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  • #61
    Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
    2)Figure out your BMR. This is the amount of calories you need to just maintain at any given weight. Google “BMR calculator”. Bunches of them. A good one will have an activity multiplier so that you can factor in how active you are into your caloric needs.

    3) figure out how fast you want to lose weight. Good rule of thumb is a 500 calorie /day deficit means about 1 lb of fat /wk shed. This is sustainable. So BMR minus your deficit number gives you your target calories.
    Very well put!

    I'm sorry for being so nitpicky, but I just wanted to point out that BMR (basal metabolism rate) is not your maintenance calories - it is the amount you would burn if you literally didn't move all day. Even a sedentary person will maintain on BMR x 1.2 give or take. Here are the typical activity multipliers:

    If you are sedentary (little or no exercise): daily burn = BMR x 1.2
    If you are lightly active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/week): daily burn = BMR x 1.375
    If you are moderatetely active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/week): daily burn = BMR x 1.55
    If you are very active (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days a week): daily burn = BMR x 1.725
    If you are extra active (very hard exercise/sports & physical job or 2x training): daily burn = BMR x 1.9

    So, I think it would be clearer if you said:
    So BMR x activity modifier minus your deficit number gives you your target calories
    The Primal Holla! Eating fat. Getting lean. Being awesome.

    You were sick, but now you're well, and there's work to do. - Kilgore Trout

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Dragonfly View Post
      I don't believe insulin spikes. per se are a problem, Paleobird. It's ongoing, elevated insulin that is an issue.
      By IFing (while eating fewer meals) I am actually decreasing the overall amount of insulin in my system. pklopp talks about this in his IF primer.
      This was posted in the original thread by PrimalWannabeGirl. I would still love to see the citation. PWG?

      "I can't find the citation, but when I first researched IF online, I found a study that examined gender differences in IF in mice. The study had four groups---male mice eating a fixed composition, fixed-calorie diet in divided "meals"; male mice eating the same diet but on an IF schedule; and two groups of female mice with the corresponding feeding schedules.

      What struck me was that the female IF mice did NOT lose weight while the male IF mice did relative to the divided meal groups, leading to the conclusion that IF---at least for female mice----did not in itself provide a weight-losing metabolic 'advantage'.

      This makes sense to me, if you think that women's metabolisms would lead to a more vigorous defense of fat in the face of "starvation." It is my opinion that IF in women WITHOUT the heavy lifting that promotes muscle growth might actually hamper weight-loss efforts."

      I have noticed that the sites such as leangains etc. seem to be more targeted at men and their six packs. I just find it difficult to get that much protein in at one sitting.

      Comment


      • #63
        Originally posted by Canarygirl View Post
        I like this basic methodology. Last year I went between April and October with zero weight loss on PB and I was definitely frustrated. Then I lost some again (spontaneous calorie reduction), but then gained that back and am now back where I was last April! (Crap, I just now figured that out.)

        I need ~108 grams of protein per day and 1400 calories.

        Is there any way to get close to these macronutrient targets without having to use a calorie counter program or book? Something like the old diabetic exchanges (or Weight Watchers exchanges), or even the Zone style dinner plate ratios? I think that was 1/3 of your dinner plate would be protein and 2/3 would be non-starchy veggies. I am just lazy and hate the thought of having to look up everything I eat on a computer.
        I actually find the computer method much easier than looking through tables and charts. All those plate ratio ideas don't hold up because some protein sources are a lot more protein dense than others per volume. Try SparkPeople. Very user friendly.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by theholla View Post
          Very well put!
          I'm sorry for being so nitpicky, but I just wanted to point out that BMR (basal metabolism rate) is not your maintenance calories - it is the amount you would burn if you literally didn't move all day. Even a sedentary person will maintain on BMR x 1.2 give or take. Here are the typical activity multipliers:
          If you are sedentary (little or no exercise): daily burn = BMR x 1.2
          If you are lightly active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/week): daily burn = BMR x 1.375
          If you are moderatetely active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/week): daily burn = BMR x 1.55
          If you are very active (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days a week): daily burn = BMR x 1.725
          If you are extra active (very hard exercise/sports & physical job or 2x training): daily burn = BMR x 1.9
          So, I think it would be clearer if you said:
          That's why I did say that a good BMR calculator has an activity multiplier (sorry if that wasn't clear.). There are some out there that don't and you are very right, they are not accurate.

          Comment


          • #65
            Cool post paleobird.

            I think when I read your original post I did react to it becaue I'd been told for years to just "cut calories" and it never worked for me (at that time I was eating about 1200 calories/day and walking 1 hour a day 5 days a week). But then I have thyroid issues, so duh.

            And interestingly, what you've cut your calories TO (1400ish) is my "high" calorie point. As in, I tend to range from 1050-1400ish naturally WITHOUT counting calories going by satiety and hunger signals, so in my brain cutting calories would be 800 or 900, which isn't healthy.

