My brother has a saying: Life is so much better now that I no longer give a shit.

    Sounds really horrible until you realize there's some truth to it.

    At my work, we had a few guys that hauled ass to get their routes done super-human fast so they'd look like the model employees. The rest of us hustled, but we didn't literally run our routes, we just walked really fast. These guys never got promotions. All they got was more and more work added to the routes (so more and more stress added to their work days) and stuck in the same position with the rest of us waiting to get laid off.

    I'm not saying you shouldn't try and do a good job. That's just having a good work ethic. But I do think there's this idea that, if we work our asses off doing stuff we hate, there will be some kind of reward at the end, and that's not always true. You have to find your reward in daily life.

    I know what you are talking about. Employers tend to give those who produce more work.

    In my field, there was no place to move up, so coworkers were cutting about keeping themselves in the spotlight as big "personalities" or tooting their own horns over being the best. I didn't do it, and they think you're incompetent if you don't blow a loud horn.

    In my field, if you don't do the work, no matter how much, you're out. They can bring someone else in, because the field is so saturated. Believe me, there are people who will work for almost nothing to get experience.

    I agree about not expecting any big reward for working hard. In this economy, the only reward is having a job, period. Having an income one can get by on.

    I agree about trying to find rewards in life, I think truly, our reward is just ecking out a living. Just having a roof over our heads, food on the table, a warm place to sleep. Those are our rewards.

    Comment


    • #32
      I wasn't suggesting that you do what I do. I was simply pointing out that you are not the only person on the planet struggling with stress.

      That being said, since you are not working now, you might as well take on pocket-jobs to bring in some income or improve your quality of life.

      Work-study at a yoga studio, for example, will teach you some skills for handling stress and make your body feel better. You'll probably have to do light cleaning in exchange for classes.

      Dog walking or dog-sitting, as another option, will bring in a little extra income, get you some movement, and also some quality time with animals which decreases stress. Is it enough to "make a living?" Maybe, I have no idea -- it honestly depends. But, until you find a job that pays what you want or need, this is at least some income coming in to offset some stress in terms of income.

      Other pocket jobs include house cleaning, general handy-person jobs, gardening and yard work, doing basic walk-around work (ie, handing out flyers to different offices and such -- we are hiring a person to help us with this) . . . there are all kinds. We're lucky in that there's a local network here through a website. I can post a job with the amount I'm willing to pay, and with this, I can also find jobs that I'm willing and able to do (and earn a bit of extra cash).

      I just find that it takes some economic pressure off to do some side gigs.

      Comment


      • #33
        Also, I understand issues such as saturated markets and so on. It's like this in my field. It's why I went into business for myself.

        The issue with over-working is generally about mind-set. Ultimately, the boss cannot give you more work than you can reasonably do in the time for which you are contracted to work. They can let you go, but going through the process of replacing you is harder than mitigating the work load by either A. better orchestrating the work-flow logistics or B. hiring on more employees to manage the workload.

        Business is generally responsive. If they can get more work out of you, they will. Lots of businesses work this way -- even yoga businesses (it's partly why I'm out of the studio system altogether and have been for years, and also why i started my own business which is utilizing a different business model than the typical studio system). But, you can hold your line, recognizing that your health and well being are important not only for you, but for productivity at the company.

        If, as an employee, you create clear boundaries (they do not have to be spoken or advertised) and do your work well, then the company will respond in kind. It's a living entity, and if it's healthy, it's highly responsive.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by doublehelix View Post
          I haven't had them tested. I don't have any medical insurance so I can't have them tested.

          What did they do for you to reduce the cortisol??
          Unfortunately my adrenals had pretty much quit by the time I got tested and were producing almost no cortisol any more. My doctor says a few years earlier my cortisol was probably quite high but that's not documented since no one was testing me for that. Apparently the adrenals will keep trying to meet the demands until they just can't any more. I did have unusually high insulin levels earlier, and now insulin is low.

