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  • #31
    Serious brain chemistry issue. Eat more fat.
    The Champagne of Beards

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    • #32
      Before asking what to do differently, it will be great to get a full picture of what you've got as a norm right now.

      What we know:

      You maintain 1300-1650 cals for 4-5 months, losing 18 lbs in the process (10% Body weight)
      Normally you do not experience hunger
      You had a quick regain of 4 lbs
      You have a physically demanding job and do some slow movement
      You have a lot of stress in your life
      Relaxation techniques lead you to depressive soul-searching
      you have a past history of reverting the weight loss

      What we do not know:

      Your macros and food choices (save for pumpkin seeds)
      Alcohol, dairy, fruits
      sleep status
      which supplements you are taking, including seaweeds, bone broth?
      did you recalculate your BMR to account to 20 lbs loss, and did you use Mifflin's equation to calculate it?

      Here is what I can tell you: 10% loss in body weight is a normal point to plateau. Pushing past this plateau is possible but often results in Bad Things Happening. I honestly believe that 4 lbs you are seeing is not a trend but a budge/some sort of re-balance. Changing one variable for 2 weeks may help you to stabilize your weight and after that start losing. The easiest variable in your case is macros, probably. Do a fat fast. Or, if your fats are high jack up protein. Drop all fruit or dairy if you are using it. Change just one thing and stick for 2 weeks. See what's up.

      I highly recommend Susan Alber's book "But I deserve this chocolate!" as it has a very short summary of a lot of psychological traps and how to avoid them by changing your thinking. I know, it irritates you and is too new agey and all that, but most people fail to lose weight not because they follow a bad diet or do bad exercise. They do it because they pay little attention to what they are thinking and where it takes them.

      Do not do a radical change. One thing. Stick. See what happens. Keep both eyes on the road, not one eye on the goal, or it will take longer to walk to the destination.
      My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread57916.html
      When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by parrottrl View Post
        Mediation makes me bored, anxious, antsy, and tends to focus me on the bitter aspects of my life and life in general.
        Everything makes you mad.

        You have a ton of obligations that you set yourself up for, which make you mad and resentful.

        But you think that 'being thin' is going to truly make you happy?

        See your comment about meditation? That's what it's supposed to do. Introspection isn't all rainbows and happiness and insta-enlightenment. It hurts. I've done it, and I continue to do it. It's amazing what bubbles up from the depths - but you have to re-experience it and move on, not pack it back in there like overstuffing a pillowcase.

        Until you peel those layers away, you could even lose 50 more lbs, but you're still going to be miserable.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by HotRodKristina View Post
          Everything makes you mad.

          You have a ton of obligations that you set yourself up for, which make you mad and resentful.

          But you think that 'being thin' is going to truly make you happy?

          See your comment about meditation? That's what it's supposed to do. Introspection isn't all rainbows and happiness and insta-enlightenment. It hurts. I've done it, and I continue to do it. It's amazing what bubbles up from the depths - but you have to re-experience it and move on, not pack it back in there like overstuffing a pillowcase.

          Until you peel those layers away, you could even lose 50 more lbs, but you're still going to be miserable.
          HRK is right. I'm reading your posts, and you are so unhappy, babe. It's not going to get better because you are thinner. I lived a life of hurt and anger. I starved myself to thin -- really thin. I looked great. And guess what: I still made poor choices and was ridiculously unhappy. I've had two horrible marriages, during both of which I suffered abuse and/or neglect. But I looked great while doing it! I've worked four jobs, gotten four degrees, and ended up suicidal.

          Please consider the suggestion of getting some good counseling. There are many affordable options out there. You need to value yourself -- love yourself -- enough to want more than just a pants size. You are worth so much more than that. But you've boiled your beliefs down into what you weigh, and shoved aside any happiness or joy you might ever have.

          Your frustration isn't about being Paleo/Primal -- it's about everything else in your life. When you move on to something else, you'll offload that frustration onto the next thing that allows you to avoid dealing with the real problem: your self-value.
          The Sedition of Sisyphus: Go Find Another Rock

          Griff's Cholesterol Primer

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          • #35
            I have to agree with everybody else - thin isn't the key to being happy. Doing things that make you happy is the key to being happy. If you went all low-fat and starved yourself down to your goal weight you'd still be in the same situation with the same stresses, the same dog, the same looming career, the same lack of time. You'd just also be half-starved.