            I'm still working on the healthy part, LOL!

            Oh and interestingly the latest Healthy Skeptic podcast they talk about IFing and how it CAN in SOME individuals cause too much of a cortisol issue which then prevents weight loss or even promotes weight gain. Depending on your stress levels and general health, of course. I thought it was interesting as I have been doing an "eating window", but I know I am on the borderline with my adrenal issues, so I'm thinking of going back to three meals, just smaller for a bit and see what happens.
            Last edited by Minxxa; 05-02-2011, 01:01 PM.
            sigpic "Boy I got vision and the rest of the world is wearing bifocals" - Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid

            Comment


            • #66
              Originally posted by Minxxa View Post
              Cool post paleobird.

              I think when I read your original post I did react to it becaue I'd been told for years to just "cut calories" and it never worked for me (at that time I was eating about 1200 calories/day and walking 1 hour a day 5 days a week). But then I have thyroid issues, so duh.

              And interestingly, what you've cut your calories TO (1400ish) is my "high" calorie point. As in, I tend to range from 1050-1400ish naturally WITHOUT counting calories going by satiety and hunger signals, so in my brain cutting calories would be 800 or 900, which isn't healthy.

              I'm still working on the healthy part, LOL!
              Well some of picking a number is based on height. I'm 5'10" and athletically built so I'm the same size as the average American guy.

              800-900 would be torture and would definitely be unhealthy. And probably doomed to fail. I feel like what I am doing is not only not torture, it's sustainable.

              I hope you find your healthy balance.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                That's why I did say that a good BMR calculator has an activity multiplier (sorry if that wasn't clear.). There are some out there that don't and you are very right, they are not accurate.
                Totally, I'm just being picky about vocabulary. BMR specifically refers to energy expended at rest. Once you add the activity multiplier, it isn't called BMR anymore - it's just called daily energy expenditure.
                The Primal Holla! Eating fat. Getting lean. Being awesome.

                You were sick, but now you're well, and there's work to do. - Kilgore Trout

                Comment


                • #68
                  Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                  I read your parenting post but, not being a parent myself, I did not feel qualified to comment. I did think however that you handled things very effectively in the end. Getting there however was the cortisol elevator, right?

                  If that split works for you, great. I think everyone needs to do their own tweaking to find what suits their body chemistry.

                  Just remember to breathe.
                  Hugs,
                  Robin
                  Thanks, yes that was the elevator, one of those super-turbo charged jobs you love in the States - you know the type that leave your stomach in the basement as the rest of you reaches the 32nd floor! As for being qualified to comment - it didn't stop some LOL! If you are at all interested in the process the last but one few posts at my blog give an overview of the process - it was very enlightening actually.

                  I'm going to try your splits out of interest over the next week and I'm going to cut the dairy (not tried that before, just to see).

                  Of course you realise this thread will become as long as the other, it's one of those topics it would seem!
                  Seeking the natural way in a modern world ...

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Just wanted to chime in with a "thanks" to Paleobird and the rest for that original thread regarding counting calories. I had been pretty frustrated just going by hunger signals and eating Paleo/Primal foods and not losing. I decided to join SparkPeople and track my calories, carbs, fat, and protein. Since I started doing that at the beginning of March, I have lost 15.6 pounds!! I also changed what I was doing for exercise so that has something to do with it as well. However, for me, I really feel it is more about what I eat. Unfortunately, you can't out-exercise bad eating!! I am going to keep on tracking but not let the calorie limit listed dictate how much I eat (if that makes sense). There are many days where I am just not hungry but I only ate 1200 calories (sometimes a little less). For someone my size, 1200 is low (I am just over 200 pounds now). However, if I am not hungry and at 1200 for the day, 1200 it is! I do need to up my protein though. I realize when I do good protein, I am not hungry (DUH!!). For example, today's menu (so far):

                    Breakfast:
                    1 C whole fresh strawberries
                    2/3 C (little less) of diced fresh pineapple

                    (I normally don't eat fruit but needed "finger food" I could eat in the car. I figured fruit was better than the cereal bars or granola bars in the cabinet!)

                    Snack (because I was HUNGRY after only fruit - imagine that!!):
                    Raw Almonds
                    Mini-size Larabar

                    Lunch:
                    Cobb Salad from Red Robin (minus bread, bleu cheese, black olives)

                    I am STUFFED from that lunch and will probably either skip or have a very minimal dinner. According to SparkPeople, I am at 830 calories for the day. You know what? If I am still "full" at dinner time or shortly after, I won't eat just because my limit says I should and will go to bed having only consumed 830 calories today!

