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I am sorry

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  • I am sorry

    I want to apologize to everyone that I've ranted at in the last few days about religion. I offer this not as an excuse but as an explanation for my bad behavior.

    I have had a lot of really, really bad experiences with religious people. I've had a lot of people push me, accuse me, and guilt-trip me about my nonbelief. I've fought back, because that's who I am. One of the worst times, for me, was two years ago when my Dad died and I had to attend his religious funeral (after having been guilt-tripped about my nonbelief by his priest at his deathbed, no less). Having to deal with all the well-intentioned religious platitudes that everyone was throwing at me just made me more and more angry, both about his having died and about the message I was receiving, which was: you are not part of this event because you do not believe in a god. (My mother-in-law (a devout Mormon) told me that I was a bad son for not believing that my father is in heaven. I'm sure you can see why the mention of Mormonism, especially, just set me off.)

    This past Wednesday was the second anniversary of his death from gangrene, brought on by complications of diabetes and cancer. For the last week or so, I've been really raw and on edge. And to add insult to injury, I've also had immense work and school stress and no way to fix any of it.

    None of that excuses the fact that I took it out on all of you. I'm truly sorry I did that. I value this community and the people here. I just... lost it. I'd just had it. I was angry and grieving and missing my Dad like crazy, and the last thing I wanted to hear was people praising something that has hurt me very, very deeply.

    In the interest of honesty, I still don't think religion is a good thing. I still think the world would be a better place without it. But from now on, I will do my best not to share that opinion with people on this forum who think religion is a good thing, no matter how much I disagree with them.

    And I'm sorry for what I said and did on this forum this past week.
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  • #2
    Griff~ (((Hugs)))
    I am truly sorry for your loss. I appreciate you sharing what's happening for you.
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    • #3
      One of the things I appreciate the most from people is the ability to be REAL. Although i didn't experience what you are speaking about as I haven't been on the boards this wk, I am thankful for your honesty and openness. Both in this post and in so many answers you offer to questions.
      Your loss is something I can't imagine and am sure it has caused indescribable grief. You are truly passionate and understanding this, I can see why.


      • #4
        I'm sorry for what you are going through Griff. I know that raw grief feeling....not a good place to be.

        Thanks for providing us with the context for your responses, the magnitude of your reaction makes much more sense now.
        Using low lectin/nightshade free primal to control autoimmune arthritis. (And lost 50 lbs along the way )


        • #5
          Religion is a good thing for some giving them hope, and a inner feeling of strength. BUT. ..most people believe in a religion because that's what they were raised to believe without any proof of truth. Not to mention the millions who don't even understand their religion thinking that by calling upon their god or gods in time of need or going to church every Sunday makes them religious and "good" what they don't understand is all religions are set forth as a guide, principles to follow if you will on how to act. If everyone fully understood their religion the world would be a different place. Men who always act.through selfless ness and are filled with compassion for all living things seldom follow a religion or have fully realized the meaning behind theirs. You can call yourself a good whatever but when it comes down to it it's about the choices you make when nobody is their to judge you. Nobody should ever push religion on anyone, or call one religion better than the other this is just a flaw in themselves. Im not sure what you said to deserve a apology to be written but you must be strong to be able to brush past the words of the religiously ignorant.
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          • #6
            Hey Griff
            I'm so sorry about your Dad. And fwiw, I totally agree with you about religion. When I lost the ability to keep my opinion to myself was during my bout with breast cancer. A well meaning devoutly Baptist friend kept saying that I should, "Put it in the hands of the Lord." Then as I healed, she was "praising the Lord" for my "miraculous" recovery. And I thought, the person who invented the mammogram machine didn't sit around putting everything in the hands of the Lord, he or she got busy and DID something. It wasn't any miracle that saved me, it was science. This was when I shifted from seeing religion as a benign difference of perceptions, live and let live. Now I see it as a ball and chain that is holding humanity back from social and technological progress. As Bill Mahrer said at the end of "Religulous" we, collectively, need to grow up or die.

            So, anytime you feel the need to have a good rant about religion feel free to write me a PM. You will, however, be preaching to the choir



            • #7
              Hi Griff,

              I first would like to say how sorry I am that you are hurting.

