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new fasting schedules, more grok-inspired?

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  • new fasting schedules, more grok-inspired?

    OK Im reading up on Martin and leangains since Ive seen it mentioned here several times now. I've recently tweaked my weekly fasting schedule, doing more of an alternate day thing, where on those days (M<W<F) I have about a 20 hour fast (8 sleeping, the rest day time) and break it with a 800-1000 calorie single meal at 5 or 6 pm. Then eat normally the next day (one AM meal (aroung 7:30 am) of about 800 cals, and one evening meal (around 7:30 pm) of about 700 cals, with the 12 hour no eating period in between.

    Im not usually so calorie focused, I just figured I would phrase it that way for quick reference. I eat 2/3 calories in fat, average 115-120 grams of protein a day (i have LBM of around 100 lbs), 100 grams fat daily, and avg 30-50 carbs a day. Even though the meal is big on a fasting day, I dont really care, because my goal is not really fat loss, but rather cell repair and renewal that comes from the 20 hours of abstaining from food.

    I am doing this because I felt that lunch was getting a bit redundant, as I sit at a desk in my office during the week, and am not being active during this time, and usually wasnt hungry for lunch, but ate anyway because I didnt want to waste food, but felt like I was eating too often. I have learned that my body was meant to go longer than 4 hours without food just fine! I used to do just one 24 hour fast a week,with a smaller fast-breaking meal, but I like this better



    Anyway Im trying this new schedule out starting this week. To me, fasting makes eating so much better. Mindlessly and unnaturally shoveling food into our faces, when we are never truly hungry (6 small meals a day crowd) makes us less sensitive to how the food effects our energy levels, and more prone to overeating. I feel like grok probably had two big main meals during his day, and spent the rest of the day at leisure or working on shelter etc. It takes a lot of energy to procure a high fat high protein food source (aka hunting and killing an animal) therefore I assume he ate larger meals less frequently and had lots of time in between meals, and also expended a lot of his energy in a fasted state. and im rambling....

    Does anyone else have similar ADF fasting schedules or experiences?
    Last edited by lmyers04; 06-01-2010, 06:34 AM.

  • #2
    I have a theory that we do best when the fasting is random rather than routine. Nothing else to add



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    • #3
      very well said cillakat.
      you sumed it up .

      been 45 hours of undereating for me.
      just back from a sprint workout feels amazing.

      can feel the real hunger now, gunna break it with 20 whole organic eggs

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      • #4
        I don't do the alternate day fasting schedule per se, but I do have alternating days due to the way my own schedule tends to work out a lot of the time. Some week nights I only eat once and on others I have a normal dinner and then a supper (usually just bacon and eggs). Moving my eggs and bacon to supper has completely removed my weekend attachment to breakfast as well. Now, I don't eat breakfast or lunch pretty much ever.
        http://www.facebook.com/daemonized

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        • #5
          I've implemented the 16/8 fasting/fed protocol from leangains and I've noticed a huge difference in body composition after switching to this method about a month ago.
          I grok, therefore I am.

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          • #6
            HOLY CRAP 20 eggs! lol, that's like two cartons!!! yeah, it's more fun and natural for me to just make the fasts random, but like mark said, some people are more spontaneous than others. Some people like to plan things out. I think i fall in the middle, but just skipping meals when im not hungry is so much fun! I tend to to skip breakfast more in the weekends.
            "I know what my body needs and what it can handle. There's no better way to achieve my goal than what im doing now. If my regimen leads to my death, be it in six days or six months...I will die fullfiled. The outcome is irrelavent so long as i steer towards my fate. If death is to be my prize, i welcome it with open arms."

            "A pound of meat a day keeps the doctor away"

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            • #7
              Originally posted by TheGrappler View Post
              HOLY CRAP 20 eggs! lol, that's like two cartons!!! yeah, it's more fun and natural for me to just make the fasts random, but like mark said, some people are more spontaneous than others. Some people like to plan things out. I think i fall in the middle, but just skipping meals when im not hungry is so much fun! I tend to to skip breakfast more in the weekends.
              lol grappler did i mention they are gunna be cooked in ghee and coconut milk.
              i love it wen i say, to top that i have a 28inch waist .

              p.s “The best of all medicines is resting and fasting”- Benjamin Franklin.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by cillakat View Post
                I have a theory that we do best when the fasting is random rather than routine. Nothing else to add

                I see your point, but modern life, with jobs, college courses, social events......it makes sense to me to plan out my fasts. If I didnt plan them, my constant access to food in this modern life would probably mean that I would never fast at all.

                And ,of course, I wont be sticking to this schedule for the rest of my years, either. Next month I can switch up the days, extend or decrease the no-food period, or whatever. Honestly, it will most likely change week- to week. (and that includes weeks with no fasting at all)

                There is also a high probability that I will not eat exactly according to plan either, as things come up in day to day life, and will probably result in my making minor adjustments in my eating through out the week. I often plan out each of my meals, since I cook almost everymeal, and find myself making significant adjustments to these plans too! Things just never go exactly as planned

                So, yes, I have "planned" my fasts, but does that make them rigid, un-spontaneous endeavors? No. For instance, I know when Im going to fast, but my body, however, does not! The signals of hunger I receive during the fasts is my body asking for food, wondering where it is, and dealing with out it.