            Honestly, it sounds like you're half-starved already. The amount of calories you're consuming is clearly not enough for the work you do. Whatever course you take in the future, I would suggest you eat more.

            The Play prescription doesn't mean "do the things on this list." It means every day, do something that is fun and relaxing for you. Chill out, in whatever way works best for you. It doesn't sound like you're doing that.

            Why did you give up video gaming? Video games are play. I play a significant chunk of Warcraft to unwind every week. I goof around online with my online friends. I read, I watch TV. Every now and then for me play is also going out for a bike ride, because I like being outdoors when the wind is blowing. But if you're reading the PB and only doing the "play" that Mark specifically calls out, it's not going to work unless those things are actually fun and relaxing for you.

            I guess the last thing I would say is, if you're miserable with your boyfriend and your schoolwork and your job and your upcoming career, you're not going to be happy until you make changes in those areas. Looking at the PB and deciding that's the big problem when it's just a tiny layer on top of all the other stresses in your life is not going to help.

            If, for you, PB is the straw that broke the camel's back, I would say, don't try to fix the straw; fix the load it landed on.

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            • #36
              By the way, I didn't see anyone mentioning this, but you do know that your stress prevents you from losing weight, right?
              Everything is bad for something - How do you feel today?

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              • #37
                I'm curious as to what you're eating. Could you give us a day's typical menu or a macronutrient breakdown?

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                • #38
                  It sounds to me like some serious pms coupled with high stress.

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                  • #39
                    Honestly I am a little scared for you. This level of rage and stress is hugely worrying, and it sounds to me like you need to get your priorities in order. Being thin isn't going to make you less angry at your life, or less resentful at your partner, or less stressed about your job.

                    You can get help for this for free. You don't need to pay. You can do body strengthening exercises for free by lifting yourself or heavy items around your apartment/home.

                    Does your boyfriend (and I hesitate to use this term as you also called him "aging partner" - how old is he?) help out around the house? Is he incapable of earning an income? Does he get government assistance? Is he, in any way, supporting you - be it emotionally, financially, or just by "doing things?" If not, why are you with him? I assume you must love him but you appear hella resentful which does not for a good relationship make.

                    Eating primal is probably the easiest "diet" I've ever tried. If your job is as physically demanding as you think it is, you're not eating nearly enough calories. Eating primal shouldn't leave you exhausted.
                    yay!

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by parrottrl View Post
                      None of the primal-approved ways to chill work for me. Working out leaves me seething with rage. Play, even more so because it's so time-wasting and juvenile. Mediation makes me bored, anxious, antsy, and tends to focus me on the bitter aspects of my life and life in general. I'm too poor to do CrossFit and have trouble finding a safe place to run (and build up my rage while doing it).

                      I cannot relax anymore. I'm in graduate school, my boyfriend moved in, I have a dog and a job that is far from ideal. I have completely lost the things I truly loved doing - video gaming, reading, writing - in favor of too much other people, other obligations in my life. I'll never get them back, because when I finish school, I'll have to work even harder, put in more hours to advance my career, so I can make enough money to take care of an aging partner.

                      All I want is to be thin so I can at least feel confident and be comfortable with myself while doing all of this.
                      Oh, I see. You're unhappy. Being thin isn't going to make you happy. You probably can't believe that right now, but it won't. You know what might? Fixing the laundry list of problems you just wrote down.

                      You chose to go to grad school even though it sounds like you don't like it. You chose to have your boyfriend move in even it though it sounds like you don't like that either. You chose to pile your plate up and advance your professional career instead of living with less and having more free time. You can also undo these choices if that's what you decide would be best for you. You don't have to do anything. You could go live in a hut with a gaming PC and an Xbox 360 and make your living as a freelance writer if you wanted.

                      You choose.
                      Today I will: Eat food, not poison. Plan for success, not settle for failure. Live my real life, not a virtual one. Move and grow, not sit and die.

