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  • flu vaccine end of the year brawl of 0'12 extravaganza part 2!
    beautiful
    yeah you are

    Baby if you time travel back far enough you can avoid that work because the dust won't be there. You're too pretty to be working that hard.
    lol

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    • Originally posted by paleo-bunny View Post
      Would you care to explain why? Because I don't see it.

      The flu vaccine is woo for weaklings.
      The evidence is pretty solid that the flu vaccine is beneficial for the elderly and the immunocompromised. It probably isn't of any benefit (and may possibly be ever so slightly slightly harmful) to you, but unless you live in isolation, you getting it will benefit those "weaklings" around you. It doesn't make sense if you approach it from a purely selfish point of view (and there's nothing wrong with that), but from a epidemiological perspective the flu shot has a purpose.

      Comment


      • but to protect the young children, elderly, and others with weakened immune systems around you.
        Then why not vaccinate THEM with the snake oil and pretend they're safe? If it's so effective, then vaccinate the weak. Not the strong.
        Crohn's, doing SCD

        Comment


        • Originally posted by dizzyorange View Post
          The evidence is pretty solid that the flu vaccine is beneficial for the elderly and the immunocompromised. It probably isn't of any benefit (and may possibly be ever so slightly slightly harmful) to you, but unless you live in isolation, you getting it will benefit those "weaklings" around you. It doesn't make sense if you approach it from a purely selfish point of view (and there's nothing wrong with that), but from a epidemiological perspective the flu shot has a purpose.
          Care to post a link offering any evidence to support your views?

          The consensus here is that the vaccine is woo.

          And you clearly failed to appreciate (how clearly did I have to spell it out to you) that from an epidemiological perspective the flu shot is worse than useless.
          Last edited by paleo-bunny; 12-11-2012, 05:08 PM.
          F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

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          • The evidence is pretty solid that the flu vaccine is beneficial for the elderly and the immunocompromised. It probably isn't of any benefit (and may possibly be ever so slightly slightly harmful) to you, but unless you live in isolation, you getting it will benefit those "weaklings" around you. It doesn't make sense if you approach it from a purely selfish point of view (and there's nothing wrong with that), but from a epidemiological perspective the flu shot has a purpose.
            It can't have a purpose if it doesn't DO anything.
            Crohn's, doing SCD

            Comment


            • It seems pathetic to me that the immunocompromised make any claim that those who have strong immune systems are selfish.

              The current system favours the immunocompromised.

              Oh and big pharma loves that.
              F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by dizzyorange View Post
                You guys make some valid points but understand that the point of vaccination is not to protect you, but to protect the young children, elderly, and others with weakened immune systems around you. You can become "infected" with the flu virus to a subclinical extent (due to your strong immune system), in which you would be asymptomatic, but still have the ability to pass the virus on to others, and keep the viral load of a "population" higher than it would be if 100% of people got the vaccine.
                Here's how I see that. Each person is responsible for themselves. I choose to no longer be vaccinated against the flu because it made me sick every time I did. No one has the right to force me to get sick every year in an unproven attempt to ensure no one else will get sick from me. Other people have the option of getting vaccinated. If they fear getting the flu from an unvaccinated individual like myself, and they believe vaccinations work, then nothing is stopping them from being vaccinated themselves.
                High Weight: 225
                Weight at start of Primal: 189
                Current Weight: 174
                Goal Weight: 130

                Primal Start Date: 11/26/2012

                Comment


                • Originally posted by EagleRiverDee View Post
                  Here's how I see that. Each person is responsible for themselves. I choose to no longer be vaccinated against the flu because it made me sick every time I did. No one has the right to force me to get sick every year in an unproven attempt to ensure no one else will get sick from me. Other people have the option of getting vaccinated. If they fear getting the flu from an unvaccinated individual like myself, and they believe vaccinations work, then nothing is stopping them from being vaccinated themselves.
                  Exactly. If the vaccine had proven effectiveness, those dependent on it wouldn't feel any compulsion to persuade anyone else to take it.

                  I count my blessings that I caught mumps and german measles as a child as that gave my immune system the opportunity to develop natural immunity to viruses. Neither infection was traumatic in any way.

