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  • #61
    Great thread.

    I've been primal for a year, and feel totally dialed in. My habits are primal, I buy, cook, and eat real food. I don't miss bread or pasta, or fast food. I have no desire to snack. My body sends trustworthy hunger signals. Some days I eat more fat, some more carbs/starch, some more fruit...it all balances in the long run. I don't question or stress about macronutrients. Occasionally I'll eat SAD pizza or kill a pint of ice cream, again with zero stress or concern (the appeal of the pizza remains but is dwindling, the appeal of ice cream will never go away).


    Pretty much none of the above reality can be translated into an elevator speech that anyone I've met cares to hear. It's not diet language. It's not numerical and presented in 5,7, 10 steps. It's about lifestyle, aka real change. And people want change without having to actually change. And to be candid, I didn't want to change either for the first 39 years of my life.

    The other hiccup is body image versus mental/emotional health. By far the most satisfying change I have experienced going primal is to my mental health. Life long depression mostly banished. Mood swings gone. Anxiety gone. Energy level returned and stabilized. Constant headaches gone. Sinus congestion gone. A whole roster of ailments gone...and none of them are visible even as collectively they are obvious in the damn near permanent smile on my face.

    But people equate diets with physical change, to the exclusion of almost all other metrics. Telling them about improvements that are real to you but invisible to them is, as you can guess, a non-starter. I'm lean and fit, but not ripped or buff. And I'm thrilled with my appearance, but this wouldn't be sustainable if it weren't for the mental health/happiness it has brought. It would be a chore, a task undertaken for something judged public (body image) rather than private (health and happiness).

    And so...all that to say that I have co-workers and family that suffer from obviously nutrition/food inflamed maladies. And they don't want to hear it. Don't dare tell them that their habits, their comforts, are the culprits. So I don't. I tried once on someone's facebook page, and it was a disaster. They said they'd rather keep taking pills than give up grains. My sister, who is dangerously thin, becomes furious when I tell her to stop running on a god damned tread mill and start eating real food. My brother, a depressed recovering alcoholic, eats frozen franken-foods and bread and pasta, and hides from the sun. But he's a god damn genius apparently and can't be bothered with advice about the 'crazy' idea that maybe what you eat AFFECTS you.

    I try to live well now. I say I cut out grains and processed foods if anyone asks...and no one ever asks a follow up question. Wanting to change is the precondition for sustainable change. And until they want to...

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    • #62
      Originally posted by tfarny View Post
      There are actually a lot of people years on maintenance but they don't tend to post as much. I "got healthy" in six months and have spend the past 1.5 years moving into "really dang fit for 40" category. There are lots of others. Also a lot of formerly extremely obese folks who have gotten to a far, far healthier spot than anyone thought they could get to. They're still "in progress" because they've only lost 120 out of the 175 they need to have BMI < 25. But there is a ton of longish-term maintenance here.
      I agree with your main points though.
      Oh, I don't doubt this way of eating works. Not in the least. It's just not that easy to figure out whose been doing this a long time, who reached their goal and stayed there happily ever after. And I have nobody in real life I can point to. I don't know a single other person in real life who eats like this. All of you here are the only examples I've got.

      I'm hoping I'll have myself to show for an example eventually. It's not like I see this as a temporary diet at all, so I have no reason to believe I won't succeed, except that there's always that little niggling voice in the back of my head that tells me "you are fat and ugly and nothing works for you." Somebody expresses any doubt to my face, says anything negative about what I'm doing to my face, and that little voice starts yammering at me and I just am not the kind of person who has a ready come-back. I just clam up.

      I think I'm pretty dang fit for 47 even with an unknown number of pounds to go. I honestly don't have a goal weight anymore. I never thought I'd get this far. Heck, I'm even getting a faint outline of abs if I really flex them. Never thought anything like that could happen to me.
      Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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      • #63
        Originally posted by Sihana
        I think there was a bit of sarcasm in there. For many people,. especially if you were very obese, the BMI < 25 is like a magical number that shows you are now "normal" and acceptable in "society". Granted, everyone learns as they draw closer to that number, that it means nothing.
        People say it's only about BF%. I beg to differ:

        15-percent-body-fat-female1.jpg

        That's why you look at BF%, weight on the scale, measurements and BMI as a whole. And I agree that most obese individuals don't have a relatively good way of judging with BF% quite yet. The "less than <25" initiative is just a good start.

