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  • #16
    1



    avey,


    Dirty secret? Guilt? Depression? These feelings may be what's driving you to binge over and over again.


    My wife buys these bags of dark chocolate covered pretzels. One day I just went nuts and ate the whole bag. Accepted it and moved on. No regrets or guilt. She still buys them. Once in a while I'll sneak one or two, but I feel no shame in doing so.


    "Everyone considers me to be super health conscious"


    Is this the expectation from others you place on yourself? No one will think less of you if you eat a biscuit now and then. Just don't create impossible expectations for yourself. And then feel ashamed or guilty you are not living up to it.


    -Steve-O

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    • #17
      1



      powdered glutamine ...I've never heard of that...interesting. thank you

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      • #18
        crepitte, I am struggling with this problem as well and interested in your post. Can you possibly refer me to a book or website that can delve into this more?

        Thanks

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        • #19
          Powdered glutamine did seem to make my nighttime cravings go away very quickly.
          .`.><((((> .`.><((((>.`.><((((>.`.><(( ((>
          ><((((> .`.><((((>.`.><((((>.`.><(( ((>

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          • #20
            Simply put, have you tried bingeing on something else aside from grains and carbs?

            I personally believe that people are programmed to binge eat. If anyone is familiar with the principles of the warrior diet, which is very similar to PB, it encourages a daily fast during the day followed by eating all the necessary food in one sitting at night. This huge meal, therefore, is pretty much a nightly session of binge eating.

            It makes sense too. Early humans did not have the luxury of supermarkets and widely available food. The concept of breakfast, lunch and dinner are purely societal constructs which have no evolutionary foundations. Grok did not sit down to breakfast lunch and dinner. Instead, Grok most likely spent the day sprinting and lifting heavy things on an empty stomach to find food, only to then bring the food back to the cave by nighttime and binge on the day's kill.

            It feels liberating. That is also why I am a big proponent of daily fasting. I just don't see the point in breakfast and lunch.

            So to tie it into your problem: skip the breakfast and lunch (assuming you partake in these meals) and then feel free to binge on PRIMAL foods during dinner time. That said, skip the pasta and scarf down some veggies, meats and fats instead. You will not feel guilty, not affect your insulin, and will do good to your body.
            --
            Here it is, your moment of zen.

            It's a no brainer: The journal of the cerebelum

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            • #21
              interesting stuff, cerebellumsdayoff, I'll have to read more about the warrior diet. Do you think this would have been true for those doing the gathering (with children in tow) as well as the hunters? Perhaps that's for another thread.

              Our society also programs us to associate a lot of emotion with food. I mean food is already emotional - serving and sharing food generates hormonal responses (not just the eating itself - food is a bonding experience) - and I wonder if that's what you're trying to give yourself.

              Avoid commercial television with food adverts. and next time you pick up something crap to binge on, tell yourself that you are better than that, deserve better, and you aren't going to stuff your body with that poison.

              Stop being such a namby pamby and get a grip.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Helen in Oz View Post
                interesting stuff, cerebellumsdayoff, I'll have to read more about the warrior diet. Do you think this would have been true for those doing the gathering (with children in tow) as well as the hunters? Perhaps that's for another thread.

                Our society also programs us to associate a lot of emotion with food. I mean food is already emotional - serving and sharing food generates hormonal responses (not just the eating itself - food is a bonding experience) - and I wonder if that's what you're trying to give yourself.
                That is definitely a very interesting notion as well. The discrepancy between those who hunted and those who gathered may have existed in the form of the [obvious] labor differences. However, one could argue that those who gathered did not want to eat out of the large 'collection' bin that was saved and filled until the hunters came back with the day's kill. It is also sound to argue that they may have 'grazed' during collection under the policy of "one berry for me, one for the bin." The logic is sound both ways.

                As far as emotions go, I could not agree more with you. My graduate psychological research consists of exploring human relationships, and specifically attraction to others. I have been wanting to tie in my interest with food to this line of research, and your idea on emotional connections really ties in to some questions I have been wanting to empirically investigate. More specifically, it may be interesting to approach food as another relationship we make. We get attracted to it for various physiological aspects (a good looking meal is as appealing as a good looking other), we get attached, we argue with it, we have make-up 'sex' with it (bingeing anyone), we can get repulsed by it; all these are really allusions to the dynamics of our relationships with others. Humans have a need to belong, and because we have such an impressive cognitive ability relative to other species, we may take that need to a whole new level and desire to belong with non-human others.
                --
                Here it is, your moment of zen.

                It's a no brainer: The journal of the cerebelum

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                • #23
                  ccarrigan,
                  Thank you for the journalling tip. I have a problem similar to avey's - bingeing - and I came here looking for ideas. I am already a journalling sort of person, so I think I'll try to make a point of keeping it more handy.

                  cerebelumsdayoff,
                  I like your theories about our relationship with food - very thought provoking.

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                  • #24
                    I "warrior" or use the "fast five" eating schedules on week days too. There are books and diet suggestions behind the "warrior" and "fast five" diets and I'm not following any of that stuff. The gist of what I do though is that I eat once or twice in the evenings and I don't eat breakfast, lunch, or snacks. When you do choose to eat like this you nee to make sure that you're going to be getting all the nutrients that your body needs for the day. It's taken some thought to make sure that I have plenty of protein and enough fat to keep me going.
                    I'm finding that I'm still slowly losing fat despite already being at a low body fat percentage. I think if I were eating the way that I do and I did have a lot to lose the pounds would be dropping off fast.
                    http://www.facebook.com/daemonized

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                    • #25
                      My cure for hunger and binging was to binge aggressively, except on healthy food. Stuff yourself with meat, good fats, and vegetables so your body gets out of survival mode. Eat until you're very full and eat delicious food. Plan to stuff yourself. It might take a little while for the hypothalamus to truly get the message that food is plentiful but once it happens you'll be a lot healthier and happier.
                      Stabbing conventional wisdom in its face.

