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Reality check: Counting calories

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  • Originally posted by Kelda View Post
    Paleo - just had a chance to finally visit my fitday account, first time in a while and I can see why you are eating 6 eggs and waving goodbye to the bacon! Yes we get protein from good cheese, nuts and bacon but boy oh boy it comes with a BIG fat expense account.
    Indeed.

    So have you come up with your BMR, BMI, target weight, calories, macros calculations? I think people would benefit from more than one example of working this through.

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    • Originally posted by MamaGrok View Post
      I think there's still validity to the point that we have a fairly set setpoint, but the problem is, most of us who are overweight are NOT at our natural setpoint. A variety of unnatural factors, from medications to just plain excess availability of crap food and our indulging in it, mean we're starting at an unnatural place, and yes, we CAN lose that unnaturally accumulated fat.

      But someone who is unnaturally fluffy can lean out a lot, as many of us have. And stay that way. Because we were meant to be there in the first place.
      Well said, MamaGrok.

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      • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
        Indeed.

        So have you come up with your BMR, BMI, target weight, calories, macros calculations? I think people would benefit from more than one example of working this through.
        I started the process today ... just back so very jet-lagged and working on a big language editing project (report about Slovak Pensions for EU ... need I say more!) so I've just eaten today to see how it stacked up without going into too much detail.

        This morning I weighed in at 60.6 kg (133 lbs) - I haven't see a 6 at the beginning in more than a decade ... bit of a shock although the mirror shows where it is accumulating. I'm nearly 44 and 5' 5.5" and my goal is to get back to 56 kg (123lbs) - actually typing that out and realising I've gained 10 lbs is a rather mind-focussing!

        I'm still considered in the normal range obviously and I've arrived at Primal (16 months ago) from an eating-disordered chronic cardio endurance sport vegetarian background so will tread cautiously. However, I am used to being leaner/lighter than this and my goal this summer is cycling over the Pyrenees so weight is a factor when cycling mountains!

        Last summer I weighed 55 kg (121 lbs) when I rode my 1,000 epic cycle from John O Groats to Land's End on 100% Primal eating - I was around 14-16% body fat and looked my best in years and felt good and LGN! My goal is slightly more than that as I'm building muscle and it's too difficult to maintain any lower I think and I don't want to become totally obsessive about it again. The gain has come from continuing to eat the same amount over the winter when the training has necessarily decreased due to the large quantity of snow we have had!

        So - I think I can maintain 56 kg at around 1800 - 2000 calories with my training load - I lift heavy twice a week, swim three times a week (around 6 km total) and cycle 6-10 hours a week depending on the season. This is usually in four sessions, two on the turbo which include sprints and high intensity work (max of one hour) and two longer rides outdoors (weather permitting) of 2 - 5 hours duration all at moving about slowly effort. I'm trying to incorporate more walking (I used to run - I'm a recovered iron distance triathlete) too.

        Today's eating was as follows and according to Fitday was 1800 calories (ish - we know it isn't toally accurate!) split 64%/28%/8% that's 129 g/120 g/38 g - fat/protein/carbs

        4 scrambled eggs, 4 small, thin rashers of back bacon 100 gs (ie all meat) grilled (broilled I think you call it) for breakfast
        1 nakd bar (raw dried fruit/nuts - 154 calories), 1 oz camembert, 1 oz macadamia nuts
        240 g salmon, cup of broccoli and half a leek and half a cup of mushrooms sauteed in a little butter
        2 squares of Lindt 85% chocolate with coffee with a dash of double cream after dinner
        I drink herbal tea at other times

        Going forward I want to create around 300-400 calorie deficit from maintenance range of 1800-2000 so tomorrow's eating will be a little more protein but from leaner sources, I'll post again tomorrow evening to see how it's panned out.

        For now I hear some unintelligible Slovak English calling me ...
        Seeking the natural way in a modern world ...

        Comment


        • Today's stats ...

          Training - one hour on stationary bike including 20 mins (in two 10 min blocks of high intensity) the rest easy or up to 75% max hr, walk after an early dinner - 40 minutes

          Eating - According to Fitday - 1,432 calories as 93.0 g fat, 34.6 g carbs, 114.3 g protein 59%/9%/32%

          4 egg omlette with ham/0.5 oz cheddar/mushrooms
          4 brazil nuts
          Liver terrine, mashed swede, curly kale
          4 squares of 85%
          Herbal tea and two (decaff) coffees with dash of double cream

          And, I'm completely and utterly stuffed ... on less than 1500 calories ... I think we are onto something here Paleo LOL! And, I haven't thought about food to be honest and I could easily have delayed dinner a lot longer but have yoga tonight so need to have not just eaten.
          Seeking the natural way in a modern world ...