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        • #64
          Originally posted by Sihana
          I think there was a bit of sarcasm in there. For many people,. especially if you were very obese, the BMI < 25 is like a magical number that shows you are now "normal" and acceptable in "society". Granted, everyone learns as they draw closer to that number, that it means nothing.
          Oh OK - I obviously didn't get the sarcasm Thanks.
          Last edited by paleo-bunny; 03-01-2012, 08:17 AM.
          F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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          • #65
            I don't really care. I'm pushing my family slowly towards a better diet (they've given up wheat) but I don't and never plan to actively get people to change.
            http://lifemutt.blogspot.sg/ - Gaming, Food Reviews and Life in Singapore

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            • #66
              Originally posted by Corvidae View Post
              Indeed, this is why I love the "Funny CW Moments" thread on the "success stories" forum. its a good place to vent, although it is also a self-acknowledged "self-righteous circle-jerk" sometimes
              Same here
              " If you truly love nature you will find beauty everywhere"

              - Vincent Van Gogh




              Primal Since January 2011

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              • #67
                I find it really interesting thinking about how people can't be convinced. I have been fat for 4 years, and during that time, I was not once really convinced of anything to do with health. People would tell me to do low-fat, eat food raw, make smoothies, shit knows. None of it stuck, I wasn't interested. Then I started reading about paleo/primal for a few months and suddenly it stuck, and I made it happen. I don't really know what the switch was. I mean, there's the science and logic part, but I'm sure I technically COULD have been convinced smoothies were super healthy too, I just wasn't interested in hearing it at that point in time.

                I try not to preach to others, but I'm not gonna lie, it's sort of in my nature to be a bit of a dick like that (I'm always aware of it though, people usually just find it funny). One friend I see a lot always does things like order soy coffees to be healthy, or have wholemeal crackers as a healthy snack. I often can't resist saying something.

                My family is interested. They know I don't dive into fads. People put too much trust in my opinion really, I have noticed over the years. I think they know I wouldn't do something like this if I wasn't sure of the research. And my results speak for themselves, 35.3 lb lost in about 3 months. I have never lost weight. I just slowly climbed and plateaued, then climbed again, but never have I really dropped until now.

                This has lead to my brother being primal (he's lost about 17 lb, he's already reasonably slim, and his bf is getting closer to the number he wants), and he often asks me what he's allowed. I'm always telling him to get his veges up. I don't live with him so I don't really know what he's eating but I have a feeling it revolves around meat and eggs.
                My mum tries to eat low carb too, but not really primal. My dad will never give up eating copious amounts of corn and fruit, and I think she finds it hard to change her diet when she has to factor him in as well. But they are adopting some factors of my lifestyle. I'll have a proper talk to my dad about it next time I go down. I don't know if he'll be receptive, but I think so many things in this lifestyle could help him.

                My friends haven't asked. They know about something referred to in my age group as "clean eating", mainly thanks to a group on facebook centered around bootcamp style cardio and "clean eating" to get a "bikini body". They know I've lost weight, but when they ask we're never really in an appropriate place for me to go into specifics, but I basically say I'm not eating anything processed, and no grains, and I've started doing more exercise (I don't get into enough detail to let them know this doesn't mean chronic cardio).
                One friend in particular I really want to tell. She has probably 30 - 35lb to lose, and it really bothers her, more than a lot of overweight people (you know how some people don't mind as much as others?). I think she could lose it and look amazing so fast, but she doesn't seem interested. I know where she's at though, I was there for a long time. You think you know best (trying to calorie restrict and set yourself unrealistic goals and always failing) and aren't open to other ideas. I know she'll find her way eventually, whether it's primal or not.

                Anyway, it's an interesting thing, advice. I try not to be too forceful onto others but sometimes I really wish they'd give it a go!
                Current weight lost: 82.9lb (37.6kg)

                Current PRs:
                Bench: 45kg/99lb
                Squat: 100kg/220lb
                Deadlift: 120kg/265lb

                My blog
                My journal

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                • #68
                  People pretend they want to be healthy, but they are just trying to bond. They think this is just another diet. They'll nod along but it all goes right over their heads. Food/health is either a hobby for somebody or it's not.
                  Crohn's, doing SCD

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                  • #69
                    This is my first post! I'm brand new to the forum's. I can really relate to you all on this topic! I'm usually hesitant when helping people with their health questions - I eat bacon and love heavy cream from grass fed cows. My friends don't understand how I can be so healthy/fit at 44 when I eat so "unhealthy"! Most of them do the "whole grains", low fat everything or at least only the healthy fats - vegetable oils! They're waiting for my bad habits to catch up with me I think!

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                    • #70
                      Hey NaturalFit! I am new on here, too, but glad to read you. I used to live in Monmouth County - Freehold. Claim to fame: Bruce Springsteen!

