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Groks vs Grokettes

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  • Groks vs Grokettes

    I'm wondering if there's a difference between the way men and women respond to the PB? It seems (I think) that the women have a harder time feeling better as fast . . . and are having more trouble with depression and maybe thyroid issues. Do we need to modify in some way? I know Sarah the Editor said something in her post about what's in her fridge that some of her friends are needing a little bit of fructose still.

    Love Mark's wisdom and advice, though.

  • #2
    Women go through more hormonal rollercoasters, including PCOS. Men don't have ovaries :P It is a theory that many of the cases where women killed someone else or went on a rampage did so because of their menstrual cycles throwing their logic out the window. Don't ever cross a woman!

    Most of thyroid disorders are autoimmune (I have Hashi's) and having one makes it more likely to have another condition linked. Though, men are as likely to have thyroid disorders as well, if only a little less likely.

    Then there's the thing about serotonin, a mood booster. Carbs will push a surge of serotonin, and some people can get crabby if they don't have carbs. People have to figure out what their bodies need.


    • #3
      I have to say, after a couple of weeks I seem to be terminally grumpy with everyone and I really hate it!! I'm not usually like this. I just hope there's something I'm missing and will figure it out soon!


      • #4
        FlamingAndromeda, that's just the kind of thing I'm wondering about! What Kristy says about serotonin and carbs might be what's bothering you. I don't know if it's women, or people who are naturally low in seratonin, or what, but I know I was on a total rollercoaster of feeling good, euphoric even, after a big carb fest, and then like grey death when I cut them out. I was managing my feeling of well-being by eating or not eating carbs. I actually read quite a bit about the physiology of "sugar sensitivity" at this site

        and I think it's right on.

        I've been eating almost 100% primal for a couple of months now. Last week, dh was at a conference and I went along. Fell off the wagon and ate lots of sugar and caffeine. It's taken me the better part of a week to feel halfway human again after 3 days of carbs. I won't have to do that too many times until I'm cured for good.

        The radiant recovery lady has a protocol for raising your serotonin levels naturally -- but it involves eating a bit of potato before you go to bed. You could maybe try it? (It has to be 3 hours after a big bunch of protein.) Or you could just tough it out. I think your mood will improve sooner or later.


        • #5
          I subscribe to Kathleen's newsletters but rarely read them these days...I was big in to her about five/six years back with the whole sugar addict thing and used to eat my nightly baked potato with butter...but haven't paid much attention since then. Potatoes are my favourite...I actually just munched out on a whole pile of potato chips this afternoon...and am curious as to how that will make me feel.

          There is so much to understand science-wise with how all this works and I find myself getting confused...however the Primal Blueprint just feels right to be doing and it's by far the easiest, simplest of any food thing I've ever done...I don't really even feel guilty about the chips - they were good and I enjoyed them immensely!! So I'm not going to give up...and if I find I need a potato here or there to pick me up then I shall...

          Thanks for the reminder/information Sanas!


          • #6
            I haven't noticed a huge difference mentally/emotionally speaking, but the weight is not dropping off as fast as several guys on this board are reporting.

            Carb wise I have absolutely no desire for any grain product (yay!). I make sure I eat veggies and/or berries with every meal. I mix my veggies up to stop myself getting bored. Occasionally I eat sweet potatoes when I need an extra boost, but it's not often.
            "For animals, the entire universe has been neatly divided into things to (a) mate with, (b) eat, (c) run away from, and (d) rocks." - Terry Pratchett, Equal Rites

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            • #7
              It's definitely true that I can thrive on a far lower-carb diet than wifey Fist (I say 'far lower' in the context of us both eating Primal, she still eats low carb). Any biological/evolutionary evidence for this, I wonder?
              The Primal Journey of Mr and Mrs Fist


              • #8
                We've talked about this a bit in the past. In some ways, from an evolutionary perspective, it makes sense that women, who may have been doing the majority of gathering (think plants--carbs!) were also snacking while gathering. (Have you ever picked strawberries and not eaten a couple?) If men were the ones hunting for the most part, they may have needed to do longer IFs while on the hunt--no stopping to grab a handful of berries from a nearby bush when chasing a fast moving meal! On the lean gains site, Martin suggests women fast for a shorter amount of time than men b/c it seems more difficult for women to hold out for long fasts.

                I find this stuff all very fascinating. It seems pregnant primal women tend to crave more carbs than they normally do, and although I realize carbs are *not* necessary for life in general, I wonder if women's optimum diet is slightly different (and more carb inclusive) than men's. I also notice huge changes in the amount and type of food I crave at different points in my cycle, which is something Grokette may have dealt with, and Grok probably did not.