                "Plan your progress carefully; hour by hour, day by day, month by month. Organized activity and maintained enthusiasm are the wellsprings of your power."--Paul J. Meyer
                Last edited by lmyers04; 06-01-2010, 07:43 AM.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Lovestoclimb View Post
                  I've implemented the 16/8 fasting/fed protocol from leangains and I've noticed a huge difference in body composition after switching to this method about a month ago.
                  I tried what I thought was the correct approach to leangains by eating a light lunch, working out, eating a large meal soon post-workout and another pretty big meal not long before going to bed, but I definitely gained some flab doing that. I was probably just going way too high on calories; I "supplemented" with copious amounts of heavy cream, heh. Any tips Lovestoclimb? I see all the awesome results on Martin's blog, and I want to follow suit.

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                  • #10
                    I think that the idea of fasting unplanned sounds better too, but with work and events going on all the time I kind of have to have things planned. The old plan was to eat breakfast lunch and dinner anyway. I also wish that my workdays weren't planned either that I could come and go work whenever I wanted, but my employer wouldn't tolerate that much eccentricity.
                    http://www.facebook.com/daemonized

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Daemonized View Post
                      I think that the idea of fasting unplanned sounds better too, but with work and events going on all the time I kind of have to have things planned. The old plan was to eat breakfast lunch and dinner anyway. I also wish that my workdays weren't planned either that I could come and go work whenever I wanted, but my employer wouldn't tolerate that much eccentricity.
                      I think all our fasting is somewhat planned when you think about it. We know when we will be in situations where eating is unavoidable (being invited over for dinner at someones house for instance) or when eating is probably preferential (I wouldn't want to "randomly" fast on a day that I had to write a 20 page research paper) And, with our knowledge of how human growth hormone secretion is enhanced after fasting post-workout, we can now plan our fasts and our workouts together, to dramatically increase the benefits of both. I think the notion of planning is an aspect of modern society that Mark Sisson would agree only further compliments grok-esque behaviors, rather than hindering them. Its supposed to be the BEST of both worlds, right?

                      And yes, I wish I could go wander around nature trails all day today.....its so absolutely gorgeous outside. maybe catch a nap by the pool, soak up some rays, do some light reading.....but alas Im in an office! I dont think my boss is going to make any exceptions today, and I dont think he gives a rats ass about Grok!
                      Last edited by lmyers04; 06-01-2010, 08:19 AM.

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                      • #12
                        I like a schedule to prevent overeating. Knowing me, random fasting would amount to more random eating than abstaining. For June I'm going on the notion that fasting durations for paleo people were cyclical/seasonal -- winter being the toughest season and where significant fat loss was most likely. So this month I'm incorporating 10 32-36 hour primal winter, food shortage fasts on an every 3rd day schedule -- eating lightly the morning after ending the fast, heavily that evening, then fasting 20 hours into the next evening, which is my normal schedule.

                        So, today = No food
                        Tomorrow = light breakfast, big dinner
                        The next day = big dinner only
                        Then back to no food for a day.

                        I like Daemon's schedule for long term maintenance and lifestyle. It seems natural to skip breakfast and lunch but enjoy food in the evening or into the night. Dinner and supper, no breakfast or lunch. The Warrior Diet makes a case for this being an accurate ancestral approach. They lit fires and ate to contentment at night, entertaining themselves with song and dance to encourage community, sound sleep, and discourage nocturnal predators. Eating meals by day would slow them down and diminish the importance of their evening gatherings. Another book I'm reading explains how this schedule was practiced by educated Roman society for similar reasons. They felt you couldn't optimally study or work on a full stomach. Eating by day would ruin the great feasts they planned for their evenings. You were seen as a glutton and a slouch if you ate before the evening feast.

                        In this forum and others, evening eating seems to be the easiest 16-22 hour schedule to keep.

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                        • #13
                          I can conceptualize a metabolic mechanism where random fasting might be beneficial, but it is hard to put into words, nor do I believe it really would actually matter. I guess it would go along the lines of confusing your system to break a plateau. I'm not sure I buy that idea either, and scheduling seems to be a very natural human endeavor that gives us certain advantages over other species.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Grol View Post
                            I can conceptualize a metabolic mechanism where random fasting might be beneficial, but it is hard to put into words, nor do I believe it really would actually matter. I guess it would go along the lines of confusing your system to break a plateau. I'm not sure I buy that idea either, and scheduling seems to be a very natural human endeavor that gives us certain advantages over other species.
                            you might even say we could schedule erratic eating patterns, right? As we can see with yours and daemon's eating schedules, planning does not have to mean repetition. We can mimic randomness just as easily as we can plan 3 squares a day.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Grol View Post
                              The Warrior Diet makes a case for this being an accurate ancestral approach. They lit fires and ate to contentment at night, entertaining themselves with song and dance to encourage community, sound sleep, and discourage nocturnal predators. Eating meals by day would slow them down and diminish the importance of their evening gatherings. Another book I'm reading explains how this schedule was practiced by educated Roman society for similar reasons. They felt you couldn't optimally study or work on a full stomach. Eating by day would ruin the great feasts they planned for their evenings. You were seen as a glutton and a slouch if you ate before the evening feast.

                              In this forum and others, evening eating seems to be the easiest 16-22 hour schedule to keep.

                              Besides the Warrior diet, what other books are you reading that makes this case? I wanna know so I can buy it!

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