                      On preaching to people - it depends. I have gotten craploads of helpful ideas and advice from other parents in the special-needs field (have a special-needs daughter), some asked for by me and some offered in kind spirit - seems the parents of challenged kiddos just kind of instinctively know that trading information is vital to our collective success.

                      I also remember being so gung-ho about discovering vegetarianism that I wanted to convert the planet. I try to remember that when I get the missionary-zeal feeling about Primal - and that I massively changed my mind twice now: once from SAD to veg, and then from veg to Primal, so I try to be humble.

                      It may be easier for people who know me to hear food talk because they also know that two of my daughters have had serious struggles with food, and today are thriving, so I guess the proof is standing there and they figure I know something, at least.

                      In practice, if the family and friends ask, I mention the word Primal and say something like "if you want to hear more, I would be glad to chat, but here is the name it is known by" and they can bite or not. Complete strangers - meh. Aquaintances - perhaps. I gave the MDA website address to the office ladies at my kids' dentist yesterday on a post-it because the ladies were in a heavy discussion about how much peanut butter was too much (I think the argument raged about the measurement being somewhere between 1-1/2 teaspoons and 1 tablespoon - according to the guy at a local GNC...), but I will leave it to her to do the looking. I trust the Universe to work out the details in good time, but at least there is a crumb of a clue that I left.
                      I have a mantra that I have spouted for years... "If I eat right, I feel right. If I feel right, I exercise right. If I exercise right, I think right. If I think right, I eat right..." Phil-SC

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                      • #71
                        Going to need to talk to my mom, again, though. She just had back surgery, is overweight, has apparently some heart issues they discovered while she was in recovery, and a lung infection. They put her on a "low carb diabetic diet" which I need to figure out, odd since her doctor told her she'd drop her as a patient if she started PB. She really needs to do PB and I really need to find a way to get over her stubbornness this time around.
                        If you are new to the PB - please ignore ALL of this stuff, until you've read the book, or at least http://www.marksdailyapple.com/primal-blueprint-101/ and this (personal fave): http://www.archevore.com/get-started/

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                        • #72
                          Eating is like religion; most people stick to what they were brought up with and the converted rarely convert to anything else. I stay out of it unless people really hammer at me. Not worth the effort. People have to have their own epiphanies for them to take.
                          5' 9" 47 YO F
                          PB start June 2, 2012
                          Pre PB SW = 180 (no scale at home, Mom's scale January - 153lbs!)
                          Current deadlift 245 lbs, squat 165 lbs, bench press 135 lbs


                          PB Journal

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                          • #73
                            Try convincing people that vegetables are irrelevant.

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                            • #74
                              I like natural bodybuilding and nutrition, and was always tuned into the science side of it. Years ago I started looking at exercise/physic (and nutrition, too) from a hunter/gatherer POV. But I didn't have the diet dialed in right. I figured the AMA's and FDA's guidelines were based on good science; and reading Covert Bailey's Fit or Fat books reinforced that belief.

                              I felt I had to starve myself to get lean. Now I'm 55yr old, 200lbs, the six pack are showing, and I don't feel hungry. Paleo/primal diet is what was missing from my routine all those years. So, yeah, I like to talk about paleo/primal to anyone who'll listen and is interested in fitness and nutrition. But since it goes against conventional wisdom it'll get tuned out as just some fad diet.

                              Here's my concern: my wife is a nurse but won't read up on the medical reasons for go paleo/primal. My kids are interested in paleo/primal but aren't trying very hard to follow it, one of them has the PB 21 day Transformation. Their excuses is with college they are too busy. Both my wife and my 21yr old daughter have hypothyroidism. My wife complains about some foods affecting her stomach after she eats. Knowing that my daughter eats a lot of breads and sugar do I just shut up about her diet? What I've learned is that (chronic) hyperinflation affect the adrenal stress which affects thyroid. And that high insulin affects T4 from converting to T3 resulting in hypothyroidism. Her OB has her on thyroid meds and is telling my daughter she'll have to take them the rest of her life. See #39 and #8 iTunes - Podcasts - Primal Body Primal Mind Radio by Nora T. Gedgaudas, CNS, CNT of these itunes, and this interview with Mark Sisson by Dr Lo at 29 minutes The Primal Blueprint with Mark Sisson 10/11 by DrLoRadio | Blog Talk Radio

                              So, knowing what I've now learned and it directly relates to my family's personal health do I just shut the hell up and watch them self-destruct their health because they don't have the knowledge?
                              Would I be putting a grain-feed cow on a fad diet if I took it out of the feedlot and put it on pasture eating the grass nature intended?

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                              • #75
                                my grandmother used to say, "like throwing pearls to swine".. Of course, she was talking about preaching to a drunk but u understand.

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