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          • Hello Paleobird and all...

            I spent the last few days reading through this entire thread and it has been very eye-opening! I am two months into this WOE and am losing weight without counting, but I know that won't last forever. I do watch my portions, though. What really struck me is getting adequate protein and lowering fat intake slightly. I recently read the Perfect Health Diet and it said for weight loss you do need to lower fat intake (not low-fat by any means, of course), but fat is the wiggle room for increasing or decreasing. I don't think I am getting nearly enough protein because I usually only eat two meals a day...sometime three. My morning is 2 cups coffee with lots of heavy cream (this is something I hate to give up, but probably need to- probably is equal to almost half a cup of cream and that amounts to a lot of fat calories and no protein). This morning I only had one cup of coffee with cream (yeah for me) and decided to eat 6 scrambled eggs. Boy did I have a hard time eating all of them... which makes me realize even more I am probably not getting enough protein. Anyone have any recommendations for BCAA? I would like to start taking them before and after my workouts. I often feel fatigued and wonder if it's because my body needs more protein.

            Anyways, very informative and helpful information here! I am so happy you started to lose weight again and feel good, also!! I will be keeping up with this thread! Thanks!

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Razzzzwell
              I have changed my views after seeing all the terrific success stories and the maintenance on another post.


              People like Jon Gabriel, Paleo, Greg, and numerous others on here have shown me that real life results trump "studies, and cannot be ignored. A good scientist would not ignore this.


              Albert Einstein ( who was a quality scientist of the hard sciences as opposed to the soft) said " The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and science. He to whom this emotion is a stranger , who can no longer pause to wonder and stand rapt in awe, is as good as dead: his eyes are closed.


              So, to Paleo I say continued success. Do not let anything stop you . I had a blind eye myself to the real life results people are getting.
              Awesome Razz!! For me the first thing I turn to are people who are currently working the program. That`s where the true evidence lies, in the experiences and results. I admire your honesty and your humbleness (is that even a word?? lol)
              "Anxiety is a sign of spiritual insecurity"
              www.beachbodycoach.com/fatbusters

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              • @healthyone
                Yes, at the beginning of this thread, everyone was on my case about IFing too much thinking I might be starving myself. Well, they were right in a way. While I was not deficient in overall calories, I wasn't getting enough protein. If you really make sure to get enough protein first, there really isn't that much room for extra fat beyond what is already in the protein source.

                I think Kelda was the resident expert on BCAAs. I've never tried them.

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                • Originally posted by Kelda View Post
                  I think we are onto something here Paleo.
                  I think you're right.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by healthy11 View Post
                    Anyone have any recommendations for BCAA? I would like to start taking them before and after my workouts. I often feel fatigued and wonder if it's because my body needs more protein.
                    Art De Vany talks about 5 - 10 g BCAA per meal for females until they have reached their goal weight/body composition - I don't know anything about brands though (I'm in the UK anyway so it probably wouldn't help much) aids feeling sated and stops cravings as it provides the brain with what it wants. I'm not sure how that equates to replacing gs of protein though!
                    Seeking the natural way in a modern world ...

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                    • OK, today has been a bit tricky! As planned I IFd breakfast as I swim at 7 am followed by LHTs on a Tuesday and then have a Yoga class at 10:30. So first meal was a late lunch by the time I'd got back home having taken an emergency phone call from a friend (more of that in a mo) - had IFd since 4:30 yesterday afternoon.

                      I ate BAS with a portion of the Liver Terrine from yesterday, 2 pieces of Lindt choc with coffee and dash of cream

                      Then went on mercy run ferrying said friend to hospital to visit her husband (a good friend of mine too) who was admitted this morning with heart pains that came on during his cycle training session first thing (a committed cardio junky and high carb consumer - 42 year old and very fit with low body fat :-/) getting back late afternoon put roast chicken in oven (several hours later than planned) felt hungry and should have gone for cold meat but instead ate small piece of cheese and handful of brazil nuts plus two squares of chocolate with herbal tea.

                      Then had two eggs mixed with left over mashed swede and kale while chicken cooked. Once I've eaten the chicken the totals for today will be ...

                      Totals according to Fitday - 1,628 calories 111.7 fat 41.4 carbs 117.9 protein - 61%/10%/29%

                      The cheese and nuts were a bad call but it's been one of those days after a poor night sleep with Mr Grok keeping me awake with his constant fidgeting! As I often find poor sleep results in less good food choices and more hunger - all to do with the liver! However, I feel satisfied now and the breakdown isn't far off what I'm shooting for. Yoga is more strenous than it might appear! Lesson - more protein less fat, again! Hide the nuts perhaps, hey ho! Will do better tomorrow.
                      Seeking the natural way in a modern world ...