                  My Mum had no problems with allowing me play with my sister and best friend as a child while they had chicken pox and I didn't catch that. I had natural immunity

                  One of my grandfathers caught Spanish flu in 1917 as a baby and was issued the last rites. He is still alive.
                  F 5 ft 3. HW: 196 lbs. Primal SW (May 2011): 182 lbs (42% BF)... W June '12: 160 lbs (29% BF) (UK size 12, US size 8). GW: ~24% BF - have ditched the scales til I fit into a pair of UK size 10 bootcut jeans. Currently aligning towards 'The Perfect Health Diet' having swapped some fat for potatoes.

                  Comment


                  • wow. I didn't even see this thread.

                    My wife, a nurse, and most of her colleagues, think that the flu vaccine should only be taken by the elderly and immunocompromised. A healthy person has no need for the vaccine, and there is nothing wrong with naturally building your immune system.

                    I felt this way before I met her, and even when she came out of college, she thought this way as well. Most of her professors actually taught it that way.

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                    • We are a vax-free family.
                      Earthy Mama's Journal

                      "Let food be thy medicine and medicine be thy food" ~ Hippocrates

                      Comment


                      • In this thread I've seen a few accusations of selfishness aimed at those who refuse to get vaccinated. The assumption being that the more people vaccinated the less likely the vulnerable are to get sick and die. Unless I've missed it, I have not seen any evidence posted that demonstrates this is an effectively strategy to prevent spread of the flu. This reminds me of cocooning where family members get vaccinated with the whooping cough vaccine to lower the risk of babies catching the disease. As many know, this is a potentially fatal disease in babies and young children. Recent research seems to show that it is not a very effective strategy:

                        He said the national Pharmaceutical Benefits Advisory Committee
                        (PBAC) had determined vaccinating parents was not effective in protecting
                        newborns, after two pharmaceutical manufacturers made submissions to the
                        PBAC.

                        "The PBAC, which is totally independent and very expert, has
                        determined that there is no clinical effectiveness of this strategy," Professor
                        Brook said.
                        He said this had made it clear the cocooning strategy
                        should not be continued.
                        States ending free parent whooping vaccine | News.com.au

                        I would want to see clear evidence that the strategy works before I consider taking the vaccine.
                        Last edited by jo; 12-12-2012, 09:15 PM.
                        My website: http://www.shoppinganywhere.net/

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                        • When whooping cough came to our town when DS would be vulnerable, we had him vaccinated. We were not vaccinated, though, nor did we have a booster.

                          When DS had his accident last year (stitches), he got his last booster of DTaP for tetanus. He was at risk, and he was due for the booster anyway. Next one is at age 10, and we'll see how we feel then. D and T are pretty important at that age.

                          I also know preventative care for those diseases, in case the vaccines don't work -- they don't always work.

                          And, I'm having a DICKENS of a time getting my son to catch the chicken pox. I've exposed him 4 times now, and still no dice. He's too darn healthy. LOL (I am infinitely blessed and lucky and thankful for it).

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by WeldingHank View Post
                            wow. I didn't even see this thread.

                            My wife, a nurse, and most of her colleagues, think that the flu vaccine should only be taken by the elderly and immunocompromised. A healthy person has no need for the vaccine, and there is nothing wrong with naturally building your immune system.

                            I felt this way before I met her, and even when she came out of college, she thought this way as well. Most of her professors actually taught it that way.
                            What is the stance where she works? Here in Alaska the hospitals made flu vaccines for staff mandatory and some people ended up quitting over it.
                            High Weight: 225
                            Weight at start of Primal: 189
                            Current Weight: 174
                            Goal Weight: 130

                            Primal Start Date: 11/26/2012

                            Comment


                            • I used to get flu shots in college, and I got the flu at least once a year back then (but I had a very, VERY unhealthy lifestyle back then). I stopped getting flu shots after college and have not had the flu since then either.

                              Flu shots are unnecessary for healthy individuals. When was the last time you got the flu anyway?

                              My journal

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by zoebird View Post
                                you could just read the thread. pretty much we all answered before. lol
                                Yes I understand that and I did read the thread, but I didn't think that a continued debate with new eyes and new members would present a problem. Opinions change, and I wanted to get the current thinking. Sorry if this caused anyone distress.
                                Last edited by JEL62; 12-13-2012, 01:12 PM.

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