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Reality check: Counting calories

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  • #61
    PaleoBird, I'm a little more than 10 years younger than you and nearly a foot shorter, but our BMIs are virtually the same. I have not found it possible to lose ALL the weight I wanted just on pure PB - the first 30 lbs came off really easy, the last 10 have been harder and the next 10 are going to require a huge effort - right now I am hacking away at those last 10 lbs (and I mean "hacking" in both senses!) I'm trying to do VLC with intermittent fasting 20-22 hrs every 3rd day. I am also lifting heavy - not at Batty's level, but I can do a few sets of 100 lb squats - and I'm going to up my sprints to twice a week. I *think* this is working but I may end up needing to calorie restrict to some extent too.

    Being post-menopausal will probably make it even more difficult for you - as women (and men, but to a lesser extent) age their bodies become more conservative with the energy. The obvious way to counteract this tendency is to pack on a little more muscle. I know you're not a huge fan of the lifting, but maybe add a bit in? Can't hurt.

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    • #62
      It would make so much sense if I was like that too, NutMeg. I know I effortlessly lost weight when I became a whole foods vegan a couple years back and kept it off. I switched to carnivore because I read so much that made it sound like it was healthier, like Taubes, but then I ended up just getting heavier and heavier. So I'm just really at a loss as to the idea that carbs could actually make me LOSE weight. Flies right in the face of low carb, doesn't it?

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      • #63
        Originally posted by brahnamin View Post
        I
        Reading this post (and several others that track along a similar path) I begin to wonder if PB really just works better for males than it does females (I'll exclude the extremely athletic females like Batty and Erica (of the *bazillion alternative pizza recipe* fame) from this observation). Maybe serious heavy workouts are necessary for real success in that last stack of pounds.

        My primary interest lies in the fact that I know my wife is very likely to follow in my footsteps despite her current vegetarian ways should this truly turn into a success for me (previously she has been much more adept at losing weight than I am and it will totally get her goat if I start losing faster than she does - not a criticism, I just know the woman).
        Interesting observation. It does seem ridiculously easy for some men.

        Hehe. "get her goat" struck me as funny because I have goat leg stew simmering in the crockpot right now.

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        • #64
          Originally posted by lexsi340 View Post
          I think the thing with calorie-counting is, as Mark & Gary Taubes have pointed out - it is IMPOSSIBLE to accurately count calories, and calories are utilized differently by your body depending on the substance.

          I understand where you're coming from - for instance, you can't eat completely excessively just because it's good food. I just think calories are a bad way to measure "excessive".
          Right. You can't really eat all the bacon wrapped bacon in the world and still lose weight. So how do we measure it if not by calories?

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          • #65
            Paleobird, count me among those who don't see "effortless weight loss" with the primal way of eating, and I'm about 100 pounds overweight. I purchased a FitDay download awhile back, and I find that if I track what I'm eating, I can lose weight (but slowly). If I don't track, I tend to gain most of it back. I think I need to have the data in front of me, or I'll tend to put too much in my mouth without thinking. I also like to see the fat/carb/protein breakdown, and I find that when I'm regularly tracking my food there is usually an "Aha!" moment when I see that something isn't as good I thought it was.

            Do you ever take your blood sugar readings? If you follow the Heart Scan Blog, you'll see that Dr. Davis thinks that postprandial BS readings have a great deal to do with whether you lose weight or not. I wonder how your BS reacts to no food for nearly 24 hours, then suddenly getting all your calories at once. It may be a perfectly normal reaction, but if that normal reaction spikes your BS > 110 or 120 or so (which CW will tell you is fantastic), so then it may inhibit weight loss.

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            • #66
              Originally posted by spughy View Post
              PaleoBird, I'm a little more than 10 years younger than you and nearly a foot shorter, but our BMIs are virtually the same. I have not found it possible to lose ALL the weight I wanted just on pure PB - the first 30 lbs came off really easy, the last 10 have been harder and the next 10 are going to require a huge effort - right now I am hacking away at those last 10 lbs (and I mean "hacking" in both senses!) I'm trying to do VLC with intermittent fasting 20-22 hrs every 3rd day. I am also lifting heavy - not at Batty's level, but I can do a few sets of 100 lb squats - and I'm going to up my sprints to twice a week. I *think* this is working but I may end up needing to calorie restrict to some extent too.

              Being post-menopausal will probably make it even more difficult for you - as women (and men, but to a lesser extent) age their bodies become more conservative with the energy. The obvious way to counteract this tendency is to pack on a little more muscle. I know you're not a huge fan of the lifting, but maybe add a bit in? Can't hurt.
              Some extra sprints sound like a good idea. Plus maybe moving up some levels on my LHT workouts (which I do at home). I just don't see myself ever getting back in the gym. It's just too much of an 80s flashback for me.

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              • #67
                Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                I'm post menopausal so PMS and such are history. I do take a post breast cancer drug that may be a hormone blocker of some kind.

                I figured or knew this, but I was thinking of aromatase inhibitors when I wrote it.

                That Bodybugg sounds like a great invention. Must go goole now
                mine is the GoWearFit, I think, got it from Costco. It definitely had it's place, as I learned something from it!