          The treatment is all naturopathic (a standard MD will just give synthetic hormone replacements) and insurance didn't cover the tests. I'm not an expert in this by any means, it's just my own experience talking. The one thing I know is that cortisol and melatonin have opposite functions. So you may get some improvements if you can increase your body's production of melatonin. This means going to bed early, not being exposed to artificial light after nightfall, no TV, no computer monitor, and getting up with the sun. Short-term supplementation with melatonin at bedtime may help too but try not to use it for months because the goal is to get your body to produce the right hormones at the right time on its own.

          Check out my journal thread or PM me if you wish. I don't get on the forum every day but I know this type of situation can be very tough and I'd like it if my experience can help someone else. (Also ditto what everyone said about the job stress. Life's too short to be miserable.)
          My Primal Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57034.html

          "...since our orthodox theories have not saved us we may have to readjust them to bring them into harmony with Nature's laws. Nature must be obeyed, not orthodoxy." Weston A. Price

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by zoebird View Post
            I wasn't suggesting that you do what I do. I was simply pointing out that you are not the only person on the planet struggling with stress.

            That being said, since you are not working now, you might as well take on pocket-jobs to bring in some income or improve your quality of life.

            Work-study at a yoga studio, for example, will teach you some skills for handling stress and make your body feel better. You'll probably have to do light cleaning in exchange for classes.

            Dog walking or dog-sitting, as another option, will bring in a little extra income, get you some movement, and also some quality time with animals which decreases stress. Is it enough to "make a living?" Maybe, I have no idea -- it honestly depends. But, until you find a job that pays what you want or need, this is at least some income coming in to offset some stress in terms of income.

            Other pocket jobs include house cleaning, general handy-person jobs, gardening and yard work, doing basic walk-around work (ie, handing out flyers to different offices and such -- we are hiring a person to help us with this) . . . there are all kinds. We're lucky in that there's a local network here through a website. I can post a job with the amount I'm willing to pay, and with this, I can also find jobs that I'm willing and able to do (and earn a bit of extra cash).

            I just find that it takes some economic pressure off to do some side gigs.

            I didn't want to get into these details, but here goes. If I make any money, it's deducted from unemployment, so it doesn't get me ahead. I don't make 200 a week with my unemployment, but if I make any money, they deduct it. I have been doing some freelance work, and it won't monetarily get me ahead, but it will be nice on my resume.

            I am living off money I saved when I worked, but it won't last forever. But there are no "pocket jobs" that can boost my situation, I'd have to go off unemployment and as I explained, it won't add to that.

            I know how to get a job, and I can guarantee you that any low pay job I have applied for, no one has contacted me.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by zoebird View Post
              Also, I understand issues such as saturated markets and so on. It's like this in my field. It's why I went into business for myself.

              The issue with over-working is generally about mind-set. Ultimately, the boss cannot give you more work than you can reasonably do in the time for which you are contracted to work. They can let you go, but going through the process of replacing you is harder than mitigating the work load by either A. better orchestrating the work-flow logistics or B. hiring on more employees to manage the workload.

              Business is generally responsive. If they can get more work out of you, they will. Lots of businesses work this way -- even yoga businesses (it's partly why I'm out of the studio system altogether and have been for years, and also why i started my own business which is utilizing a different business model than the typical studio system). But, you can hold your line, recognizing that your health and well being are important not only for you, but for productivity at the company.

              If, as an employee, you create clear boundaries (they do not have to be spoken or advertised) and do your work well, then the company will respond in kind. It's a living entity, and if it's healthy, it's highly responsive.
              Again, in a saturated profession, you make demands and they will bring someone else in. Companies expect good work, they do not give you allowances or considerations for doing what you're paid to do. I am not out of school in this, I have a lot of experience.

              I am an educated professional and I know my profession. If you are able to make demands on employers in yours, then you are far more in demand!