              Also, I have been so wounded by "the church" and organised religion in general. I am only this year finally tearing apart the bondage that I have been held in, the bondage of fear and repression and guilt.

              I know you are a sociology prof, and I am a first year university student with a growing love for sociology. (I may even beg for your help at some point when I am working on my paper! Please? )

              Anyways, I just wanted to thank you. Some people don't realise that organized religion is completely different than spirituality. I don't believe in a dogma, or deity or anything concrete, but I do love yoga and meditating. I guess I I'm starting to believe that spirituality is personal and outside of religion, and that religion is a construct of man built for control.

              It's lonely and heartwrenching learning this, because there's no turning back to the soft comfort of sheeple. Thanks for being a hero to those like me who are just trying to crawl out of the miasma of lies and manipulation.
              Last edited by lil_earthmomma; 01-28-2011, 10:57 PM.
              The more I see the less I know for sure.
              -John Lennon


              • #8
                I get the same when talking about AGW/CC

                so many people treat it like it's a religion and rely on dogma under the guise of science (it's really junk science)

                much like when: Dr. Robert Olson made a plea for more data before sweeping recommendations are made to the American public and beyond. We also see Sen. George Mcgovern make the point that “…we need to do SOMETHING” about heart disease. We picked the wrong path and billions of dollars and millions of lives have subsequently been squandered.

                PS...hope your week gets better
                Last edited by kenn; 01-28-2011, 10:41 PM.
                Starting Date: Dec 18, 2010
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                Current Weight: 235 pounds
                Goal Weight: 195 pounds


                • #9
                  Sorry for the crappy week with crappy memories

                  When my brother died of SIDS, my parents were turned completely away from religion by breathtakingly cruel comments like "Since you didn't have him baptized yet, he can't go to heaven." WTF!

                  I was born after my brother died, so the spiritual part of my brain was never exercised and atrophied. Funny to think that without that event and the aftermath, I would be probably be religious, since my parents were regular church goers before that. Makes it all seem arbitrary.

                  Zone diet on and off for several years....worked, but too much focus on exact meal composition
                  Primal since July 2010...skinniest I've ever been and the least stressed about food


                  • #10
                    It would be nice if Griff's apology post didn't turn into a religion bashing thread. Hopefully, it won't.


                    • #11
                      I too am sorry about your loss and the stuff you are going through. Thanks for the explanation. i understand about lashing out. I did so after the AZ shooting. It happens.

                      I frequently curse organized religion privately. I try to not do it publicly because it isn't fair, but it is how I feel. I do follow neo-paganism. Talk about getting bashed!
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                      • #12

                        I understand your pain. When my brother died four years ago, I was the outcast. The nonbelieving child, sister, friend, who could find no comfort in platitudes about his death. We can often pretend the different belief systems do not matter when things are good. But in times of stress, those differences become issues among those we care about.

                        I hope you find a way to process your grief in a way that helps you cope and allows you to connect wth family with different belief structures. I know my family and I will never be on the same page for religious beliefs. But I also know we will share in the grief when we lose a family member.
                        Food should be fun--Thomas Keller


                        • #13
                          Griff: I am not sorry you are hurting. your pain is a testament to the depth of your loss and the depth of your love for lost ones. I hurt from the loss of my father two years ago, from my mother's early death 15 years ago, from the loss of some dear friends. I love them and miss them and it causes pain of a real human kind.

                          I agree with all that has been said in this thread about not confusing spirituality with religious following (not that the two are mutually exclusive, but neither is the later a necessary precursor or the former). I highly recommend "Fingerprints of God" by Barbara Bradley Haggerty about the nature of spiritual or transcendent experiences. Well written and interesting connections and commonalities between transcendent experiences, whether borne from deep hurt, deep religious observance, psychedelic experience or other random experience. Cool book.

                          Be Well.

                          One Delta Ten Tango


                          • #14
                            thanks for keeping it honest and real, Griff.

                            i'm very sorry for the loss of your father, and the lack of helpful support during that time for you. i'm sorry that people said such hurtful things to do, simply because you do not believe as they do. it was wrong, and i'm sorry it happened to you.


                            • #15

                              Griff, I especially love the way you keep it real. You do a lot of good here, and no doubt in the rest of your life, too. It is OK if you spin your wheels a little bit every now and then.

                              Take care of yourself!