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Can Paleo Stop the Infertility Epidemic?

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  • #91
    Nah, it started out as a cluster-fuck.
    Buy house, Demolish house, Build house.

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    • #92
      Originally posted by Blackcatbone View Post
      Nah, it started out as a cluster-fuck.
      Yeah, the OP pretty much guaranteed that by telling everyone who disagreed with him to STFU and GTFO of "his" thread on this free public forum.

      Not the approach most conducive to reasoned and civil discourse, IMO.
      Today I will: Eat food, not poison. Plan for success, not settle for failure. Live my real life, not a virtual one. Move and grow, not sit and die.

      My Primal Journal

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      • #93
        Haters win another thread

        Heaven forbid someone not agree with the thread hijackers
        Starting Date: Dec 18, 2010
        Starting Weight: 294 pounds
        Current Weight: 235 pounds
        Goal Weight: 195 pounds

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        • #94
          Originally posted by Blackcatbone View Post
          Nah, it started out as a cluster-fuck.
          Speaking of which, S and I were out for coffee this afternoon and we sat out on the patio. The table next to us had a guy who used fuck like this example: "I fuckin' told her to fuckin' put the fuckin' bowl fuckin' down."
          We thought it was hilarious, and nearly snorted our coffees because we had just finished a conversation on the optimum times to say fuck.

          By the way some people use DH or something like that, for spouses I think... I've been thinking it's strange how all these people have partners with the same initials.
          Female, age 51, 5' 9"
          SW - 183 (Jan 22, 2012), CW - 159, GW - healthy.

          Met my 2012 goals by losing 24 pounds.
          2013 goals are to get fit and strong!

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          • #95
            Originally posted by Blackcatbone View Post
            Well, in the case of a disaster my neighbors would be in the same boat as me, my family wouldn't be able to get help to me and the churches would already be swamped. I may be fairly comfortable financially but at $10 a pop my charity would only go so far. While I would certainly do what I could to help those around me I wouldn't be dropping the thousands of dollars it would cost to help those that could be helped for much less without the price gouging. And where are the churches supposed to get the money and supplies if vendors can charge whatever they want?
            If everyone is in such a sorry situation where nobody can help anyone else out, then the government isn't going to help you either.

            I wasn't there in Katrina, but I heard the government did a really lousy job. Rounding up people's guns and such.

            You would be much better off actually preparing for disaster yourself rather than having the money you would have spent on disaster preparation stolen from you by the government so they can pay outrageous salaries and benefits to FEMA employees who do nothing but go around and take all your guns when a hurricane strikes.

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            • #96
              Originally posted by kenn View Post
              Haters win another thread

              Heaven forbid someone not agree with the thread hijackers
              They need fertility gods.
              Or THIS guy.
              “You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
              ~Friedrich Nietzsche
              And that's why I'm here eating HFLC Primal/Paleo.

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              • #97
                well, i originally planned to read the first page and skip to the last. then i saw that i am one of the barren freaks who should stay away so i decided to keep reading

                soo here's my thoughts, unwanted tho they may be

                life for humanity isn't ideal. as a species, we are diseased and weak, yet over populated enough that we encroach on other species and drive them to extinction. i believe that we need this short (evolutionary) break from populating the species so we can heal and become genetically stronger

                it's not something that can be fixed in 5 minutes

                and i prefer my dogs to children too, you know, cause i'm a barren freak
                beautiful
                yeah you are

                Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
                lol

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                • #98
                  Originally posted by zoebird View Post
                  If we want to get into some science, there's a lot of interesting work at the Weston A Price Foundation web site about the impact of soy on fertility, as well as on sperm motility, etc.
                  With regards to the soy, that is a severe goitrogen, and if you check out the ingredients on virtually any processed food (I mean, like 97% of shit at the grocery store) then, yeah, you'll find soy is in it, some way, somehow. So I most definitely think that that could be a strong, strong component of the infertility epidemic. As a perfectly logical precautionary measure, I personally think that people should avoid soy altogether, but especially people who are trying to have children.

                  (Here's an excellent Mercola article on the ravaging effects of processed soy.)

                  As far as whether soy is solely to blame, I wouldn't think so, but who knows? My guess, though, would be that many countries like Russia have less soy than the U.S., which provides subsidies for soy (and the other grains, obviously) and so, if soy were the lone culprit, than the U.S. would be the only country with this problem. But it's not. It seems to be all countries (especially countries of European descent).

                  Obviously, many of the other things that you'd cited (such as people choosing to be childless and people being more open and vocal about their fertility problems) are more cultural things, and are unlikely to have had any impact on the 92% reduction in sperm count.

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                  • #99
                    Originally posted by bloodorchid View Post
                    life for humanity isn't ideal. as a species, we are diseased and weak, yet over populated enough that we encroach on other species and drive them to extinction. i believe that we need this short (evolutionary) break from populating the species so we can heal and become genetically stronger
                    It's funny: I was get confused when I hear people talking about, "we" when discussing things, as if we're a hivemind or something. I never talk like that, "We need to ------" or "Our problem is -----".