                    I do think everyone has to find what works for them. I know low carb/high protein/moderate-high fat works for me. However, I also know (as others have said), that I can eat the heck out of things like bacon so I do know I have to be careful and tracking is holding me accountable! My next step is to start a journal on this website to keep me even more accountable. For awhile there, I was allowing non-Primal treats back in and selling it to myself that I wasn't hitting my calorie target and I was hungry so I'm fine. Ummm...NO!!!

                    Carrie

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                    • #70
                      I am a big fat of protein as well. Fat tends to accompany protein sources in my diet (meat, eggs, ect) and carbs are an afterthought.
                      http://www.facebook.com/daemonized

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Kelda View Post
                        I'm going to try your splits out of interest over the next week and I'm going to cut the dairy (not tried that before, just to see).

                        Of course you realise this thread will become as long as the other, it's one of those topics it would seem!
                        Let me know how that works out. Yes, it does seem to be a topic that touches a nerve.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Originally posted by carres1973 View Post
                          Just wanted to chime in with a "thanks" to Paleobird and the rest for that original thread regarding counting calories. I had been pretty frustrated just going by hunger signals and eating Paleo/Primal foods and not losing. I decided to join SparkPeople and track my calories, carbs, fat, and protein. Since I started doing that at the beginning of March, I have lost 15.6 pounds!! I also changed what I was doing for exercise so that has something to do with it as well. However, for me, I really feel it is more about what I eat. Unfortunately, you can't out-exercise bad eating!! I am going to keep on tracking but not let the calorie limit listed dictate how much I eat (if that makes sense). There are many days where I am just not hungry but I only ate 1200 calories (sometimes a little less). For someone my size, 1200 is low (I am just over 200 pounds now). However, if I am not hungry and at 1200 for the day, 1200 it is! I do need to up my protein though. I realize when I do good protein, I am not hungry (DUH!!). For example, today's menu (so far):

                          Breakfast:
                          1 C whole fresh strawberries
                          2/3 C (little less) of diced fresh pineapple

                          (I normally don't eat fruit but needed "finger food" I could eat in the car. I figured fruit was better than the cereal bars or granola bars in the cabinet!)

                          Snack (because I was HUNGRY after only fruit - imagine that!!):
                          Raw Almonds
                          Mini-size Larabar

                          Lunch:
                          Cobb Salad from Red Robin (minus bread, bleu cheese, black olives)

                          I am STUFFED from that lunch and will probably either skip or have a very minimal dinner. According to SparkPeople, I am at 830 calories for the day. You know what? If I am still "full" at dinner time or shortly after, I won't eat just because my limit says I should and will go to bed having only consumed 830 calories today!

                          I do think everyone has to find what works for them. I know low carb/high protein/moderate-high fat works for me. However, I also know (as others have said), that I can eat the heck out of things like bacon so I do know I have to be careful and tracking is holding me accountable! My next step is to start a journal on this website to keep me even more accountable. For awhile there, I was allowing non-Primal treats back in and selling it to myself that I wasn't hitting my calorie target and I was hungry so I'm fine. Ummm...NO!!!

                          Carrie
                          Congrats on the weight loss.
                          Yes, as pointed out in the original thread by (I think?) Runnergal, in a lot of us the hungry or not hungry signaling process is whacked. It can't be counted on to give us an accurate heads up when to stop eating. On the other hand, no you shouldn't stuff yourself if you don't feel like eating. But you should make sure you are getting enough protein and at least some veggies to get the broad spectrum of nutrients your body needs. No sense in getting thin but being unhealthy.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Daemonized View Post
                            I am a big fat of protein as well. Fat tends to accompany protein sources in my diet (meat, eggs, ect) and carbs are an afterthought.
                            Right. There is plenty of good fat in the protein sources themselves. I found that just cutting out the add-ons like butter and mayo by the glob really helped.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Yeah - I find I am better not adding tons of butter or other fats. The big issue for me seems to be making sure I am getting enough protein. I think that has stalled me a bit. I am tall too, so I need 100 to 110g. I eat around 1300 cals on the average day, so I have to work at getting that protein, and if I do so, the fat seems to come with it, since I am not eating skinless chicken breasts (YUCK).
                              Karin

                              A joyful heart is good medicine

                              He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose. - Jim Elliot

                              Mmmmm. Real food is good.

                              My Journal: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/forum/thread29685.html

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by JKC View Post
                                Yeah - I find I am better not adding tons of butter or other fats. The big issue for me seems to be making sure I am getting enough protein. I think that has stalled me a bit. I am tall too, so I need 100 to 110g. I eat around 1300 cals on the average day, so I have to work at getting that protein, and if I do so, the fat seems to come with it, since I am not eating skinless chicken breasts (YUCK).
                                I make my own venison jerky. Very protein dense and portable. Also when it's dried like that, it doesn't look or feel like such a huge amount.

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