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by pebblehead View Post
                  Paleobird, count me among those who don't see "effortless weight loss" with the primal way of eating, and I'm about 100 pounds overweight. I purchased a FitDay download awhile back, and I find that if I track what I'm eating, I can lose weight (but slowly). If I don't track, I tend to gain most of it back. I think I need to have the data in front of me, or I'll tend to put too much in my mouth without thinking. I also like to see the fat/carb/protein breakdown, and I find that when I'm regularly tracking my food there is usually an "Aha!" moment when I see that something isn't as good I thought it was.

                  Do you ever take your blood sugar readings? If you follow the Heart Scan Blog, you'll see that Dr. Davis thinks that postprandial BS readings have a great deal to do with whether you lose weight or not. I wonder how your BS reacts to no food for nearly 24 hours, then suddenly getting all your calories at once. It may be a perfectly normal reaction, but if that normal reaction spikes your BS > 110 or 120 or so (which CW will tell you is fantastic), so then it may inhibit weight loss.
                  Not being diabetic or anywhere near it, I have never felt the need to measure blood sugar levels. When I'm fasting, I don't feel like the typical "low blood sugar" weakness, shaky feeling or any of that stuff. If anything I feel really good. Alive, focused, intense. My workouts are great fasting.

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                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                    Then there is the question of if I really need to lose 30 lbs or if some chart just says I do. I don’t care about charts. I know what I look like naked and it’s not what I want to see. Also, even though I am healthy now, I would like to prevent the health problems that can be a result of excess weight down the line. (Also I am not one of those size 2 people needing help getting to size 0. I am 5'10" and 180 but I would like to be 150)
                    Haven't read the whole thread, but was struck by this.... 5"10? size 10? That seems to be exactly the size someone your height should be wearing.... (If not a 12). Are you sure you really have 30 pounds to lose?

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                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                      Not being diabetic or anywhere near it, I have never felt the need to measure blood sugar levels. When I'm fasting, I don't feel like the typical "low blood sugar" weakness, shaky feeling or any of that stuff. If anything I feel really good. Alive, focused, intense. My workouts are great fasting.
                      It's not about diabetes. It's about weight loss, and about understanding how your body metabolizes your food. Here is a link to a blog post explaining it. A lot of people here in the MDA forums read Dr. Davis' blog, myself included, and have a lot of respect for what he says since he seems to be one of those MD's who really "gets" it.

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                      • #71
                        Oh Paleobird, I am in the same boat! I will admit to being one who read the book (and now several Paleo books) and thought after reading that weight loss would "just happen." Alas, it just ain't happening! I do what I am supposed to but the weight just doesn't go. I haven't even really shifted to a smaller size or found the elusive increased entergy. I do like the foods I am eating and do find that I don't have the "sugar lows" after eating heavy carb meals.

                        I guess, it seems, we all have a decision to make. Either we buckle down and count calories (and probably be hungry) or resign ourselves to the fact that maybe we won't lose weight and just be haply with where we are. I am seriously struggling with the choice!

                        Carrie

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                        • #72
                          One of the things that I have been playing with is trying to do the very very small reduction....eat close to maintenance at my desired weight and try to drift there.

                          The post prandial stuff is interesting. I need to restock test strips and I need a new lancet. But I have to admit to finding checking blood sugars highly annoying. Partly because I so rarely get to sit down and just eat so my meal TAKES close to an hour sometimes.
                          MTA: because it is rare I dont have more to say

                          "When I got too tired to run anymore I just pretended I wasnt tired and kept running anyway" - my daughter Age 7

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                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                            About Batty’s thread which I so adore, Yes, body composition has shifted around allowing me into a smaller size jeans. But I am not buying the “muscle is more compact than fat so you should ditch your scale” argument. At the levels I’m working out, I am not packing on pounds of muscle. Batty is a different story. They don’t call her workout room “Batty’s Basement of Doom” for nothing. My PBF push ups, pull ups, planks, etc. are toning things up a bit so the size 10s fit and I’m loving that. But the reason I’m not seeing falling numbers on the scale is not because of muscle mass gain although it would be reassuring to believe that and keep eating my bacon.
                            no, i'm really not a different story. i am just like everyone else here. i am a former 200 lb woman who started out with pilates 3x a week and nothing else because i knew crapall about nutrition and exercise. i have restricted, starved myself, got really small, went on food benders, got bigger again, ad nauseum for the past 4 years. i have BTDT. i come from experience. so, i am entirely confused as to why my viewpoint is now dismissed because i enjoy lifting heavier than most of the females around here.

                            if you want to track and restrict, by all means, go for it. and if you can maintain that restriction indefinitely, then my proverbial hat goes off to you. but it always seems that 'eating too much' is the only answer people come up with, and i dont necessarily agree that it is.

                            paste what braintwin iniQuity said here and i'll leave it at that.
                            sigpic

                            HANDS OFF MY BACON :: my primal journal

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                            • #74
                              Originally posted by frances View Post
                              Haven't read the whole thread, but was struck by this.... 5"10? size 10? That seems to be exactly the size someone your height should be wearing.... (If not a 12). Are you sure you really have 30 pounds to lose?
                              There's a difference between adequate and awesome.

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                              • #75
                                well, i find "adequate" to not be an word that fits you at all. yes, it is like ill-fitting shirts. just not right. you're awesome, even if your body composition hasn't caught onto that idea yet. it will. i'm sure you'll figure it out, whatever it is that needs to happen.

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