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  • Small cavity. Any hope?

    It would appear I have developed a small cavity on one of my rearmost lower molars (I have been slightly negligent as far as dental goes as of late). It is approximately 1mm deep and 1/32" wide (maybe a little less even). I am going to the dentist on tuesday.

    Doing some reading, I was hoping I could heal (maybe not recover the lost material, but at least harden what remains) using MI Paste in the morning, a 5000ppm fluoride toothpaste at night, limiting simple sugars to a minimum (bye bye fruit ), and cleaning my mouth up after meals.

    I want to suggest to the dentist the above, and ask about coming back in 3 months in addition to 6 months to check on it. I know alot of people would say "just get it filled now and dont risk it", but I don't want to enter the cycle of issues surrounding fillings. I hear my family bitch about them enough.

    So bottom line: should I give my body a chance to prove itself, giving it the best conditions I can? Or is it pretty much hopeless?



    (MI paste is a calcium/phosphate saturated compound that also includes CPP-ACP, a milk derived protein, that is supposed to facilitate the remineralization process.)

  • #2
    what are the issues with fillings? i have several fillings and have had no problems at all
    Primal Chaos
    37yo 6'5"
    6-19-2011 393lbs 60" waist
    current 338lbs 49" waist
    goal 240lbs 35" waist

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    • #3
      If it's not through the enamel layer watchful waiting might be indicated but...a filling now is infinitely preferable to what will be needed if the decay goes too far. Once it's past the enamel layer decay will progress rapidly. Just stay away from the amalgam.

      There is also this: Colgate® PreviDent® 5000 Plus (Rx only) A script will be needed from the DMD.
      Wheat is the new tobacco. Spread the word.

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      • #4
        Buy a blender and drink all your food with a straw. Problem solved. Teeth are only useful to poor losers who can't afford a good blender anyway.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by IvyBlue View Post
          If it's not through the enamel layer watchful waiting might be indicated but...a filling now is infinitely preferable to what will be needed if the decay goes too far. Once it's past the enamel layer decay will progress rapidly. Just stay away from the amalgam.

          There is also this: Colgate® PreviDent® 5000 Plus (Rx only) A script will be needed from the DMD.
          That is basically what I was looking at getting. And again, the problem with fillings is how much I constantly hear my mother and grandfather bitch about them. They are always having trouble from them.

          I have also read stuff about superficial sealants. Does anyone around here have knowledge of them? My reading tells me they etch the enamel and then place the sealant on the surface of the tooth, without drilling.
          Last edited by Conner P.; 07-09-2011, 08:54 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Winterbike View Post
            Buy a blender and drink all your food with a straw. Problem solved. Teeth are only useful to poor losers who can't afford a good blender anyway.
            LOL. I bought an awesome blender today. Check my latest journal post if you're thinking about buying one.

            Seriously though, I have some really bad teeth. The last time I went to the dentist they said I had five cavities!

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            • #7
              A Primal diet with enough vitamins A, D, and K2 (may need to supplement) can heal small cavities, but there's a limit and past that you definitely need to get it filled. Don't know what that is, unfortunately, but 1/32" might be manageable. If you're going to get it filled just make sure it's a ceramic, not metal filling.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Conner P. View Post
                I have also read stuff about superficial sealants. Does anyone around here have knowledge of them? My reading tells me they etch the enamel and then place the sealant on the surface of the tooth, without drilling.
                Had my molars done. It wears off anyway so is not a long term solution to anything.
                Wheat is the new tobacco. Spread the word.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by AndreaReina View Post
                  A Primal diet with enough vitamins A, D, and K2 (may need to supplement) can heal small cavities, but there's a limit and past that you definitely need to get it filled. Don't know what that is, unfortunately, but 1/32" might be manageable. If you're going to get it filled just make sure it's a ceramic, not metal filling.
                  Absolutely on the ceramic. Air etched & ceramic. If I am getting portions of my tooth removed, it is going to be the smallest amount possible.

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                  • #10
                    I've got literally a dozen or more fillings. My rearmost molar is completely hollowed out and reformed with a filling (pretty much as extensive as it gets before a root canal and crown would be necessary). I have had pretty good luck so far with all of the fillings and even better luck since i've cut down sugar intake. I'd say try out the other's suggestions regarding good vitamin balance and perhaps the 'script toothpaste.

                    Good luck!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Conner P. View Post
                      So bottom line: should I give my body a chance to prove itself, giving it the best conditions I can? Or is it pretty much hopeless?
                      No Idea. And I'm not qualified to give dental advice.

                      But whether it's capable of healing or not, it's best, for the long term, to incorporate the kind of foods in the diet that are likely to protect your teeth and avoid those that seem to be problematic.

                      Ramiel Nagel's book is probably as good as anything:

                      Amazon.com: Cure Tooth Decay: Heal and Prevent Cavities with Nutrition, Second Edition (9780982021309): Ramiel Nagel, Timothy Gallagher: Books

                      As someone already mentioned, a good supply of fat-soluble vitamins is essential. (Main sources: (1) raw dairy; (2) offal, particularly liver; (3) seafood, including the heads and organs of sea creatures, with cod liver oil as an obvious source.)

                      A fair whack of the right minerals seems to be important, too. (IIRC, he doesn't mention magnesium—but perhaps he really should have.)