                      Anyone who wants to talk nutrition should PM me!

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by avey View Post
                        but in the last two months I just can't stop binge eating.
                        Can you get your vitamin D tested? (see links in my sig)

                        Work on your zinc - it's worth it to track intake for a couple of days to assess intake from all sources - many need more zinc than you'd expect based on the RDI. I need about 30 mg daily from all sources combed.

                        The unfortunately named _Depression Free Naturally_ (Joan Matthews Larson) has excellent information about treating the causes of binge eating from an orthomolecular perspective. Orthomolecular = vitamins, minerals, amino acids, efas. Along with vitamin D, this saved my life.

                        Do you have ADHD by any chance? Those with ADHD are more likely to be overweight, more likely to binge eat and because of impulse control issues and executive function deficits, have trouble controlling it. Medication is helpful more than most can imagine.

                        Eat more protein - at least a palm sized portion 3x per day with 3 servings veggies. The more full you are on the good stuff, the less room there is for the less desirable.

                        Best,
                        Katherine



                        iherb referral code CIL457- $5 off first order

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                        • #27
                          There's great resources on this from Julia Ross- you can just google her. You can supplement and it is very helpful- she has diagnostic tools to help identify deficiencies and solutions- I highly recommend her work.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by cerebelumsdayoff View Post
                            More specifically, it may be interesting to approach food as another relationship we make. We get attracted to it for various physiological aspects (a good looking meal is as appealing as a good looking other), we get attached, we argue with it, we have make-up 'sex' with it (bingeing anyone), we can get repulsed by it; all these are really allusions to the dynamics of our relationships with others. Humans have a need to belong, and because we have such an impressive cognitive ability relative to other species, we may take that need to a whole new level and desire to belong with non-human others.
                            Oh this is a really interesting idea. When I referred to emotions/hormones, I was thinking in terms of food as a family/friend bonding activity - that's why (as you no doubt know) it's important for kids (some study I read somewhere about kids who eat meals at home not being in gangs... and another reference about estrogen/oxytocin?? release...)

                            I had thought a bit about having emotional responses to food due to the memories connected... but wow, it could be so much more involved than that. What an interesting study that could be.

                            I remember when I was a poor student - when I was completely broke - down to my last few dollars - I'd spend that money on a bottle of cheap red wine and a nice cheese, and pretend that I was really rich.

                            When I have a cart full of lovely produce, I feel really smug and self-congratulatory... but 'giving in' to a 'treat' like one of those fake-cream buns makes me feel really gross. The foodie version of sicko porn or something!

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Helen in Oz View Post
                              Oh this is a really interesting idea. When I referred to emotions/hormones, I was thinking in terms of food as a family/friend bonding activity - that's why (as you no doubt know) it's important for kids (some study I read somewhere about kids who eat meals at home not being in gangs... and another reference about estrogen/oxytocin?? release...)
                              That is another great point as well! Food is not something with what we form relationships, but food is something that we use to buttress and proliferate our already established (or establishing) relationships with human others. What is the most common activity for a first date? Dinner. What do you do when you have friends over? Serve dinner or snacks or something edible. What do you do to celebrate something? Go out to eat and drink. Food is society. That is why every society has its own unique food.

                              What is also important is that people take pride in their culture's food. To insult someone's cultural food is to insult them. Oxytocin is a bonding neurotransmitter. It is released when we engage in bonding behavior, such as touch, and it makes us feel good. Some even suggest that it promotes attachment emotions. Maybe that is why we may develop all the bonds with certain comfort foods. When we were sick as kids, our moms would make chicken noodle soup for us, and feed it to us while rubbing our foreheads or stomachs. That may have released oxytocin. Through good old classical conditioning, we may have associated that release of oxytocin to the consumption of that food. In turn, maybe mere consumption of that food released oxytocin, forming a bond to that bowl of chicken noodle soup. Sadly, noodles are not primal, and it may be very hard for many to say goodbye.

                              This again is where the bingeing comes in. It may be a sign of the inability to part with certain foods which may be associated with attachment (or even oxytocin). Because we live in a western world, most of these foods are going to come in the form of carbohydrates and sugars. These molecules obviously have their own effects on both the human body and mind. The combination of all that may be a reason why saying goodbye to carb-rich comfort foods may be very difficult for some who are new to the primal lifestyle. We are attached to cookies, yet we are mad at cookies for causing insulin spikes. We ignore cookies, hiding the remaining few away deep in the pantry until one night you feel 'lonely and deprived.' You miss the cookies. You miss the way they make you feel. You rush back to the pantry, dig deep, and find the box. The bingeing could be a hypothetical session of make up sex with those cookies, after which you feel guilty for coming back to a lover who has hurt you, reminding you of why you left in the first place.

                              In such a scenario, food really does become a boyfriend or girlfriend.
                              --
                              Here it is, your moment of zen.

                              It's a no brainer: The journal of the cerebelum

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