                      My Primal Journal

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                      • #41
                        There are drugs that will help you lose weight. If you are on insulin, maybe your doctor could give you drugs to help counteract the insulin making it harder to lose.

                        While I agree that merely being thin won't make you happy, if you think it will, I won't argue with you. There are aspects of life that do improve when one looks good and feels confident. For example, there are studies that overweight people make less money (particularly women) and have a harder time finding work.

                        But you have other things in your life that are making you angry over which you have complete control. If I take sympathy and compassion out of my brain for a minute... If you don't like school, the dog, the aging partner, or the job, and you do like gaming, writing, etc., ditch school, the dog, the aging partner, and change jobs.

                        There's an old Eagles lyric that goes something like, "So often time it happens that we live our lives in chains and we never even know we have the key." Once you're an adult, barring physical limitations, you are free to live your life as you choose within the law (or outside the law as long as you're willing to accept those consequences).

                        I wish you all the best.
                        "Right is right, even if no one is doing it; wrong is wrong, even if everyone is doing it." - St. Augustine

                        B*tch-lite

                        Who says back fat is a bad thing? Maybe on a hairy guy at the beach, but not on a crab.

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                        • #42
                          "All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us." - Gandalf

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by cori93437 View Post
                            Yep... find a doctor to give you a prescription for Phentermine.
                            You'll get thin.
                            But you won't learn how to stay thin.
                            Good luck.
                            Yep... my genius doctor put me on Adipex for a month... I lost 30lbs, but I am pretty sure I felt like what a coke head must feel like. Oh, and I gained it all back. My weight has dropped since being on PB (22lbs), but it has slowed down significantly. My thought is that if it comes off slowly and naturally it will stay off. If you go on some crash diet you may get results, but you'll be back to square one shortly after.

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by Jena View Post
                              Yep... my genius doctor put me on Adipex for a month... I lost 30lbs, but I am pretty sure I felt like what a coke head must feel like. Oh, and I gained it all back. My weight has dropped since being on PB (22lbs), but it has slowed down significantly. My thought is that if it comes off slowly and naturally it will stay off. If you go on some crash diet you may get results, but you'll be back to square one shortly after.

                              Truth.
                              A pill can make you not want to eat.
                              But it can't change your relationship with food.
                              If the only difference is a pill or "weight loss DIET"... the weight will come right back.
                              Thousands upon thousands of people prove this fact every year.

                              If the idea is to become a healthy person both physically and mentally... you stand a good chance of making permanent changes to your body, and other aspects of life.
                              It's a harder road perhaps...
                              But the choice is always yours.
                              “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
                              ~Friedrich Nietzsche
                              And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

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                              • #45
                                It sounds like primal is the least of your worries. Honestly there were a couple of things I got out of your posts, namely "my boyfriend moved in and I am really stressed" and "I have to work really REALLY hard in the next few years to support him as he gets older so I have to forego the fun things in my life". Are you really happy in this relationship?? Is he incapable of supporting himself?

                                I think I'd be resentful as fuck if I was looking at a long term future of working my ass off to support my partner and this meant I couldn't do the stuff I wanted to do. If you're happy with him and madly in love, that's one thing... but it sounded to me like he's just adding to your stress.

                                You shouldn't have to dump the fun stuff in your life out of duty and obligation (at least not completely). Hell, I've got 3 kids and I STILL aim to do some of the fun stuff I love (or I'd go insane). As for "play", if you're not enjoying it, you're not doing it right . Seriously. Play IS supposed to be the fun stuff!! I mean, instead of whatever you think play is... do some gaming instead. If you don't like meditation, then use that time to read a book, if that's what you like. Doing the stuff you love should be what relaxes you. If you don't like doing it, then it's not going to work.

                                Aside from that, I understand WHY you are frustrated with your lack of weight loss. My weight went up this week as well, which pretty much sucks from my perspective. Still, I'm trying different things... and I've been able to eat better with PB than I ever did before, so if I can figure out how to keep the weight going down (even if it's slow) then it's all good. If you have to make changes, then make changes. The trick is you HAVE to find something you can stick with. If you can't stick with it, it's not going to work for you, no matter what, as you're just going to resent the way you feel you have to eat.

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