                      Sugar is definitely a bad problem for teeth—but not necessarily because it helps bacteria grow. In fact, it probably doesn't do that. Bacteria are always there, anyway, and the important question is probably: "Are you largely immune to them or not?" What governs that is almost certainly the structural integrity of the teeth: how mineralized they are. It's possible that sugar is actually a problem because sugar spikes can upset the balance of minerals in the blood and lead to their being withdrawn from the teeth. In any event, all refined carbohydrate is best left alone.

                      Nagel believes that too much high-sugar fruit can be a problem for people with rampant tooth-decay but a little more is possible for others. His approach is more the one-to-three moderate servings of (preferably low-sugar) fruit than the 30-bananas-a-day approach of the lunatic fringe of the vegetarian movement. (Wonder what their teeth will be like in a few years!) He suggests fruit is best eaten at midday and it may be a good idea to put some high-butterfat cream on it.

                      If refined carbs come with a big red warning sign, wholegrains are not seen as a solution. These may be worse for people's teeth in some respects. Anti-nutrients in them, such as phytates, seem to be capable of complexing minerals out of your body. He relates an anecdote of a mother who was actually feeding her daughter an excellent nutrient-dense diet with enough fat (which in itself is unusual these days), but who gave her a milkshake with a spoonful of bran and a spoonful of wheatgerm in it every day. That "healthy" drink seems to have been enough to sabotage her teeth.

                      Populations with virtual immunity to tooth decay include some that ate cereal grains. But these people seem to have prepared them with great care by methods that neutralized antinutrients. And their diets were otherwise very rich.

                      It was mostly the dietary recommendations i was interested in. I only skimmed the section of the book on fillings. There seem to be many pitfalls there. He doesn't like mercury-silver amalgam fillings at all, but he's wary of some of the alternatives, too. (I once heard Professor Bryce-Smith, who's an international expert on heavy metal toxicity speak, and when he took questions someone raised the issue: if heavy metals can be as problematic as you seem to think, what about the fillings we all have? Bryce-Smith was actually not too doom-laden on that: he said the amount of mercury in your blood goes up at first, but it does settle down after that.) Some plastic composite fillings use BPA harders—we already know about BPA's problems here, of course. It's no longer allowed in babies bottles in the EU. Would you want that in your mouth? Nagel says that when people's reactions to one popular plastic composite filling was tested, nine out of ten people turned out to be allergic to it. Dentists don't usually test whether patients are allergic to a material or not before going right ahead. Apparently, as well as possible toxicity of materials there are thought to be problems with electric flow around your mouth. Something inside your tooth can stop this going on freely. Different metals can affect it. If you've a mix of metals in there—say, amalgam fillings plus a brace—he says you're setting up a battery-like effect. I guess you would be.

                      I skimmed the stuff on tooth-cleaning, too. There's some pretty weird stuff in some toothpastes and on the whole he prefers to just use bicarbonate of soda or seasalt. There are also questions about whether too much brushing can push food up under the gumline and actually cause problems. Similarly, over-enthusiastic flossing that causes the gums to bleed amy be contra-indicated. He mentions a technique called "blotting" and has video of that online—haven't seen it. He's also a fan of the Ayurvedic technique of "oil pulling". (Nagel is a yoga practitioner, which perhaps makes him, for good or ill, likely to be in favour of Ayurvedic stuff.) Someone has a whole book on the subject:

                      Amazon.com: Oil Pulling Therapy: Detoxifying and Healing the Body Through Oral Cleansing (9780941599672): Bruce Fife: Books

                      Anyway, I'd have a look at Nagel's book. Most of his dietary protocols sound fairly well time-tested, being based on protocols that Weston Price used to try to help orphanage children. Apparently, just a few good meals overseen by Price a week were enough to stop tooth decay in these children.

                      At root the problem seems to be our trashy modern diet. There's a photo of an old Eskimo at the back of the book. His teeth are mechanically worn right down—sand particles would blow onto their windrows of drying fish—but he is, nevertheless, totally free from tooth decay.

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                      • #12
                        i still havent seen anyone say what the problems are with fillings. its really not a big deal just go get the cavities fixed
                        Primal Chaos
                        37yo 6'5"
                        6-19-2011 393lbs 60" waist
                        current 338lbs 49" waist
                        goal 240lbs 35" waist

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Perhaps get this one filled then follow natural protocols to prevent further ones? You don't want to wind up getting a root canal and then everyone mocking you for trying to naturally heal it. Insult to injury, ouch.

                          Also, I love my sonicare. Have only had one tiny cavity since getting it years and years ago and I had the most disgusting weak-enameled mouth ever as a kid.

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                          • #14
                            Wellness Mama had a post about a remineralizing toothpaste that rebuilds the enamel of your teeth. I have not tried it yet but it is an interesting idea. Here is the link to her tooth paste recipe.
                            The doctor of the future will give no medicine, but will interest his patients in the care of the human frame, in diet, and in the cause and prevention of disease. - Thomas Edison

                            Vancouver Island Primal and Paleo Living <<< join our Facebook Group

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                            • #15
                              Went to the dentist today. Nothing came up on the xrays so it appears to be superficial. On the down side I have wisdom teeth showing up so I may be in for a few days of misery and soft foods in the not so distant future.

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