                It all comes back to you--what diet do *you* feel best eating. I think sticking to primal foods and staying within Mark's carb range for maintance levels gives a fair amount of carbs to most folks. Many of the forumers here are way lower carb than the PB says you need to be, and I don't know that this *is* optimum for *everyone*. I've still never stuck to VLC for long yet, ever--be it willpower or just not right for me... I just feel a lot better personally eating tons of veggies, some fruit as long as it is close to meals or protein/fat rich snacks, and a small amount of nuts for carbs, and almost no tubers. (Tubers I find fascinating though, and go back and forth on them in my mind.) I also always eat in the least 100 g carbs a day, but probably hang out closer to the 150 range. I'm not trying to lose weight--working more on body comp now, and just trying to follow my body.

                Watching this thread w/ interest! I would LOVE to read some science on this topic!!!! Much of what I've read, and thought, is really anecdotally based, or just my own musings from *my* own experience.
                My Before/After Pics
                Are you new here? Be sure to check these links FIRST, before reading anything on the forum! Succeed & PB 101

                "I am a work in progress." -Ani DiFranco


                • #9
                  Right on, FairyRae. I definitely find that my cravings change throughout my cycle. I try to listen to my body as much as possible, which usually means eating around 100 g of carbs daily, but upping carbs (as well as total calories) for a few days around my period.

                  As for how Grokettes vs. Groks respond to the PB, I have noticed that women have a harder time dropping weight than men in general, especially if they are already in a healthy weight range. Admittedly, my observations are based on a small non-random sample, but it also makes a degree of sense from an evolutionary standpoint, since women do require a certain amount of fat for fertility. On the other hand, I also seem to be more sensitive to carbohydrates than my husband, and have experienced a more significant benefit from cutting them than he has.
                  The Primal Holla! Eating fat. Getting lean. Being awesome.

                  You were sick, but now you're well, and there's work to do. - Kilgore Trout


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Primal Fist View Post
                    It's definitely true that I can thrive on a far lower-carb diet than wifey Fist (I say 'far lower' in the context of us both eating Primal, she still eats low carb). Any biological/evolutionary evidence for this, I wonder?
                    It is the opposite with my husband and myself. I can thrive on far fewer carbs than he without having any issues.
                    Start weight: 250 - 06/2009
                    Current weight: 199
                    Goal: 145


                    • #11
                      Interesting mood thought/question... I have always had monthly moods, much improved by going primal. Just in the last month, they've gotten worse - and longer-lasting. Last week there was a lot more misery than I've had in a long time. What have I been eating a lot of? Conventional meat.

                      I'm biting the bullet and buying the good stuff. T-bones on sale are awesome, but if they leave me feeling like crap, what's the point?


                      • #12
                        I wonder. If PB improves testosterone (androgen) levels for men, perhaps for some women it increases their androgens too -- which could arguably rev up our monthly Time of Joy so it's a little closer to what it was like back when we were teenagers with more androgens (estrogen especially).

                        As an increasingly-older chick, my periods were getting less dramatic. And that's hormonal (in part due to my weight). So I wonder if that will reverse somewhat once I'm done being pregnant, breastfeeding, etc.

                        It'll be interesting. And presumably still worthwhile!
                        "Trust me, you will soon enter a magical land full of delicious steakflowers, with butterbacons fluttering around over the extremely rompable grass and hillsides."


                        • #13
                          Is serotonin the key to this? The number of receptors we each have in our brain? We need it to function well and feel good . . . those of us with lots of receptors need more to feel optimal . . . and carbohydrates is how they get into the brain. (I think.)

                          Katt, does your husband have more of a "sweet tooth" than you do?


                          • #14
                            Hmm, I've been Primal for about 2 weeks now, havn't had any issues, any cravings, etc. But then I don't have to deal with fluctuating hormones right now as I'm 9 weeks postpartum and and constant nursing keeps my cycle away for about a year, YAY! I havn't had any problem keeping carbs super low, average of about 70gms for the days I've kept track. My husband doesn't think he could live like this, not eating grains, and up til a few weeks ago he ate way healthier than me. I've always been the sugar/carbaholic.


                            • #15
                              Hmmm, I was always the one with the crazy sweet-tooth, and yet I'm the one who can live on very low carbs. Maybe we just live to extremes!
                              The Primal Journey of Mr and Mrs Fist