                    I guess that the libertarian ethos of self-motivation and individual thinking is so deeply embedded in my worldview that I think of myself as a person first, and don't view the world in this collectivist, communist, centralized manner.

                    So I see the fact that your testicles are hollowed out and useless (you likely couldn't have children even if you wanted to) as an assault on you as an individual, not some sort of, I don't know, collectivist philosophical thing.

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                    • no no, my uterus expells fetuses. my ovaries still work and are succulent and eggy

                      i consider myself part of the human race, when i say 'we' or 'our' i mean that on average the race i belong to is genetically weakened

                      you seem to feel as tho when i say 'we' i say 'you'

                      don't be so touchy
                      beautiful
                      yeah you are

                      Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
                      lol

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                      • Well, to be sure, I never asserted that soy was the sole origin of the problem. I did, in fact, bring up several other possible elements such as chemicals in diapers for male children in particular, hormonal birth control, as well as waiting until later in life to have children to begin with (usually after being on hormonal birth control for years). We might also look at things like pollution (even "acceptable pollution" such as fluorinated water), and several other potential causes.

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                        • Originally posted by bloodorchid View Post
                          no no, my uterus expells fetuses. my ovaries still work and are succulent and eggy

                          i consider myself part of the human race, when i say 'we' or 'our' i mean that on average the race i belong to is genetically weakened

                          you seem to feel as tho when i say 'we' i say 'you'

                          don't be so touchy
                          Okay, I don't believe that you (or really anybody) have the aptitude to "average" out 7 billion people - not without the largest and most complex polling project ever conducted. God knows I have enough trouble getting a good grasp on my own life and that of my family and social circle, so I don't even bother trying to presume to tell other people what to do with their lives. Needless to say, you're free to continue your cries for the government (or whatever other body) to assault people's bodies to make it conform to your philosophical worldview. Dream away, just as long as you keep your hands off mine and my family's bodies.

                          Also, I wouldn't be too sure about your uterus being "succulent". Not that it matters either way.

                          (By the way, human beings are a species. Races are subsets within the species.)

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                          • Originally posted by bloodorchid View Post
                            no no, my uterus expells fetuses. my ovaries still work and are succulent and eggy

                            i consider myself part of the human race, when i say 'we' or 'our' i mean that on average the race i belong to is genetically weakened

                            you seem to feel as tho when i say 'we' i say 'you'

                            don't be so touchy
                            The image this conjured made me chuckle. Sounds like 'expelling fetuses' is characteristic of your uterus .. like it just pops 'em out on a regular basis.

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                            • Originally posted by DavidBrennan View Post
                              Okay, I don't believe that you (or really anybody) have the aptitude to "average" out 7 billion people - not without the largest and most complex polling project ever conducted. God knows I have enough trouble getting a good grasp on my own life and that of my family and social circle, so I don't even bother trying to presume to tell other people what to do with their lives. Needless to say, you're free to continue your cries for the government (or whatever other body) to assault people's bodies to make it conform to your philosophical worldview. Dream away, just as long as you keep your hands off mine and my family's bodies.

                              Also, I wouldn't be too sure about your uterus being "succulent". Not that it matters either way.

                              (By the way, human beings are a species. Races are subsets within the species.)
                              What? Your whole deal is about how low sperm is typical across the board. As a male you wouldn't say "We have low sperm" to characterize the state of the average male? It can be true despite exceptions to the rule, that's the way that kind of statement works. Like saying "Birds can fly"

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                              • Originally posted by zoebird View Post
                                Well, to be sure, I never asserted that soy was the sole origin of the problem. I did, in fact, bring up several other possible elements such as chemicals in diapers for male children in particular, hormonal birth control, as well as waiting until later in life to have children to begin with (usually after being on hormonal birth control for years). We might also look at things like pollution (even "acceptable pollution" such as fluorinated water), and several other potential causes.
                                Oh yeah, I recognize that (and acknowledged some of those other ideas in my post).

                                The diaper notion wouldn't address the fact that so many of the (few) children who are being born are boys, although I agree that that could theoretically harm the baby's lifelong fertility, in some manner. Though that seems to be kind of a stretch.

                                As far as fluoride goes, yeah, there's nothing good that can be said about this poisonous chemical, and I've heard that it has a steady deleterious effect on thyroid function. If so, then that means that it directly suppresses hormones, which could well mean that it also impacts fertility (fluoride obviously suppresses sex drive in the first place, so it's off to a bad start right there).

                                Here's the CBC documentary, 'The Disappearing Male', I referenced a few pages back (which misdirects people to BPA as being the sole culprit for this epidemic, which is a silly theory on its face - it's so limiting it is like saying that OJ Simpson was responsible for every stabbing murder in American history.) Like I noted earlier, when that was posted to YouTube (it's since been stripped, at least in the U.S.), all of the replies were celebrating this bizarre epidemic, diminished fertility, and insidious assault on people. "Our good Mother Earth is being saved from us terrible people. Yay, assaulting testicles and wombs!" was the basic gist of the responses.
                                Last edited by DavidBrennan; 09-14-2012, 01:29 AM.

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