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Are Legumes Really That Bad?

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  • #46
    It's true you don't have to combine proteins in a single meal, but you do ultimately have to eat all the essential aminos regularly. All legumes except soya are missing some amino acids, so legumes as your sole protein source wouldn't work. A vegan needs plenty of grains, nuts & seeds as well as pulses. (A vegetarian might be able to avoid the grains through heavy reliance on dairy and eggs.)

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
      Not at the same time, at the same meal, no. But within the same day, before your body rids itself of the complementary aminos, you must get the missing pieces.
      And you still have to eat about 2 cups of calorie-dense food. Calorie dense food that tastes a lot better with bacon, a ham hock or guacamole.

      Or you can eat 3oz of chicken.
      Female, 5'3", 50, Max squat: 202.5lbs. Max deadlift: 225 x 3.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
        Or you can eat 3oz of chicken.
        Well not everybody here is trying to do high protein. My protein hovers around 20% of calories with the lion's share being from complex carbs so beans supplemented with a bit of meat are really a good match for me, personally.
        My food philosophy is whole foods, simply and traditionally prepared. Food should honor your taste, health, and the environment.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
          And you still have to eat about 2 cups of calorie-dense food. Calorie dense food that tastes a lot better with bacon, a ham hock or guacamole.

          Or you can eat 3oz of chicken.
          I think you are being a bit semantic. If you enjoy food then you've probably eaten bacon, pork belly and other cuts of meat that are damn tasty, but calorie dense. I also don't know why you keep calling legumes calorie dense.

          100g of cooked lentils has 116 kcal and 9g of protein.
          100g of skinless chicken breast has 150 kcal and 29g of protein.

          So chicken is more calorie dense, with more protein. Lentils have a better mineral profile, and vitamins are about the same. Lentils have fibre. If you ate the fattier cuts of chicken (with skin, thigh, wings) your calories would be even higher, with less protein and the same vitamins and minerals.

          On a calorie basis, legumes have more minerals and vitamins than muscle meat does.

          So they each have pros and cons, and each have a place in your diet. Saying chicken has more protein, ergo legumes are pointless, is short sighted. Legumes are cheap, tasty (can be) and reasonably nutritious. Primal/paleo doesn't boil down to eating the same 'optimal' foods every day, nor are protein requirements that hard to meet.
          Last edited by AMonkey; 04-28-2014, 02:18 PM.
          http://lifemutt.blogspot.sg/ - Gaming, Food Reviews and Life in Singapore

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          • #50
            Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
            And you still have to eat about 2 cups of calorie-dense food. Calorie dense food that tastes a lot better with bacon, a ham hock or guacamole.

            Or you can eat 3oz of chicken.
            I'm with ya on this one SB.

            Frankly, I don't think there's anything wrong with properly soaked sprouted, and fermented beans (except the damn wait time for all three, but meh ). It has RS in it, good nutrients (that are actually bioavailable by fermenting the beans), helps regulate digestion...

            But as a protein source, meat is just... Easier. Or hell, can't eat all that meat in a day? Eat a small piece or two and get gelatin for the rest.

            Keeps your necessary calorie load quite low too just as you pointed out.

            Yep, that's my two cents. Stickin' to it.
            "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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            • #51
              Originally posted by sbhikes View Post
              They are incomplete protein, which means you need to combine them with another vegetarian protein source to get a complete protein, and they are relatively lacking in protein so you must eat a lot more calories of beans than calories of meat to get the same amount of protein. This is why they are not that great of a protein source.

              A quick search shows that to equal the protein in 3 oz of chicken, you need:
              1 cup, plus 2.5 tablespoons of lentils.
              1-1/3 cups of black beans.
              1-1/2 cups (just a little less than this, actually) of chickpeas.

              And then you need some rice or corn or something else to provide the missing amino acids. That's more calories than 3oz of chicken.
              Oh great, I'm probably accidentally killing myself again. It's always bad news with you people :P

              Originally posted by MEversbergII View Post
              Oh hey Nellodee, I haven't seen you about a while. Did you end up adding meats into your diet, or are you still vegetarian? I'm with you on the bean-joy; I always enjoyed good red beans with my Hispanic foods. It's a must, which is interesting because they're not particularly flavorful on their own.

              Now I'm wondering as the pressure eases off legumes in the general sense if we'll start seeing soy introduced to "Paleo", in the general sense.

              M.
              Hey! Hope you're well

              Eating meat was never really an option here. Vegetarian 4 lyfe maybe. Or at least 4... the foreseeable future lol. Beans super great yes.
              Music of the day/week/month/whatever:

              K.A.A.N. - L.T.N. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWocmse1Ef4

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              • #52
                Originally posted by AMonkey View Post
                I think you are being a bit semantic. If you enjoy food then you've probably eaten bacon, pork belly and other cuts of meat that are damn tasty, but calorie dense. I also don't know why you keep calling legumes calorie dense.

                100g of cooked lentils has 116 kcal and 9g of protein.
                100g of skinless chicken breast has 150 kcal and 29g of protein.

                So chicken is more calorie dense, with more protein. Lentils have a better mineral profile, and vitamins are about the same. Lentils have fibre. If you ate the fattier cuts of chicken (with skin, thigh, wings) your calories would be even higher, with less protein and the same vitamins and minerals.