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                      • Thanks for checking in with your stats, Kelda.

                        I've been keeping to the plan with the exception of Saturday night when I went to a party and did too much munchie grazing. I am really seeing the wisdom in confining your eating to mealtimes. For me it seems like if I graze here and there, my body doesn't really remember it as having Eaten so it wants to keep on grazing. Somebody brought wasabi coated almonds to the party which were just too yummy plus I indulged in some cheese and salami. The next day it showed on the scale. Probably just bloat weight from extra salt and processed stuff like the salami but it was a good reminder to give up the snackage.

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                        • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                          Thanks for checking in with your stats, Kelda.

                          I've been keeping to the plan with the exception of Saturday night when I went to a party and did too much munchie grazing. I am really seeing the wisdom in confining your eating to mealtimes. For me it seems like if I graze here and there, my body doesn't really remember it as having Eaten so it wants to keep on grazing. Somebody brought wasabi coated almonds to the party which were just too yummy plus I indulged in some cheese and salami. The next day it showed on the scale. Probably just bloat weight from extra salt and processed stuff like the salami but it was a good reminder to give up the snackage.
                          Indeed, snacking is my downfall, the day before I was fine, a big breakfast and could have waited till after 6 pm to be honest and then felt full with my earlish dinner. Today not so good, not helped by poor sleep and ad hoc mercy runs which threw my planning. Just checked in to add 150 calories as I needed to eat more so finished off the liver with my chicken and now feel good again. So the totals for today are

                          1764 cals as 60%/9%/31 (134 g of protein!) %

                          I will keep the checking in going till Sunday when I'll weigh myself and we'll see what difference it's made! My own fault today didn't feel so good, but it is far from deprevation LOL! Now off to the Depression thread (there is no connection - I feel fine LOL!).

                          Tomorrow will be a little different as I have to factor in a long bike ride - will be interesting :-)
                          Seeking the natural way in a modern world ...

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                          • Will be interested to see how easy it is for folks to maintain after counting for fat loss.

                            I counted for 6 weeks. 1500 calories. Was losing nicely, but I was getting bored, lol! I only had 5 lbs left to lose (approx--I don't weigh myself!)

                            So I read the LeanSaloon blog over my vacation and decided to drop a meal. I was IFing 14-15 hours already, so I just adjusted my eating window from 12-8 pm. Worked really well and got a flat belly, even with lots of eating out!

                            2 weeks later and it looks like I have about 3 lbs left to lose, so I am guessing I maintained my fat loss at about 1 lb a week.

                            IFing is a lot more fun than counting! However, counting definitely helped me to get a grip on portions/calories and learn not to gorge.
                            Ancestral Nutrition Coaching
                            Pregnancy Nutrition Coaching
                            Primal Pregnancy Nutrition Article

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                            • Originally posted by Dragonfly View Post
                              I counted for 6 weeks. 1500 calories. Was losing nicely, but I was getting bored, lol! I only had 5 lbs left to lose (approx--I don't weigh myself!)

                              So I read the LeanSaloon blog over my vacation and decided to drop a meal. I was IFing 14-15 hours already, so I just adjusted my eating window from 12-8 pm. Worked really well and got a flat belly, even with lots of eating out!

                              2 weeks later and it looks like I have about 3 lbs left to lose, so I am guessing I maintained my fat loss at about 1 lb a week.

                              IFing is a lot more fun than counting! However, counting definitely helped me to get a grip on portions/calories and learn not to gorge.
                              I just naturally seem to only eat two meals a day and often the a.m. one is more of a small something, not a full meal. Some people would call that IFing, but I just find it normal. I actually find the counting to be fun, not tedious. Maybe it just appeals to my academic geekiness. I like playing with numbers. I think a lot of people have so much negativity tied up with calorie counting in their heads due to years of CW deprivation diets and all the frustration and failure that inevitably follow. This is so different.

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                              • Originally posted by Paleobird View Post
                                I just naturally seem to only eat two meals a day and often the a.m. one is more of a small something, not a full meal. Some people would call that IFing, but I just find it normal. I actually find the counting to be fun, not tedious. Maybe it just appeals to my academic geekiness. I like playing with numbers. I think a lot of people have so much negativity tied up with calorie counting in their heads due to years of CW deprivation diets and all the frustration and failure that inevitably follow. This is so different.
                                Sure, but are you happy to count for the rest of your life? It was getting too repetitive for me, though it was fun for the first month. No negativity, just boredom.
                                Last edited by Dragonfly; 03-22-2011, 04:46 PM.
                                Ancestral Nutrition Coaching
                                Pregnancy Nutrition Coaching
                                Primal Pregnancy Nutrition Article

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