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by Wrenwood View Post
                Unfortunately my adrenals had pretty much quit by the time I got tested and were producing almost no cortisol any more. My doctor says a few years earlier my cortisol was probably quite high but that's not documented since no one was testing me for that. Apparently the adrenals will keep trying to meet the demands until they just can't any more. I did have unusually high insulin levels earlier, and now insulin is low.

                The treatment is all naturopathic (a standard MD will just give synthetic hormone replacements) and insurance didn't cover the tests. I'm not an expert in this by any means, it's just my own experience talking. The one thing I know is that cortisol and melatonin have opposite functions. So you may get some improvements if you can increase your body's production of melatonin. This means going to bed early, not being exposed to artificial light after nightfall, no TV, no computer monitor, and getting up with the sun. Short-term supplementation with melatonin at bedtime may help too but try not to use it for months because the goal is to get your body to produce the right hormones at the right time on its own.

                Check out my journal thread or PM me if you wish. I don't get on the forum every day but I know this type of situation can be very tough and I'd like it if my experience can help someone else. (Also ditto what everyone said about the job stress. Life's too short to be miserable.)
                Thanks for the response and I will check out your journal!
                I have been using Melatonin, since I worked a lot of nights for awhile. I thought it would help.
                I was wondering what treatments they gave you, even if naturopathic. I can't get to a doc right now with no
                insurance.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Yes, I suppose therefore that there are no solutions what so ever and you are doomed to a life of cortisol and problems that come with it.

                  Know why? Lots of people have provided you with a lot of information and help, and you basically can't do any of it. Can't walk dogs, can't do a yoga class in exchange for light cleaning, can't do a doctor's appointment (most naturopaths are independent of the allopathic system, and many do exchanges or work on a sliding scale), aren't interested in breathing techniques and you have the worst job on the plante and no one can possibly understand the conditions of that work environment both in terms of when you are in that work environment as well as in terms of finding a job in that field.

                  So, you are right. Nothing you can do.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by zoebird View Post
                    Yes, I suppose therefore that there are no solutions what so ever and you are doomed to a life of cortisol and problems that come with it.

                    Know why? Lots of people have provided you with a lot of information and help, and you basically can't do any of it. Can't walk dogs, can't do a yoga class in exchange for light cleaning, can't do a doctor's appointment (most naturopaths are independent of the allopathic system, and many do exchanges or work on a sliding scale), aren't interested in breathing techniques and you have the worst job on the plante and no one can possibly understand the conditions of that work environment both in terms of when you are in that work environment as well as in terms of finding a job in that field.

                    So, you are right. Nothing you can do.
                    I am sorry if you have misunderstood my responses.
                    This is getting too much into my personal business, and while I have provided some information, this is way out of control.
                    I never said I wasn't interested in some of the responses. Yes, I can't do a doctor's appointment. That's not hard to understand, and if you don't have to struggle looking for work, you are lucky and rejoice in that.

                    Now, with that, I am done.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Try adaptogens

                      Originally posted by doublehelix View Post
                      Does anyone know how to control cortisol levels?
                      I am eating meat, eggs, nuts, vegetables. Pretty Paleo.
                      I can't control the stress. I can't out--think it. I've tried all kinds of
                      relaxation...works for a few minutes until the next stressful situation.
                      Anyone have any experience with this?
                      While you learn the skills of relaxation, etc. you can improve your biochemical response using adaptogenic herbs. For example, Revolution Macalibrium is a combination of phenotypes of maca (maca-OG) and is useful for men while it's sister product is clinically tested Femmenessence for women (maca-GO). You can try these and then spend the time learning the skills. Hormones and neurotransmitters are incredibly important for the stress response, but it isn't about one or two organs (adrenals or liver). It isn't just cortisol so be careful about modulating cortisol levels alone. The company offers medical team support as well if you have further questions about your condition. This is a difficult position to be in, but being Paleo is the right start. You may find that you need minimal grains in your diet. The rules are the rules, but if your body does better with a little more carbs, don't feel like you're cheating if you have some quinoa, rice or a potato once in a while.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by zoebird View Post
                        Yes, I suppose therefore that there are no solutions what so ever and you are doomed to a life of cortisol and problems that come with it.