                On a calorie basis, legumes have more minerals and vitamins than muscle meat does.

                So they each have pros and cons, and each have a place in your diet. Saying chicken has more protein, ergo legumes are pointless, is short sighted. Legumes are cheap, tasty (can be) and reasonably nutritious. Primal/paleo doesn't boil down to eating the same 'optimal' foods every day, nor are protein requirements that hard to meet.
                Your comparison is not apt. You didn't add in the caloric load from the complementary grains that are necessary to make the beans/lentils a "complete" protein. Because yeah, food combining in the same meal isn't necessary, but if you don't get the complimentary source of aminos at some point, your muscle can't use the legumes to assist with muscle building. It needs ALL of the pieces eventually.

                That was, I think, SB's point about caloric load. She was considering the whole package necessary in a legume-heavy diet to achieve the complete protein profile man needs to build and maintain muscle.

                It's like all the people here saying "why should I have gelatin in my post workout sake? It's not a complete protein!" Well, no, but it will still build your muscles if you get a few of the missing pieces (basically minute amounts of tryptophan) from other dietary components within the same day as well.

                And also, if quibbling over 31 calories is a sticking point... You're worrying about calories TOO much. There is a limit.
                "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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                • #53
                  a little OT but from what I understand, this bit about humans needing esentially amino acids was actually from a study done on mice. I have yet to find one done on humans that proved there are essential amino acids for humans - does anyone have a link or can point me in the right direction?
                  I have eaten only one type of protein ie beans - other than the little I would get on veggies and fruit - and have thrived and put on muscle weight. Same eating just grains and veggies when I was younger.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Drumroll View Post
                    Your comparison is not apt. You didn't add in the caloric load from the complementary grains that are necessary to make the beans/lentils a "complete" protein.
                    We eat meat here. What need do we have for food combining? The amino acids from beans become part of your amino acid pool, and that's that. No big deal. I think the benefits of legumes outweigh the risks.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Timthetaco View Post
                      We eat meat here. What need do we have for food combining? The amino acids from beans become part of your amino acid pool, and that's that. No big deal. I think the benefits of legumes outweigh the risks.
                      Actually, not everybody here does eat meat in fact. I have met more than I expected to say the least with my understanding of what the Primal Blueprint is supposed to be.
                      "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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                      • #56
                        I assumed your statement applied to meat eaters as well. My bad.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Nourished View Post
                          Well not everybody here is trying to do high protein. My protein hovers around 20% of calories with the lion's share being from complex carbs so beans supplemented with a bit of meat are really a good match for me, personally.
                          3 oz of chicken in one day isn't high protein

                          Sent from my HTC_PN071 using Tapatalk

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by AMonkey View Post
                            I think you are being a bit semantic. If you enjoy food then you've probably eaten bacon, pork belly and other cuts of meat that are damn tasty, but calorie dense. I also don't know why you keep calling legumes calorie dense.

                            100g of cooked lentils has 116 kcal and 9g of protein.
                            100g of skinless chicken breast has 150 kcal and 29g of protein.

                            So chicken is more calorie dense, with more protein. Lentils have a better mineral profile, and vitamins are about the same. Lentils have fibre. If you ate the fattier cuts of chicken (with skin, thigh, wings) your calories would be even higher, with less protein and the same vitamins and minerals.

                            On a calorie basis, legumes have more minerals and vitamins than muscle meat does.

                            So they each have pros and cons, and each have a place in your diet. Saying chicken has more protein, ergo legumes are pointless, is short sighted. Legumes are cheap, tasty (can be) and reasonably nutritious. Primal/paleo doesn't boil down to eating the same 'optimal' foods every day, nor are protein requirements that hard to meet.
                            What's being said is that legumes aren't the best source of protein, not don't eat them they are worthless.

                            Sent from my HTC_PN071 using Tapatalk

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                            • #59
                              A day without meat is like a day without sunshine.

                              Beans are cool.......but not an everyday thing......

                              My problem with them is the starchy calorie load. Can't be a fat burner and a starch burner at the exact same time.

                              Better for carb loading times. Or when going low fat, high carb.

                              Just can't do both when your 55.
                              What have you done today to make you feel Proud?

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Timthetaco View Post
                                I assumed your statement applied to meat eaters as well. My bad.
                                Haha, I made the comment about gelatin and meat eaters to draw a comparison to what I was talking about with amino combining.

                                And even the people who do eat meat but not daily still run into the combining issue occasionally because on your "non-meat days" you'd still have to get the full spectrum aminos you need to maintain muscle. You can't, say, eat meat every OTHER day and think that gets you around needing to get the requisite aminos on the other days. Muscle maintenance and growth is a daily task.
                                "The cling and a clang is the metal in my head when I walk. I hear a sort of, this tinging noise - cling clang. The cling clang. So many things happen while walking. The metal in my head clangs and clings as I walk - freaks my balance out. So the natural thought is just clogged up. Totally clogged up. So we need to unplug these dams, and make the the natural flow... It sort of freaks me out. We need to unplug the dams. You cannot stop the natural flow of thought with a cling and a clang..."

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