                        Know why? Lots of people have provided you with a lot of information and help, and you basically can't do any of it. Can't walk dogs, can't do a yoga class in exchange for light cleaning, can't do a doctor's appointment (most naturopaths are independent of the allopathic system, and many do exchanges or work on a sliding scale), aren't interested in breathing techniques and you have the worst job on the plante and no one can possibly understand the conditions of that work environment both in terms of when you are in that work environment as well as in terms of finding a job in that field.

                        So, you are right. Nothing you can do.
                        Zoebird is nailing something here, though it might be hard for you to accept the message.

                        I see a lot of my old self in your responses.

                        I have built a small business up for the last 15 years. Most of that time was horribly stressful. Additionally, I have an anxious (Type A or whatever) personality type. I am truly surprised that I don't have adrenal fatigue. The worst times involved suicidal thoughts, depression, etc.. The best times were not relaxed or enjoyable.

                        About a year ago I realized that even when I didn't feel stressed, I still was stressed. How did I figure this out? Mindfulness. Yoga is a great suggestion because it suits anxious people in having a motion to focus on. But even just learning how to get out of your thoughts so you know not to take them so seriously is a major step. Once I learned how to do this throughout the day, my life changed. I still do my work well but I have a life now and I'm sure I've reduced my Cortisol levels. I just feel different.

                        Why did it take me so long to get to this point? I had friends and family who suggested meditation, etc. I was stressed and I just "knew better" that all I had to do was get through the external situation to feel better. It's bullshit. All I had to do was retrain my mind to know that the external situation was temporary and not make it worse by how I thought about it or how often I thought about it. It's really hard to break out of this mentality. It's totally worth it, though.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          I think it's really the way you look at your job. If you think what you are doing is fun, there really shouldn't be so much stress. Isn't there like some 90-something year old surgeon who still performed surgery? I remember seeing a documentary with him and he was still sharp as a knife, despite the industry supposedly creating a lot of stress and inflicting wear and tear on each person in it.
                          My chocolatey Primal journey

                          Unusual food recipes (plus chocolate) blog

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by doublehelix View Post
                            I didn't want to get into these details, but here goes. If I make any money, it's deducted from unemployment, so it doesn't get me ahead. I don't make 200 a week with my unemployment, but if I make any money, they deduct it. I have been doing some freelance work, and it won't monetarily get me ahead, but it will be nice on my resume.

                            I am living off money I saved when I worked, but it won't last forever. But there are no "pocket jobs" that can boost my situation, I'd have to go off unemployment and as I explained, it won't add to that.
                            The lovely thing about odd jobs like dog-sitting is that you can work on a cash basis. What the unemployment agency doesn't know won't hurt them. The unemployment benefits system is run pretty stupidly and if you can successfully work around it I suggest you do so.

                            EDIT: Also, I agree with others that it is your own negativity that is paralyzing you, not your situation. You need to get up and do SOMETHING. Seriously, just go for a damn walk, a nice long one (one of the many benefits of being unemployed is that you can go for long walks whenever you like). While you are walking, maybe think of something you would like to do when you get back. And then when you get back, do it--at least get started on it. Don't sit down in front of your TV or computer, do something that involves moving your body and preferably puts you in contact with other human beings. Then maybe you won't feel so sorry for yourself for a little while, and all of the excellent advice people are giving you will seem more useful to you.
                            Last edited by Uncephalized; 10-09-2012, 12:48 PM.
                            Today I will: Eat food, not poison. Plan for success, not settle for failure. Live my real life, not a virtual one. Move and grow, not sit and die.

                            My Primal Journal

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